NFL 2019

[GhostMachine]

11 hours ago, Meacon say “Feliz Navidad” said:

Lovie Smith has turned Illinois into a bowl team, you fool.

Yes, but he sucks as an NFL coach. Has only 2 more wins than losses.

 

[Meacon Keaton]

You know who else had only two more wins than loses before going to coach in college? Pete Carroll.

You're being racist. Quit being racist. 

[JasonM]

10 hours ago, Meacon say “Feliz Navidad” said:

If there's a four way tie and all four suck like these four, maybe they should forfeit their automatic playoff spot to a team that deserves it. 

And that's how the Bengals make the Superbowl this year!

[gunnar hendershow]

You can't count Lovie's run in TB since he only had 2 seasons there while they were rebuilding, in Chicago he had a .563 winning percentage. You don't see bad coaches have that sustained level of success. He got to a Super Bowl with Rex Grossman and almost got to another with Jay Cutler.

He can just ride it out at Illinois though, he'll have them regularly making bowls and making money for the program. 

[DMN in the House]

Watching Zoomers cry about the NFL100 All Time Team is great. Like, yeah, Justin Tucker probably is better than Jan Stenerud, probably would have been fine kicking in the 60s, but to act like a first ballot hall of famer, which Stenerud is and Tucker most likely will not be, is some kind of joke is a really bad take.

[JasonM]

Honestly, Stenerud is first ballot because he modernized kicking and he more than deserves all he has.

But at the same time Tucker is the best kicker in nfl history from an efficiency standpoint, and if he keeps this up without a shocking dropoff, I don't see why he shouldn't be first ballot himself, other than kicking not being an offensive or defensive position.

Same for Vinatieri, imo.

Vin and Sten are bonafidr hall of famers, and Tucker might be one when it's all said and done.

Then again, I'm a biased ravens fan, and a mark for kickers and punters. So I am definitely full of shit.

[DMN in the House]

58 minutes ago, Jasonmufc said:

Honestly, Stenerud is first ballot because he modernized kicking and he more than deserves all he has.

But at the same time Tucker is the best kicker in nfl history from an efficiency standpoint, and if he keeps this up without a shocking dropoff, I don't see why he shouldn't be first ballot himself, other than kicking not being an offensive or defensive position.

Same for Vinatieri, imo.

Vin and Sten are bonafidr hall of famers, and Tucker might be one when it's all said and done.

Then again, I'm a biased ravens fan, and a mark for kickers and punters. So I am definitely full of shit.

Justin Tucker may very well be the best NFL kicker of all time, I'm not trying to dispute that in any way, Baltimore is as difficult a place to kick as their is in the modern NFL. I have no issue with him as a future HOFer, nor Vinatieri.

That said, they're entire careers are built upon the revolution that Stenerud (and Pete Gogolak) started. They're soccer style kickers because of him. That's the reason Stenerud was a first ballot HOFer, and Tucker will not be. Because Jan did things no one had done before, and Tucker is 'simply' the most accurate kicker of all-time.

On an all-time list, I'd probably have Stenerud and George Blanda ahead of Tucker, but it really has nothing to do with how good a kicker they are.

At least Tucker has to kick outside, don't even get me started on the Morten Anderson fanboys.

[JasonM]

8 hours ago, DMN said:

Justin Tucker may very well be the best NFL kicker of all time, I'm not trying to dispute that in any way, Baltimore is as difficult a place to kick as their is in the modern NFL. I have no issue with him as a future HOFer, nor Vinatieri.

That said, they're entire careers are built upon the revolution that Stenerud (and Pete Gogolak) started. They're soccer style kickers because of him. That's the reason Stenerud was a first ballot HOFer, and Tucker will not be. Because Jan did things no one had done before, and Tucker is 'simply' the most accurate kicker of all-time.

On an all-time list, I'd probably have Stenerud and George Blanda ahead of Tucker, but it really has nothing to do with how good a kicker they are.

At least Tucker has to kick outside, don't even get me started on the Morten Anderson fanboys.

I mean I totally get what you're trying to say, and i'm at this point only making argument for the sake of philosophizing about football.

But to say that after Blanda and Stenerud the kicking game never progressed is a bit of a weird place to draw the line in the sand talking about any kicker that followed not being first ballot worthy. Because the game evolved more than just the way the ball is kicked, Stenerud created the optimal way to kick, but if draining 90% of your shots on the field wasn't unique then everyone'd be yeeting 40 yarders through the uprights with absurd efficiency.

