2008/2009 Hockey Thread v2.0

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

Yeah, two Cups in 15 years, and at least six legitimate hall of famers in the same timespan. Not like...whatever team you cheer for.

[Slogger]

Yeah, two Cups in 15 years, and at least six legitimate hall of famers in the same timespan. Not like...whatever team you cheer for.

I was more thinking of them finishing pritty much dead last this year, But whatever.

[Plubby]

That said, I'm not arguing whether or not Crosby has a lot to learn. I'm merely stating the the Red Wings (and thus the media) making a big deal out of this is beyond sad. This is a non-issue and should be treated as such. But because it's something else the Crosby haters can use to justify why they don't like him it continues to get play. Nevermind the fact that it's fucking stupid and was blown completely out of proportion.

EDIT: I included you in the post because I assumed the "travesty" you spoke of was the Pens winning the Cup. If I wasn't such a "fair weather fan" and posted in this thread more often, maybe I wouldn't have made that mistake.

We'll debate until the ends of time about the stuff I left out of the quote. To some more productie things:

First section: Agree. Completely. The handshake is a big deal, but to be fair - for every second Crosby could have gotten there faster, the Wings could have waited.

Second section: Not the pens in general, their defensive corps, J-Staal, Talbot, Malkin on a good day, and esepecially Fleury are all players I have a lot of respect for. Just not Crosby. Crosby getting a cup is the travesty in my mind. And I know we'll debate that until the ends of time as well

[Clawson]

Talbot getting one second and Fleury maybe a minute of air-time to every five minutes of Crosby after they won the Cup is what pisses me off. These two guys won Pittsburgh that game and CBC is too fondling themselves to images of Crosby.

[SeanDMan]

So... both Sedin twins want 63 million for 12 years.

That works out to 5.25 million averaged for the cap hit.

When you do the math, that means 10.5 million dollar contract hit against what should probably be a 55 million dollar cap.

Last year, the Canucks scored 243 goals. The Sedins accounted for a combined 53 goals. That's 21.8 percent. If you factor together their combined point total, 164, that's a more considerable 67 percent. So to give them 19 percent of the payroll is either a slight steal or the biggest fucking robbery since the trade that netted them Luongo.

Even so, it's possible they might test the market, but I doubt any team except Vancouver (or maybe Toronto or New York) is willing to commit to that kind of term.

[gunnar hendershow]

Are the Sedin twins determined to play together?

[Toe]

These massive length contracts are just awful.

[SeanDMan]

Are the Sedin twins determined to play together?

Yes.

[TGWL]

These massive length contracts are just awful.

12 years? seriously? Drop Dead, you overrated piece of shits.

no,but seriously...12 years is a bit much. Look at what happened to Ricki in Long Island'ers. Sure, he might bounce back... but it puts the team in a bad situation.

[Reddaye]

The Sedins are going to get a hard dose of reality once they hit the FA market. No one in their right mind would pay that much for two players, and at that term; that still have a lot to prove in the post season. Had the Sedins made a bigger splash in the playoffs this year...maybe it would be worth some consideration.

Now watch Brian Burke sign them for that much. Ugh.

[Clawson]

I wasn't for them until I read this...

http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2009/6/1...re-elite-hockey

[Toe]

I like signing the Sedins because it would instantly give us a top scoring line and you don't need to worry about chemistry with them.

Edited June 20, 2009 by Toe

[Gabriel]

They're better suited for the Eastern Conference, where the emphasis is more on skill than grit... but at the same time, 20% of the team's Salary going to two players? Especially when the team is openly rebuilding? That just doesn't make any sense.

Let Vancouver keep them, and struggle to keep Luongo.

[Toe]

I think signing the Sedins would work. When you sign two good players, your going to be giving them similar deals if they are point per game players. Cammalleri will probably want 5-6 per year too. Case in point...

The Rangers and Nik Antropov are having some preliminary discussions as they would like to re-sign the 29 yr old sniper, but in reality there is very little the Rangers can do unless they move some bodies.

