EliteXC on CBS Live Thread

[Krone]

That's like saying Rashad got lucky with his knockout, Gonzaga got lucky with his high kick on Cro Cop, Serra got lucky by TKO'ing St. Pierre. The list of "luck" goes on and on, but at some point, there is a difference between skill and luck. Luck is when something happens like Tito going to punch Ken and he slips, falling into the punch. Skill is KO'ing or submitting a fighter without any outside interference, which there was none of in the Rashad KO, Gonzaga KO, Serra TKO, or Seth TKO.

[gunnar hendershow]

The bar I was at went NUTS when Kimbo got destroyed tonight. Nuts, I tell ye. I heard some guy go "Take that youtube cunt" which amused my friends and I. I'm not familiar with MMA, but is dislike for Kimbo Slice universal? It was in Philly at least.

[CQI13]

No, not universal. Dan Lebaretard basically gives him verbal blow jobs on his radio show in Miami. God, I can't wait until Monday's show. Wonder what excuses they'll come up with. They were mocking James Thompson leading up to the fight (since he'd lost to Butterbean in a minute and a half). I was cackling like a little girl on the inside during that TKO.

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

Kimbo's first MMA match was last November, so he's been doing this for about a year. There's a point when inexperience isn't an excuse.

[HailtotheYo]

That's crap and you know it because had someone been "training" for a year and had only what ? four fights ? and this happened everyone would say that well ... it's only his fourth fight. He's still got a few things to figure out etc.

Only because it's Kimbo are you saying that. FACT.

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

Not really. If Lesnar makes a dumb mistake against Couture, I wouldn't use "it's only his fourth fight" as an excuse.

[KCC]

Just saw this, and thought I'd share it with you all:

[Fitzy]

Yeah that's what I was talking about yesterday. He wouldn't be complaining if it was Kimbo hitting the back of the head.

[Ananas]

I just want to raise one point about this Kimbo thing. As much as so many of us seem convinced he's done, can we really say that without a real understanding of the "MMA on CBS" audience? I don't know how many experiences you folks have had with these fans (the CBS ones not the MMA establishment ones), but my experiences have led me to believe they're the ultimate "mark" audience. Perhaps it's because they just don't have much in the way of experience with any outside MMA, but I remember the day after the first CBS show going into work and having to explain to a bunch of people that Kimbo Slice is not in fact the best fighter in the world. If they were willing to believe that, if they have so little MMA experience and knowledge as to not understand that it's a fallacy, then how can we really say that they won't just accept Mauro Renallo's analysis that "Kimbo gets a mulligan" as a result of lack of preparation? I think Kimbo's next fight and the reaction to it will tell the tale, not this one. It's just too wacky and to out-of-nowhere to really write the book on Kimbo Slice's MMA career just yet. I'm not defending Kimbo as a fighter, because I would agree that he's a brawler and he'll continue to get picked apart if they keep picking tough opponents for him. But consider three facts: 1) his audience of marks, 2) the short notice and 3) the near certainty that he has absolutely no preparation to fight a karate specialist (who from my limited experience with the sport seem to be specially gifted at doing exactly what Seth Petruzelli did, evading an attack and striking at a weak position). Last night was not a good one for EliteXC, but I have a hard time to believe it was the final nail in the coffin.

[HailtotheYo]

^ Thaaaaaaaannnk Yoooooouuuu

[ZJ Penn]

Lol, Kimbo. What a fucking debacle, that main event was like a WWE PPV.

That said, it took the focus off an otherwise solid show. Arlovski is brilliant and has perhaps the best beard in all of MMA.

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

Kimbo's not done. I never said Kimbo was done.

But all EXC can do now is book him in freak show matches against guys he'll definitely beat (Ken Shamrock, Don Frye, etc.), and he's got maybe one more good loss in him. He showed with the Thompson fight that he can't even beat a journeyman, and one of the "Kimbo-beater" rubs was just wasted on Petruzelli.

Edited October 5, 2008 by Mr. Potato Head

[Gene Kiniski]

Lol, Kimbo. What a fucking debacle, that main event was like a WWE PPV.

That said, it took the focus off an otherwise solid show. Arlovski is brilliant and has perhaps the best beard in all of MMA.