I feel the insane level of power and accuracy on display right now is ample qualification to put someone on the first ballot. Because again, it's a unique achievement. We've reached a point where teams are drafting kickers out of College because teams are seeing that having an elite kicker that can convert 80% of his attempts is still a more efficient scorer than a normal drive (2.04ppd in 2018). It's basically like in the NBA where teams decided that you're either going to score close to the basket, or chuck it from the three point line because those are the only statistically efficient ways to score.

But I will concede your point, because the NFL balloting leads to a shitload less First ballots than any other major sport, although on pure achievement taken in a vacuum, there's no reason why a guy like Tucker couldn't be seen on the same level as Stenerud, in doing things in his time that are timeless.

By the same token really, you could ultimately say that no other speedy Running Back deserves to be a first ballot guy, because Barry Sanders revolutionized it, and there's practically nobody that has done it better than Barry Sanders ever since. But that won't stop people from sending in AP when he hangs them up.

Edited December 8, 2019 by Jasonmufc

[DMN in the House]

6 hours ago, Jasonmufc said:

I mean I totally get what you're trying to say, and i'm at this point only making argument for the sake of philosophizing about football.

But to say that after Blanda and Stenerud the kicking game never progressed is a bit of a weird place to draw the line in the sand talking about any kicker that followed not being first ballot worthy. Because the game evolved more than just the way the ball is kicked, Stenerud created the optimal way to kick, but if draining 90% of your shots on the field wasn't unique then everyone'd be yeeting 40 yarders through the uprights with absurd efficiency.

I feel the insane level of power and accuracy on display right now is ample qualification to put someone on the first ballot. Because again, it's a unique achievement. We've reached a point where teams are drafting kickers out of College because teams are seeing that having an elite kicker that can convert 80% of his attempts is still a more efficient scorer than a normal drive (2.04ppd in 2018). It's basically like in the NBA where teams decided that you're either going to score close to the basket, or chuck it from the three point line because those are the only statistically efficient ways to score.

But I will concede your point, because the NFL balloting leads to a shitload less First ballots than any other major sport, although on pure achievement taken in a vacuum, there's no reason why a guy like Tucker couldn't be seen on the same level as Stenerud, in doing things in his time that are timeless.

By the same token really, you could ultimately say that no other speedy Running Back deserves to be a first ballot guy, because Barry Sanders revolutionized it, and there's practically nobody that has done it better than Barry Sanders ever since. But that won't stop people from sending in AP when he hangs them up.

I love philosophizing about football, so we're all good!

I really don't disagree with you, and, at any other position on the field (besides punter), I think you'd be right, I just don't foresee the committee electing a kicker on the first ballot because of how good a kicker they are. It took forever for Ray Guy to get in, and he was at least as good a punter as Tucker is as a kicker. It's the position he plays, not an indictment of Tucker's ability.

[GhostMachine]

There are only 4 kickers in the Hall, and of those two played other positions as well. Ray Guy is the only punter in, and he played in the 70's and 80's.

NO WAY a kicker goes in first ballot, unless somehow its a lean year. Which won't be happening any time soon.

 

 

[gunnar hendershow]

They have such a backlog at other positions that it's challenging to see a kicker getting in first ballot unless he makes like every kick ever.

[Maxx]

So the 49ers look really average against the leagues better teams, not sure I would trust them in the playoffs

[Lint]

Chiefs gear mistakenly sent to New Jersey, sources say

[Lowerdeck]

On 02/12/2019 at 05:14, Lineklaus said:

Holy crap we beat New England?

 

Congrats on your Week 13 Super Bowl.   I see you're losing 31-3 to Denver.

[Maxx]

Ya’ll ever heard of Meacon’s favorite player, Drew Lock?

[The Buscher]

Saints have had some very blatant, legit penalties called against them but after last year their fans go ballistic over every call.  Everything is a screwjob against them

It’s making me want to root against New Orleans by default.

[FLiam]

Oof. This Saints/49ers game has been excellent.

[Pooker]

What a game. We needed this win after dropping to the Ravens last week. George Kittle is amazing.

[lanky316]

Thought that two point conversion attempt would bite them in the arse in the end. Then thought they'd scored too soon. A lot of issues with the Saints in that one.

[DMN in the House]

Well, this season was fun while it lasted.