Metallica

[Benji]

Doesn't make them legends?

Being in the top 10 of records sold OVERALL in ANY genre doesn't make them legends?

Making the album many claim to be the best metal album EVER doesn't make them legends?

Inspiring practically ever single hard rock/heavy metal band in the 90's and 2000's doesn't make them legends?

What does then? Rapping and screaming about how the government sucks and how oppressed you are when in fact you are anything but?

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I'd agree, that makes them legends, that USED to make them legends, they are like Ric Flair, great in their heyday, but they need to step back before embarassing themselves more, the recent stuff, I hope you agree, has been terrible.

When did I claim RATM were legends? I love the band but this is about Metallica, not Rage, try and get a grip

[StevenRichardsRules]

I really don't enjoy Metallica. Others may but I find their music overrated and boring. But it's probably because I dislike almost all classic rock...

[tristy]

Overrated, and I'll duck out of here before the godz pens his second novel.

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[Evil Chase K]

Doesn't make them legends?

Being in the top 10 of records sold OVERALL in ANY genre doesn't make them legends?

Making the album many claim to be the best metal album EVER doesn't make them legends?

Inspiring practically ever single hard rock/heavy metal band in the 90's and 2000's doesn't make them legends?

What does then? Rapping and screaming about how the government sucks and how oppressed you are when in fact you are anything but?

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I'd agree, that makes them legends, that USED to make them legends, they are like Ric Flair, great in their heyday, but they need to step back before embarassing themselves more, the recent stuff, I hope you agree, has been terrible.

When did I claim RATM were legends? I love the band but this is about Metallica, not Rage, try and get a grip

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[Hobo]

I really don't enjoy Metallica. Others may but I find their music overrated and boring.  But it's probably because I dislike almost all classic rock...

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I wouldn't classify Metallica as classic rock, not personally. I think that's more bands like The Who.

[Guest Ringmaster]

To me, they're overrated. They have a few songs that are good, other than that I don't see the obsession. Even live, they were kinda meh compared to something like Slayer. And it doesn't help that they have really annoying fanboys (I don't think there are any here) that pretty much scream at any move they do and cause the radio to play them until my ears bleed.

[Guest Bluesman]

Doesn't make them legends?

Being in the top 10 of records sold OVERALL in ANY genre doesn't make them legends?

Making the album many claim to be the best metal album EVER doesn't make them legends?

Inspiring practically ever single hard rock/heavy metal band in the 90's and 2000's doesn't make them legends?

What does then? Rapping and screaming about how the government sucks and how oppressed you are when in fact you are anything but?

[Evil Chase K]

Doesn't make them legends?

Being in the top 10 of records sold OVERALL in ANY genre doesn't make them legends?

Making the album many claim to be the best metal album EVER doesn't make them legends?

Inspiring practically ever single hard rock/heavy metal band in the 90's and 2000's doesn't make them legends?

What does then? Rapping and screaming about how the government sucks and how oppressed you are when in fact you are anything but?

1. Kenny G is one of all time selling 'jazz' artists of all time, outselling (IIRC) Sonny Rollins, John Coltrane, and Charlie Parker (?) combined. Are you going to call him a legend?

2. "Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs" by Derek and the Dominos is often hailed as the best blues-rock album of all time. Are they legends?

3. What was Metallica doing during this time? If you answered "taking piles of shit and selling it as CD's", you'd be correct. (aside from the Black album, which I think may have been early 90's).

The ability to do something well over along period of time would be a nice start. The fact that they come out with St. Anger, in effect following instead of leading, shows how seriously limited they really are.

Let's look at Guns N Roses. They come close to, or do meet, almost all of your legend requirements. Are you going to argue that Guns N Roses are legends?

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[Darloboy]

Doesn't make them legends?

Being in the top 10 of records sold OVERALL in ANY genre doesn't make them legends?

Making the album many claim to be the best metal album EVER doesn't make them legends?

Inspiring practically ever single hard rock/heavy metal band in the 90's and 2000's doesn't make them legends?

What does then? Rapping and screaming about how the government sucks and how oppressed you are when in fact you are anything but?

1. Kenny G is one of all time selling 'jazz' artists of all time, outselling (IIRC) Sonny Rollins, John Coltrane, and Charlie Parker (?) combined. Are you going to call him a legend?

2. "Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs" by Derek and the Dominos is often hailed as the best blues-rock album of all time. Are they legends?

3. What was Metallica doing during this time? If you answered "taking piles of shit and selling it as CD's", you'd be correct. (aside from the Black album, which I think may have been early 90's).

The ability to do something well over along period of time would be a nice start. The fact that they come out with St. Anger, in effect following instead of leading, shows how seriously limited they really are.

Let's look at Guns N Roses. They come close to, or do meet, almost all of your legend requirements. Are you going to argue that Guns N Roses are legends?

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[Skummy]

1. Kenny G plays a commercial style of music. Metallica doesn't.

Metallica don't play commerical music? Then why does every big music shop I go in to sell Metallica CDs, Metallica T-shirts, Metallica hoodies, Metallica dog-tags, Metallica posters, hell, even Metallica action figures? That sounds like commercialism to me.

You can argue all you want that Metallica are "alternative" or whatever, but the fact of the matter is that they're just as, probably more, commercial than Kenny G.

3. Influence is influence. You don't have to constantly be active to be good. Taking breaks doesn't mean you're not "talented" the extensive touring takes it's toll. Blues and jazz artists don't have anywhere near the rough touring schedule that heavy metal bands take.

