Bill1996

I follow Shimmer and have pretty much maintained NCW-FF on my own, as Shimmer does a good job of promoting the NCW-FF shows. If someone wanted to put together all of the stuff for NCW to be included (with NCW-FF being a roster split) I'd have no issues with that. But, since I don't follow NCW in and of itself, I'm not gonna incorporate them into the game until someone that actually follows them is willing to make suggestions and keep them updated on a constant basis. The three contracts thing is certainly an issue for a fair amount of workers as well. It's one of the reasons I'm hesitant about adding a promotion when 1/3 of their roster can't be added, due to already having three promotions. Not much we can do about that, though. -Bill

Perhaps I should reclarify... Catch Wrestling is, for the most part, the same amateur freestyle wrestling that is in the Olympics, only without the submissions. I was pretty tired when I typed last night, so hopefully, this makes a bit more sense. No, technically, they're not "equal," but for EWR purposes, I would classify both of them as qualifying for shooting ability. -Bill To answer that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_wrestling I'm sorry again Bill, but freestyle wrestling and catch wrestling aren't virtually the same and your link just proves it isn't the same as freestyle, olympic free style or college style wrestling focuses on throws and pins, not submissions, among other key diffrerences. And if we are going down the "What is shoot fighting?" route Shoot Fighting: Per: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shootfighting Did you just read what you posted? "Shootfighting incorporates techniques from a multitude of traditional martial arts, the most principle of these being Muay Thai and Catch Wrestling." Again, for the purposes of EWR (which to be honest, is all I really care about here), I would personally say that amateur wrestling, catch wrestling (since you seem insistent on separating the two) boxing, martial arts and any actual, competitive fighting would comfortably fit under "shoot fighting experience." -Bill

To answer that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_wrestling If wiki isn't good enough for you: http://www.scientificwrestling.com/ Certainly sounds like shooting to me. -Bill

I'm still wondering where this "Shooting only affects who PRIDE will sign" is coming from, other than someone in the other thread saying that that's all it does. If I were a betting man, I'd about bet that owners that are set to "Prefer Mixed Martial Arts" would look to sign workers with Shooting Ability as well. Which means, if we take the "Shooting only affects who PRIDE will sign" as correct and remove shooting from everyone, then when and if an owner that prefers mixed martial arts takes over one of the in-game promotions, they won't sign anyone, since nobody will have shooting checked. Currently, there are two owners that prefer mixed martial arts in the game: Antonio Inoki and Rick Bassman. So, it's not like it's a major thing, but if one of those two take over a promotion in your game and nobody has shooting checked, if they don't sign anyone due to that, you essentially have an empty promotion in the game... Which will ultimately lead to people wanting shooting ticked on workers again. With over 5800 workers in the database currently, I'm really not liking the idea of going through and making sure none of them have shooting checked, only to have to go through and recheck it, if this whole "shooting only affects who PRIDE will sign" theory is incorrect. On things like superstar look, fonz factor, etc: The problem is, they're subjective. Everyone will have their own opinions. In theory, damn near every female should have diva checked, because pretty much everyone is attractive to someone. An example of this would be Taylor Nicole. She doesn't have diva checked, but is married to Joe Rules. Are we to believe that, if Joe Rules was making suggestions to the data, that he doesn't think his wife has sex appeal or is photogenic? Same goes for Superstar Look. I might catch hell for this, but personally, I think Dean Ambrose looks like a goofball, not a superstar. Of the three members of the Shield, he'd be the last one I gave Superstar look to. But, I know the majority would raise hell if he didn't have it checked. Just again, personal opinions. One thing I can say is, if someone makes a suggestion for a gimmick change that requires something be checked... If the worker fits that gimmick, they also would get the check to ensure that the gimmick works. For superstar look, that's only 4 gimmicks. But, for menacing, it's around 10. Some gimmicks require that the worker not have something checked as well. On older (unknown, or little known) workers: I've been gradually weeding some out and I'll continue to do that. That's one thing I really do like about Fusion's posts... They're drawing my attention to some of these workers who, if we can't find info on them in 2013, probably won't be in the data much longer. Beforehand, I'd visit guys like Randy Orton and John Cena's stats multiple times per month, because there were people arguing over whether their charisma should be at 94 or 95... When I have to visit the same workers multiple times, month after month, for such miniscule changes (which again, mainly are suggested based on opinion) it takes away from other stuff that I could be doing. Thanks to Fusion, I have literally pages and pages of suggestions on workers, many of whom I've never worked on in my seven years of doing updates. While it's likely annoying to some, it forces me to actually look at the worker and see if he or she is even worth keeping in, if we can't get accurate info for him/her. It won't get done in one month and a good majority of his suggestions are "back burner" stuff, but it is nice to have something in my notes regarding these workers. -Bill