Arlovski look good out there, IMO. I enjoyed his fight for the most part He looks like he's back on his way to the top.

[ZJ Penn]

He's a fantastic fighter, easily one of my all-time favourite heavyweights. Exciting to watch and more often than not fights to a finish. UFC 70 is the only time I can think him going to a decision off the top of my head.

EDIT - Scratch that, there was the second Sylvia fight too. Still, 18 finishes in 20 fights is pretty good.

Edited October 5, 2008 by Zombie Jesus

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

Earliest word for numbers on last night is an average of 4.30 million viewers over the first two hours (so not including the main event), roughly on par with what the first show did. So I guess not too many people would have tuned out because of no Shamrock.

Edited October 5, 2008 by Mr. Potato Head

[caucasianheat]

But all EXC can do now is book him in freak show matches against guys he'll definitely beat (Ken Shamrock, Don Frye, etc.), and he's got maybe one more good loss in him. He showed with the Thompson fight that he can't even beat a journeyman, and one of the "Kimbo-beater" rubs was just wasted on Petruzelli.

Absolutely. They could take notes from PRIDE/K-1/DREAM and just feed him a steady diet of lousy or over-the-hill fighters to preserve his aura and keep people watching. I think the casual fan (ie: the people they want watching these CBS shows) just wants to see Slice kick somebody's ass; the talent level of that ass isn't relevant to them.

You're right about Slice having a few more losses before his value is shot. If Elite put him in what amount to squash matches until someone with superstar potential comes along, his aura is protected and he can fight that new person, potentially give them a big rub and go back to squashing tomato can fighters. He can be a freak show forever, but as a main eventer, eventually people are going to figure out that he's no good if he's getting punched out by just decent fighters. People expect main event fighters to have a level of talent that Slice doesn't now and could possibly never posses.

He's not shot, but he will be promptly if they book him as a world class fighter.

[CQI13]

At what age do you see MMA careers winding down? Kimbo is 34. As for his aura, nearly going the distance with Thompson certainly diminished it. And losing to an unimpressive fighter doesn't bode well either. It was fun while it lasted. If Kimbo had beaten good competition, or have had competitive fights against good competition, a loss wouldn't mean as much. But he's beaten nobodies or people who have seen their better days pass them already. And now this loss? Nobody wrote Lesnar off because his first UFC fight was against legit competition. Now if he'd lost the second one, we could think that maybe he's not as good as advertised. But Kimbo was living off the hype, having proven absolutely 0 in the cage.

[ZJ Penn]

At what age do you see MMA careers winding down?

All depends on the fighter. Lots of guys go out in their mid to late thirties as that's roughly the points that experience can't make up for the decline in physical ability. Whereas you also have Couture, who'll probably still be going when he's 60...and still as Heavyweight champion.

On the whole though, I'd say ability to keep up with the changing fighting styles is much more important than age with regards to career length.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Zombie Jesus

[Asuka's Gonna Kill You]

Why anybody is comparing this to wrestling is way beyond me. How the fuck is Hogan beating Goldberg in 13 seconds anything like an MMA fight?

Kimbo got knocked out, simple as that. He's not going to lose his major reputation as a badass, because everybody knows he's a badass. The guy has taken ten times harder punches from the looks of it, yet this time he got caught and was out, it happens in this sport. And that's supposed to be one of the awesome things about the sport, you never know what's going to happen. All that will happen is he'll have his next fight, probably destroy his opponent and just be back to where he was before. It's not exactly hard to build up a bad motherfucker like Kimbo, so I don't see why everybody thinks this will hurt him. Brock came in and lost his first fight, hasn't effected him at all. True, he was up against a ten times better opponent than what Kimbo was, but everybody was already shitting on Kimbo claiming he wasn't anything special. He cant have any excuses either, just lost fairly, simple as that.

I'd like to see Shamrock/Kimbo though. Gutted it didn't happen in the end, fucking tired of seeing this interesting fights promoted and then somebody pulling out of it. The injury to Shamrock sounds laughable as well. I think this can still swing well for Kimbo. He's lost a fight, pressure is off, a bit of attention away from him, but everybody is going to be interested to see what happens to him from here on. I know if that was me, I wouldn't want to be fighting him in his next fight when he's out to kill somebody.