"Taking breaks" is one thing, releasing bad albums is quite another. If you're going to take a break, you take a holiday and spend some time on the beach or at home with the kids or whatever. Recording a sub-standard album for your fans to lap up, knowing that you've, as Kirk Hammet once so eloquently put it, "Lost your balls", is near on exploitation. Whether or not metal bands tour as much as blues or jazz bands or whatever is inconsequential.

What they did on St. Anger was what they felt like doing. They didn't take out solos because they wanted to be trendy. They did it because they changed their style of writing and felt that solos didn't fit in the songs. I would say that the songs are too riff heavy and heavily copy and pasted, but to me that doesn't make the album bad or mean they were following trends.

Oh sorry, I didn't realise you could read Lars Ulrich's mind. How do you know why they did what they did on St. Anger?

And as for GN'R, why couldn't they be considered legends? Do I personally think they are? I don't know. I'd have to think about it. Apetite For Destruction is a classic album and GNR has influenced a ton of bands, but I only really like Lies.

I'd argue that G'n'R are legends, and I'd probably say that Metallica are too, it just depends how far you can stretch your definition of the word.

[Evil Chase K]

1. Kenny G plays a commercial style of music. Metallica doesn't.

Metallica don't play commerical music? Then why does every big music shop I go in to sell Metallica CDs, Metallica T-shirts, Metallica hoodies, Metallica dog-tags, Metallica posters, hell, even Metallica action figures? That sounds like commercialism to me.

You can argue all you want that Metallica are "alternative" or whatever, but the fact of the matter is that they're just as, probably more, commercial than Kenny G.

3. Influence is influence. You don't have to constantly be active to be good. Taking breaks doesn't mean you're not "talented" the extensive touring takes it's toll. Blues and jazz artists don't have anywhere near the rough touring schedule that heavy metal bands take.

[tristy]

but when you think of heavy metal and heavy metal legends, you (well at least metal fans) think of bands like Metallica, Slayer, Judas Priest, and Iron Maiden.

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[Evil Chase K]

Who do you think of then? I'm interested in who you consider to be metal legends, the bands that exemplify the genre.

[Guest Bluesman]

1. Kenny G plays a commercial style of music. Metallica doesn't.

[tristy]

Who do you think of then? I'm interested in who you consider to be metal legends, the bands that exemplify the genre.

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[Evil Chase K]

1. Kenny G plays a commercial style of music. Metallica doesn't.

Are you willing to discount every 'pop' act, since they play a commercial style of music?

2. Sure.

[Evil Chase K]

Who do you think of then? I'm interested in who you consider to be metal legends, the bands that exemplify the genre.

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I guess I'm just a different breed of "heavy metal" fan than you are. You're most likely older than me, and probably grew up in the 80s or something, where as I didn't. I grew up in the Grunge boom, but never liked it.

As for the bands you listed, I only really like Slayer. Priest & Maiden aren't really my thing. I've tried to listen to them, since my dad likes them, but I just can't get into it. I hate the vocals and lyrics, and I don't really like the music that much either.

As for Metallica, I basically grew up on The Black Album, and that's probably the only Metallica CD I like, believe it or not. I'm the exact opposite from alot of people. I don't like their older stuff, but I can tolerate Load & Reload. I really, really hated Saint Anger, though.

I won't go listing bands that I like that could be considered Heavy Metal/Metal, since I hate when I mention a band I like that I think they're a certain genre, and someone says "X band aren't Y type of music, idiot!" or something, you know?

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[TOG]

Metallica ARE legends. Any band who reaches the level of popularity they have, and maintains it for the length of time they have, are legends. However, that does not mean that I find their music to be great by any means. I consider Ozzy Osbourne a legend, and I despise his music.

Guns N Roses are also legends.

When I think of heavy metal legends, I have never, and never will, think of Judas fucking Priest.

Back to Metallica, I like a lot of Metallica, but this is probably equal to the amount that I dislike. Couple that with the fact that I don't like Hetfield or Lars, and I don't consider myself a fan. Kirk is one of my favorite guitarists, but I still prefer Mustaine or Kerry King.

I have no reason to form opinions for or against Trujilo, since I know very little of him.

I despised everything about St. Anger, and unlike most I do not support the arguement of "You just don't like it because it's different." You fucking idiot. Of course i'm not going to like it because it's different from the what I did like. If it were the same, why the fuck would I hate it? They changed their sound, it sucked. Period.

Much of this isn't only aimed at board members, but the Metallica fans who hassle me for not liking them in general. As for "hating Metallica because it's cool", no. Metallica fans come in masses, and I have ALWAYS been outnumbered in the Metallica debates. People who hate Metallica hate them because they do not enjoy their music. Just as you like them because you do enjoy their music. It doesn't go any deeper than that.

Slayer > Metallica

[DMN in the House]

Black Album and before, Metallica was the shit, though not as good as Slayer has consistently been. Post Black Album, minus a few songs here and there, and S&M, which is basically a greatest hits, they've been lackluster, to say the least.

Their legends in their genre, but never really did anything that no one else was doing. A great thrash band, but never the best at any one time (Slayer, in my opinion, is the greatest thrast/metal band of all time), and their recent personality quirks has really turned me off of them.

I like them better then Iron Maiden, who I detest, and on about the same level as Judas Priest, but any comparison of James Hetfield to Rob Halford will be met with swift, swift retribution.

All in all, really fucking great in the beginning, and really fucking shitty now.

[tristy]

and S&M, which is basically a greatest hits, they've been lackluster, to say the least.

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