***spoilers*** UFC News and Discussion Thread

[Thrilla]

Meh, its all hype for when Nelson delivers the goods at the Finale and destroys Schaub in highlight reel fashion.

(Y)

[Asuka's Gonna Kill You]

Good God was that an excruciating show to watch.

Started off okay up to and including the Bocek fight.

Then we got Kimbo/Houston, and it went exactly how everyone should have expected it to go. No legitimate MMA fighter is going to want the embarrassment of a loss to Kimbo, so they're going to exploit his biggest weakness - no real ground game. Problem with that here is that Houston had even less of a ground game, so all he could do was take advantage of Kimbo's unwillingness to press the action by throwing a ton of low kicks. Of course it was going to be a boring fight - Kimbo's only an exciting fighter when he's in with people who are willing to make themselves look like complete dumbasses.

Oh and the judge who scored it 30-27 was clearly bullshit. Round 2 was Kimbo's and I'll admit that I can see giving him round 3, but did he even land one shot in round 1? Octagon control isn't enough when the other guy's the aggressor AND the better striker.

Then we got Bones/Hamill, which was an excellent demolition by one of my favourite fighters turned into a bullshit decision. I'll admit that Mazzagatti made the right call within the framework of the rules, but it's stupid to have those elbows banned (at least if you believe Joe Rogan's explanation), and it had better be turned into a NC because there's no way you can argue that Hamill deserves a win. I think the NC is fair too because Jones wouldn't have thrown those elbows if he knew they were illegal and originally Mazzagatti was just going to deduct a point - had the fight gone on, Jones would've adjusted his ground-and-pound and still won easily.

Then we find out that Chuck Liddell is coming out of retirement because Dana ultimately cares more about making money than his friend's well-being or legacy. It's going to be really sad to see Chuck lose to Tito.

I actually enjoyed the main event enough, but because Nelson gets the X-Pac heat, it was by far the worst outcome UFC could have hoped for. I like the guy, but most people don't (and not in a good way like with Tito).

Hopefully things pick up for UFC soon, because I'm not going to stick around if it gets much worse.

That makes no sense what so ever. I've actually not seen a single person say it'd go the distance. Everybody thought it'd be over in round one :/

Despite Big Bore winning and Big Baby losing, all was made up for with the Kimbo win. I'm really interested to see where they go with him from here and who he faces next. Kongo/Kimbo if Mir beats Kongo?

[Thrilla]

If they're clever Kimbo will go up against Mitirone as he is the only one in the heavyweight division he has a chance of beating.

[Plubby]

I hope Kimbo slams you like he did to Alexander.

[Thrilla]

Mostapha Al Turk

Paul Buentello

Shane Carwin

Mirko Cro Cop

Junior Dos Santos

Todd Duffee

Rolles Gracie

Gabriel Gonzaga

Antoni Hardonk

Heath Herring

Cheick Kongo

Brock Lesnar

Frank Mir

Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira

Ben Rothwell

Stefan Struve

Cain Velasquez

Gilbert Yvel

Barring the people from the latest season of The Ultimate Fighter that is the Heavyweight division. The only person on there I can see Kimbo have a definite chance of beating is Mostapha Al Turk, even Struve who is the penultimate guy in the pecking order would walk through Kimbo with his massive reach and ever improving ground game.

[Guest Mr. Grinch]

I don't know who keeps marking NBT down because he's exactly right. Houston was basically Kimbo-lite - a smaller, less powerful version of Kimbo. Unless Phil Baroni wants to suddenly put on a lot of weight, Mitrione's the only person at either 205 or HW I give Kimbo even close to a 50/50 chance against.

I just pray they never put him against Chuck or Randy. Or even Tito.

[IzzyX]

I hope Kimbo slams you like he did to Alexander.

({)

I LOVED THAT BACKDROP DRIVER!

[Thrilla]

I don't know who keeps marking NBT down because he's exactly right. Houston was basically Kimbo-lite - a smaller, less powerful version of Kimbo. Unless Phil Baroni wants to suddenly put on a lot of weight, Mitrione's the only person at either 205 or HW I give Kimbo even close to a 50/50 chance against.

I just pray they never put him against Chuck or Randy. Or even Tito.

Kimbo might have a chance against Elvis Sinosic if he sticks around after the Australia show.

And I think Kimbo/Chuck could be on the cards for late 2010, regardless of how either guy does in their next bout it would still draw big numbers as they are two of the biggest names in the industry right now and both are known for being able to just throw down.

[Guest Mr. Grinch]

Yeah but washed-up Chuck getting knocked out by Kimbo is pretty much UFC shitting on the tiny bit of legacy this sport has in the name of profits. I'd expect it in Japan, but really really hope it doesn't happen here.

[Thrilla]

If Chuck is determined to fight again, Dana is better off putting him against people his is stylistically better than like Tito and guys with little experience like Kimbo than one of the rising stars of MMA that'll beat him down in a quick, embarrassing and dangerous fashion.

[Plubby]

WAR FLORIAN~!

That's all >_>

[Fitzy]

Kenny Florian looked great out there. Perhaps Florian vs. Frankie Edgar for a title shot?

Frank Mir making quick work of Cheick Kongo was wonderful.

And Penn outclassed Sanchez badly. Absolutely sick cut from that kick to the head to finish it off.

DaMarques Johnson vs. Edgar Garcia was a short, but entertaining fight. Johnson surviving the Peruvian Necktie only to finish Garcia off with a triangle choke was great.

