Star Trek TV

[stokeriño]

On a side-note, I just read on wiki that the Maquis were created in DS9 entirely for the purpose of providing the upcoming Voyager series with a renegade group that would fit into the show's proposed premise.

And yet I daresay that DS9 has a better selection of truly Maquis-orientated episodes than Voyager ever did (Sisko v Eddington springs to mind). Even the couple TNG had (with Ensign Ro) weren't slouches.

Hah.

[Nick Adams]

It would have been nice to have "Star Trek as Firefly" for Voyager, but honestly, most of the column was off, as far as I was concerned. Janeway being more along the lines of Picard worked specifically because she wasn't a young, brash Starfleet captain. She was an experienced, mature scientist, which is why she got to captain Voyager in the first place. B'Elanna as Meg Griffin was the weirdest comparison ever. If "secondary characters" get major story arcs in repeated episodes, they obviously aren't secondary characters, no matter what rank they are. Somebody seems to have forgotten Wesley Crusher, Guinan, Nog, Quark, Rom, Odo, Jake Sisko, etc. As for Chakotay, if a man having a cultural history is racist, then nobody in Star Trek should have any history but, "I'm in Starfleet." And that invalidates the idea that the Maquis should have remained what they were instead of agreeing to rejoin Starfleet, because the Maquis were as much a cultural group as they were a rebel faction.

As for the Dorn/McDuffie story, that was all kinds of hilarious. I imagine a lot of people at the screening wanted to just choke Halle Berry at that point, because she was yelling during a movie.

[stokeriño]

Yeah that's why I referred to Chakotay being one-dimensional rather than specifically about his Native American portrayal. He really did just wander around being uninteresting for the majority of the time.

[Noah]

So from the articles I clicked on, after reading the article link on this page, JJ originally wanted a bigger universe complete with a new tv show but rights issues got in the way?

Also, can someone explain the beginnings of the mirror universe to me? From what I do know, it seems like advanced culture visits backwards culture and then backwards culture kills and steals the advanced culture's technology and then proceeds to conquer other worlds. Surely we still couldn't have conquered other advanced worlds though, because even with better tech we are surely still backwards compared to them?

[Mick]

Also, can someone explain the beginnings of the mirror universe to me? From what I do know, it seems like advanced culture visits backwards culture and then backwards culture kills and steals the advanced culture's technology and then proceeds to conquer other worlds. Surely we still couldn't have conquered other advanced worlds though, because even with better tech we are surely still backwards compared to them?

I'm not sure where the point of divergence was. Originally it was theorized that the mirror universe was the result of Khan winning the Eugenics War. I never quite bought that, since the characters in that universe are...mirrors...of themselves, I always imagined Khan would be someone more like Gandhi. Anyway, no mention of how it broke off is made, wisely, and the only real point we have comes from "In A Mirror Darkly", where Mirror Phlox says he looked up the literature of our universe, and while the famous authors were still there, the characters were weak "Except for Shakespeare", and even then it's not really expounded upon.

If you're referring to the start of In A Mirror Darkly, let's take the brief clip we have of First Contact. Remember what Cochrane said to Riker? He was all about money. Alien technology could fetch a pretty penny, especially in a post-World War III economy. Suddenly Cochrane has a new warp engine and whatever goodies the Vulcans had on board. They weren't expecting to be shot at. And remember, if Carbon Creek is to be believed, T'Pol's grandma got a wad of cash for selling velcro. What do you think the other shit on board would go for? Cochrane was probably scared shitless about the Borg (not that I blame him), decided to take what he could and get out, and with his reports probably being able to be confirmed by Lily, Earth rallied together, said "Fuck this shit" and decided to have a massive military build up, conquering whoever they came across. Then for whatever reason, they stopped for awhile.

See, the whole problem that's created is the massive fuck up from First Contact (the movie), which essentially creates an alternate reality from perspective of whoever made it back to 2373. Cochrane had information about the future (even if it's limited in the sense of a bizarre alien race), but the Borg now have information about the past. It's created an alternate reality based entirely on a predestination paradox. The Borg head to Earth (season 2, Q Who and Best of Both Worlds, Season 3). The Enterprise crew stops them. They try again (First Contact), they fuck up history (along with the ground crew of the Enterprise and Picard's interaction with Lily) by sending the message to the Borg in the Delta Quadrant. The Borg head to Earth. etc. How this plays out with the mirror universe, I don't know, following the confirmation of the existence of the Vulcans (and the Roswell incident...thank you Quark), the governments on Earth probably cracked the whip and decided to be as aggressive as possible when the inevitable battle against the Borg comes. Which the Klingons and Cardassians have to worry about now.

