Euro 2020(1)

[Pogue Mahone]

6 minutes ago, Colly said:

I really think people are making a lot of this. Derby game, poor performance, but 4 points is fine from two games. We'll play better than that going forward.

Who against? Not particularly good against a poor Croatia side. Poor against a low ranking Scottish side. I wouldn't be surprised if the Czech Republic grab a win in this next game.

France/Italy would have torn England to pieces tonight, and I think part of that is to do with selections like Tyrone Mings, Kalvin Phillips, Reece James, Declan Rice and Mason Mount. They're good players but they're not top international standard - not yet anyway.

[FestiveJack]

France needed an own goal to beat the worst Germany side since 2004 - not sure they'd tear England apart considering in attack their tactics are "oh you're all great players just do something". Only so long that works.

Convinced Italy are winning the whole thing though.

[Colly]

 

7 minutes ago, Pogue Mahone said:

Who against? Not particularly good against a poor Croatia side. Poor against a low ranking Scottish side. I wouldn't be surprised if the Czech Republic grab a win in this next game.

France/Italy would have torn England to pieces tonight, and I think part of that is to do with selections like Tyrone Mings, Kalvin Phillips, Reece James, Declan Rice and Mason Mount. They're good players but they're not top international standard - not yet anyway.

Of course they would, but we're still in the groups. Belgium looked shaky the other night, France only beat a fairly average Germany side with an own goal. Plenty of sides grow into tournaments and opening like Italy have is pretty rare. The important thing is to get through.

If the players aren't good enough the players aren't good enough, but there's more quality than we've seen so far. Knocking young players as "not good enough" feels very pre-emptive, especially Mings after two clean sheets. Southgate's got work to do, but I'd be very surprised if we don't beat the Czechs.

[Adam]

19 minutes ago, Colly said:

I really think people are making a lot of this. Derby game, poor performance, but 4 points is fine from two games. We'll play better than that going forward.

If we want to be winning this tournament - which apparently we are aiming for - we cannot labour to a draw against one of the lowest ranked teams in the tournament. Scotland were strong and resolute but nothing special, we had players who can unlock their defence but some (Kane, Sterling, Mount) didn't play well enough and some (Sancho, Grealish, DCL) weren't even given a chance, or only a little bit of a chance.

We'll not do anything against the top nations if we are rigidly committed to this conservative, slow style.

[The Kraig]

Frankly, England can use this game to learn and fix their problems, and can still win this.

I've avoided watching the game despite being at work, because I can't focus. Sounds like a weak game overall that both teams can improve from analysing.

This group is wide open now. England could always just be pricks and hack Schick out the game.

[Colly]

2 minutes ago, Adam said:

If we want to be winning this tournament - which apparently we are aiming for - we cannot labour to a draw against one of the lowest ranked teams in the tournament. Scotland were strong and resolute but nothing special, we had players who can unlock their defence but some (Kane, Sterling, Mount) didn't play well enough and some (Sancho, Grealish, DCL) weren't even given a chance, or only a little bit of a chance.

We'll not do anything against the top nations if we are rigidly committed to this conservative, slow style.

Portugal won the last one having failed to win a single group game. It was a poor performance of course, but you don't win international tournaments in the second group game. Things have to change for a game that means something, but I don't think a panicked change of shape was needed to try to nick it. 

[Kaney]

8 minutes ago, MadJack said:

France needed an own goal to beat the worst Germany side since 2004 - not sure they'd tear England apart considering in attack their tactics are "oh you're all great players just do something". Only so long that works.

Hasn't that been England's tactics since the so-called Golden Generation?

[Colly]

England just scored.

 

[Dang117]

Something that's bothered me in the first two games that Kane doesn't seem fully fit

[Lineker]

Tournaments are so much more enjoyable when England aren't there.

[Gazz]

Just now, Lineker said:

Tournaments are so much more enjoyable when England aren't there.

We're getting a special invitation to the next Copa America.

[Rich]

1 hour ago, MadJack said:

What does Harry Kane offer England? I'm really starting to wonder.

34 goals in 56 games

[FLiam]

1 hour ago, Rich said:

34 goals in 56 games

Obviously he's scored plenty but again you have to look at who he has scored them against. Nations you'd expect. 

[The Kraig]

31 minutes ago, FLiam said:

Obviously he's scored plenty but again you have to look at who he has scored them against. Nations you'd expect. 

But people expected 4-0 or 5-0 against Scotland? A team lower than their usual opponents in the nations ladder league.

[Owen]

Honestly, before I sat down to watch I was absolutely expecting England to beat Scotland by at least 3 goals.

[Jimmy]

9 hours ago, Dang117 said:

Something that's bothered me in the first two games that Kane doesn't seem fully fit

Yeah, this looks suspiciously like Kane playing through an injury to me. 

That said, we're also not playing to his strengths at all. He's best with a runner in behind and Sterling likes to play wide more than directly running in behind, like Son does. We've got no one playing on the shoulder to drag players away from Kane to open up space for him.

In this 4-3-3, with Southgate seemingly unwilling to unleash the fullbacks, I think we're not getting any other players close enough to Kane. There's so few overloads on the sides, and we only occasionally look like doing something when someone like Phillips breaks from the holding role and gives an option / extra man going forward.  

7 hours ago, FLiam said:

Obviously he's scored plenty but again you have to look at who he has scored them against. Nations you'd expect. 

I mean, then look at the assists he laid on when we beat Spain. He's not having a good tournament whatsoever, but the "what does Kane offer" England is such an English way of thinking about a striker who literally just finished the season with the most goals and most assists in the league. 

[FestiveJack]

9 hours ago, Rich said:

34 goals in 56 games

6 touches in the box in 150 minutes this tournament - not sure he's adding to that tally.

[Jimmy]

25 minutes ago, MadJack said:

6 touches in the box in 150 minutes this tournament - not sure he's adding to that tally.

Wouldn't you say that's also a systematic problem? 

[GA!]

I love that Sam Matteryourface hyped England vs Scotland as the event of the summer, while everyone outside the UK probably saw the game as an even worse Sweden vs Slovakia. 

[FestiveJack]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

Wouldn't you say that's also a systematic problem? 

Absolutely, but it's easier to change a cog in a system than it is to rebuild the entire system around one very shiny cog.