[Guest Mr. Grinch]

I do like the idea of Florian vs. Edgar, yeah. Penn's way too dominant though.

[Rich]

I found the event was all about answering questions and we did get some emphatic answers:

Is there a man in the 155 division that can match up to BJ Penn?... No, Diego tried but just didn't match up, and you can't say he sucks, Sanchez is fan-dabi-dozi, just not fan-dabi-dozi enough.

Is Frank Mir the best we have ever seen him?... I could say, with confidence, from what little we saw, yes. he sounds focused, his strategy of faking the shoot and hitting with the overhand left was on the button and his choke was strong and deep, putting Kongo to sleep. Mir also looked huge and lean at the same time, I think he could be heading back for that rubber match with Lesnar if Brock recovers.

Is Alan Belcher a little nutty?... Yes

Does KenFlo have a future still at the top of 155?... Yes, I thought he looked awesome, his technique was improved and despite the fact he choked out one of my favourite fighters (I me some Clay Guida). KenFlo just looked so, so focused, I was very impressed.

Does Stefan Struve have a future in the UFC?... Yes, while I doubt he will fly up the rankings like a Cain Velasquez, he looks solid and improves so much every fight that a slow build could lead him towards the top of the division.

The only BIG conundrum I can see coming out of this event is Jon Fitch. The guy got a hard fought, slow, mechanical and frankly unispiring victory and where does he now fit. I doubt too many people want to see the GSP rematch, but Fitch is now 12-1 in the UFC (his only loss to GSP) and if you were to use him in the "Gatekeeper" role you risk derailing your budding stars and challengers for GSP when there aren't that many to begin with. You also can't cut the guy for being too good surely? I mean I wouldn't have wanted Hardy to face Fitch prior to facing GSP, if Hardy wins he would no doubt be considered the no.1 contender for the title as Fitch is always up there, but if Hardy lost we would have looked like an also ran. Seriously, where can Fitch go next? Yeah there is a ready made fight with Koscheck there, but if Koscheck beats Thiago you have to believe that he will be next inline for a welterwieght title shot against either Hardy or GSP... Jon Fitch, between a rock and a hard place

[Guest Mr. Grinch]

Thing about Mir was that we still have no idea if his weight training means he hits hard but blows up fast. (Which I suspect is the case, and Lesnar or even Couture would be able to last to that point whilst Kongo couldn't.)

Fitch is in the same spot Florian was in before this fight...he's basically the #2 guy and he's already lost to the #1. Put him against Hardy after Hardy loses to GSP maybe. Swick's another possibility. Hazelett even, much as I'd hate that and Bryan Alvarez wouldn't be able to tell them apart. Basically the guys who are pretty good, but not good enough to ever be a threat to GSP - anybody who has a bit of mystique around them should be kept far away from Fitch.

[Rich]

Thing about Mir was that we still have no idea if his weight training means he hits hard but blows up fast. (Which I suspect is the case, and Lesnar or even Couture would be able to last to that point whilst Kongo couldn't.)

Agreed, but the next step for Mir would have to be against a Velaquez or a Junior Dos Santos in the future then, particulary Velasquez with his power+wrestling...

I mean he's better than a Herring, and i don't want to see a rematch with Nogueria yet, so Velaquez, maybe Gonzaga could be next.

[Fitzy]

Thing about Mir was that we still have no idea if his weight training means he hits hard but blows up fast. (Which I suspect is the case, and Lesnar or even Couture would be able to last to that point whilst Kongo couldn't.)

Fitch is in the same spot Florian was in before this fight...he's basically the #2 guy and he's already lost to the #1. Put him against Hardy after Hardy loses to GSP maybe. Swick's another possibility. Hazelett even, much as I'd hate that and Bryan Alvarez wouldn't be able to tell them apart. Basically the guys who are pretty good, but not good enough to ever be a threat to GSP - anybody who has a bit of mystique around them should be kept far away from Fitch.

Well Swick for sure is not a possibility, Both AKA fighters who won't fight.

[Guest Mr. Grinch]

I'd like to see Mir/Dos Santos. I think that would be a great (!) fight.

[Gene Kiniski]

On what Fitzy said, Kos is also AKA so that adds another dimension to that division. You have three of the highest ranked fighters in that division in the same, extremely loyal, camp.

[Fitzy]

Good WEC, as usual. Jorgensen and Mizugaki put on a good, entertaining fight. Njokunani hitting Horodecki with an awesome kick to the face as he was running away (honestly, who does this in a fight? dumb move on Horodecki's part there) was awesome. And good main event between Cerrone and Ratcliff. Cerrone finishing off Ratcliff after being behind due to low blow point deductions was fan-dabi-dozi to see.

And on the Strikefore side of the night, Scott Smith coming back after being down two rounds and looking to go to a decision loss, comes back in fan-dabi-dozi fashion and is the first man to knock out Cung Le. Awesome. And Gilbert Melendez and Josh Thomson put on the best match of the night. Can't wait for the third fight between these two now. And with the year coming to an end, it is certainly one to put into consideration for fight of the year (I like how in Meltzer's recap of the show he puts it ahead of Cerrone/Henderson and Couture/Nog and up there with Sanchez/Guida for a fight of the year, but in his own awards, this isn't in contention with those due to taking place in December, shouldn't he know this? ) Souza looked good finishing off Lindland, and King MO had a good debut in Strikeforce, knocking out Whitehead, but he really should not be fighting in heavyweight, too small.