My advice: Just try not to think about it and enjoy yourself.

As for why Voyager sucked, it's simple. Janeway was never wrong, and if, God forbid, she was, the only person with the balls to call her on it (ironically someone lacking them) was The Doctor, who was simply told to shut the fuck up or he'd be deactivated. I maintain that if that ship came to a sudden stop, the entire crew would go up Janeway's ass.

Chakotay just couldn't cut the mustard. We've had, for XOs, at least up till Voyager, Spock, technically Decker, Riker, and Kira. Each had their own little thing to make them interesting. Spock was always Mr Stoic, Riker was fucking hardcore, and Kira was an extremely complex character that was getting fed up with the bullshit. Chakotay....did nothing. Wise spiritual type mentor? Sorry, that's taken by Tuvok with the meditation. Cheap (intended) laughs? Neelix. Snarkiness? Tom. Advice? Janeway or The Doctor. He wasn't interesting, and I can't blame Robert Beltran for trying to get fired. Still, considering the raise he got for that ploy, that's not a bad consolation prize.

[Lint]

He TRIED to get fired? I never heard that...

[Mick]

He demanded a raise when it was to renew his contract, thinking they woukd just kill off th character.

[stokeriño]

You know what another good episode was with the Maquis in it? The DS9 one where Tom Riker steals the Defiant. Admittedly it's fun mainly for reasons that have nothing to do with the Maquis, i.e.:

1) Sisko and Dukat trying to work together

2) Foreshadowing of what the hell the Obsidian Order is upto in the Orias system

3) zOMG it's Riker in DS9

But it did also involve Kira giving a "YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG" lecture on how to be a terrorist, which was pretty badass.

[Benji]

The Drumhead is such a good episode. For all it's content, both actual and potential, it could've madr a stupendous two-parter.

[KONGO]

Oh god yes. I think the Drumhead, the Data legal episode, and Darmok are my absolute favorite episodes of TNG. Whenever Picard gets a chance to engage on that level it's marvelous.

[Lint]

don't forget Inner Light..another fantastic Picard episode

[KONGO]

Is that the one where's captured on Cardassia? Classic.

[Lint]

No that was Chain of Command. Inner Light was the one where a probe transmits the memories of a dead civilization to Picard. When he learns to play the flute

[Mick]

Yeah, Inner Light = Flute.

Anyway, my favorite Picard episode is Tapestry. It's not so much because of Q's antics, but it's a pivotal moment in his history, which makes the rare TNG reference to a previous episode.

[KONGO]

Ah, I was not a huge fan of Picard fluting it up, but it was certainly not a bad episode.

[Lint]

Yeah, Inner Light = Flute.

Anyway, my favorite Picard episode is Tapestry. It's not so much because of Q's antics, but it's a pivotal moment in his history, which makes the rare TNG reference to a previous episode.

Is that the one where Q takes Picard "back in time" to avoid being stabbed in the Academy?

[Mick]

Yes.

[9 to 5]

So, I have been watching through DS9 again and near the end of the 3rd series. I have a few points to make.

Terry Farrell is a very beautiful woman.

Bashir really is a cock.

Kai Winn is really under-rated as a bad woman.

And do you think Sisko told Dax he fucked her good and hard in the Mirror Universe?

[stokeriño]

Bashir improves dramatically after the first few series, to be fair.

Winn, as I've said before, is a magnificent heel. So magnificent that I still want to punch her.

And do you think Sisko told Dax he fucked her good and hard in the Mirror Universe?

I would love to think he started the story with "Hey Dax, remember the time Curzon told me about him [doing something excessively lewd to some woman], and I found the idea repulsive? Well here's some irony for you..."

[Benji]

I've always wondered - what was with Kirk's green open shirt uniform that suddenly appears regularly during season two?