I’m told Antropov is seeking a 4-5 yr. deal worth somewhere in the neighborhood of $4-5 million per season.

Getting the brothers would be a jump. We don't need any more grit. We need skill. With the Sedins, we suddenly have a top line that we can lean on for production while continuing to draft and trade for some more skill players. Daniel and Henrik have been consistent producers for the Canucks. And remember, we might be seeing Kubina and/or Kaberle traded around the draft.

I've been telling people I know that getting the twins would be a good deal for the team. Unless the Leafs want to tank, that is.

Edited June 20, 2009 by Toe

[SeanDMan]

Canucks can afford to keep Luongo at his current rate and sign the Sedins, the major issues that would cause would be Kesler and Burrows when they come up for new deals, and finding money to resign/replace Mattias Ohlund.

[SeanDMan]

Also, it's pretty amusing how the dancing Sedin Sisters balet on ice suddenly looks a lot more appealing if they might be playing for you rather than us.

[Gabriel]

Canucks can afford to keep Luongo at his current rate and sign the Sedins, the major issues that would cause would be Kesler and Burrows when they come up for new deals, and finding money to resign/replace Mattias Ohlund.

See, that's the issue they're facing this summer. Do they re-sign the Sedins with the intention of moving Luongo? Do they re-sign all Sedins now, and then Luongo next summer at the expense of three core players?

It's a tight-wire walk they're attempting right now, and I'm not envious. If they re-sign all the stars, they will lose a lot of essential core players that they may not be able to replace, which, could lead to disaster... if they let some of them go in favor of keeping a strong overall group, they might not have that extra push added by having superstar playmakers or a superstar goaltender, which could be equally disastrous.

What I feel it comes down to, is how good the rest of the team looks. Personally, I think the Canucks have a really good base, and that the way to go for them is to part with either the Sedins or Luongo.

What do I see happening? I think they'll make a pitch to keep the Sedins, because if they lose them now, they lose them for nothing... if they can re-sign them, I fully expect them to move Luongo. Roberto Luongo, with 1 year left on his deal, will bring back a VERY nice return from a team who feels like all they're missing is the goaltending.

Case in point, the Washington Capitals. Send Luongo over to Washington for a package of players (including Theodore IF, IF, they cannot sign someone from Free Agency... which, they should be able to, because lots of guys are available.)

I'm not saying that's what will happen... but if the Sedins get re-upped, and they intend on keeping Luongo, the Canucks could very well end up being a team with four or five superstar players and a bunch of cans to fill in the roster... and in the NHL, in 2010... that's not going to be enough to win anything more than a playoff spot.

[SeanDMan]

Well, the Canucks have Alex Edler and Bieksa who are 2-3 guys on defense, and Burrows and Kesler for next year on affordable deals, plus they're trimming a lot of fat this year, Sundin is off the books, Pyatt is gone, plus they have Cody Hodgson coming up. He gives them a lot of flexibility, since they think he can be a top 2 line forward. You have the Sedins and Burrows, then Kesler - Hodgson - whoever, then Wellwood and Bernier on the third line, that's a pretty affordable and effective forward core. Sure, you'd need 3 cans to form your fourth line and the defense would be wafer thin if you can't replace Ohlund and Salo effectively, but fuck that, you've got Jesus Christ in net, just shoot out the lights and good things will happen.

[Gabriel]

I don't know if Jesus is the analogy you want to use. That guy was full of holes.

It's definitely do-able... they can keep their stars and move forward. I won't argue that. But I will say, without any doubt, that they will not be in the top 5 in terms of overall teams. By that, I mean, the sum of the whole won't be as great as at least five teams, maybe more... despite how great some of the parts might be.

Even Luongo showed he was human this year, and I personally wouldn't want to risk exposing him to any more of that by weakening his defensive corps too much.

Ohlund will be a big loss this summer.

[SeanDMan]

I'd debate anything you said, but you're a Flames fan, and you know what they say about gift horses in glass houses and all that.