Perhaps I should reclarify... Catch Wrestling is, for the most part, the same amateur freestyle wrestling that is in the Olympics, only without the submissions. I was pretty tired when I typed last night, so hopefully, this makes a bit more sense. No, technically, they're not "equal," but for EWR purposes, I would classify both of them as qualifying for shooting ability. -Bill

It would be fine, if I didn't have about 75,000 other notepad and word files already that I look over on a monthly basis. To be honest, it's just one more headache that I'd rather not take on... Also, it's not just me remembering which promotion is which... Every other person posting and making suggestions would have to as well. We tried it before and it didn't work out so well. -Bill

Here's my earlier question... How do you know that the shooting tick is only for PRIDE? I've never seen or heard this anywhere before. Keep in mind, one of the owners' "Preferences" is Mixed Martial Arts. I'd have to think that if you set an owner to that and they took over a promotion, they would look for workers with shooting ticked as well. This is why Shimmer and NCW-FF (women's promotions) have their owners set to "Prefers T And A." While Shimmer and NCW-FF aren't really "T and A" promotions, that leads owners with that preference to hire women. I just am finding it very hard to believe that shooting was added to the worker statistics for the sole purpose of determining whether or not one of the Japanese promotions would hire them.

OK, now I know that this is incorrect... I played a game using Shimmer before Sara Del Ray went to WWE... PRIDE signed her to a touring contract. Remember it quite vividly, as I was upset, because I wanted to sign her to a written deal. So, women can certainly be offered contracts with PRIDE in EWR... -Bill

Regarding shooting ability: I'd like to know what shows that "all's it affects is who gets hired by PRIDE." I've been doing these updates for over seven years and have never seen or heard that anywhere. Here's what the Guide says: "Shooting Ability: If this is true, the workers has shoot fighting experience." Here's what the Editor says: "If this box is checked, the wrestler has previous shoot fight experience." I would personally say that amateur wrestling (also called "catch wrestling") boxing, martial arts and any actual, competitive fighting would comfortably fit under "shoot fighting experience." Simply playing American Football would not be. Also, someone mentioned reassigning the Japanese promotions to reflect modern day promotions. Problem with that is, remembering which "new" promotion is replacing the "old" one. The Japanese promotions are hardwired into the game... They can't be changed to reflect new promotion names. As a result, I really don't like the idea of reassigning those slots, as then I have to remember which is which, because people will inevitably suggest to put a worker into a Japanese Touring commitment using the "new" promotion name. Finally, maybe it's me, but it seems like a lot of people this month (I'm noticing a lot of posters labeled as "donators," specifically) that are hardly, if ever, in these threads at any other time. This thread (and future threads) needs to be on track with actual suggestions for updating, not for bickering back and forth. If you have an issue with a specific suggestion, feel free post on it, speak your peace and then move on. Believe it or not, it takes up a fair amount of time to go through these threads every month to make notes and it's very frustrating when half of the thread is nothing more than back and forth arguing about silly stuff. Please don't waste my time by spending thread space arguing back and forth endlessly. That only minimizes the time I have to update, meaning that less gets done. If I'm coming in here day after day, month after month, seeing nothing but arguing, I'm going to be much less inclined to put out monthly updates at all, than to go through a thread reading a back-and-forth bitchfest. That's all I'm going to say on the matter. -Bill

Hopefully, this will clear up the Lightweight/Heavyweight cutoff debate: Anyone under 220 pounds = Lightweight Anyone over 230 pounds = Heavyweight Anyone between 220 and 230 can be classified as either. Let me explain the reasoning here: If site A has, for Example, Curtis Axel at 219, while site B has him at 225, there could be a back and forth where I'm changing him from a lightweight to a heavyweight and back based on what a site says he weighs on a given day. People's weights fluctuate, so the 220-230 is sort of a "buffer" that way, if they fall in that area, we're not having a constant debate about those workers that are right on the line. Unless I'm mistaken, the only difference in EWR, besides a couple gimmicks, is that heavyweights can't wrestle for titles classified as "lightweight" titles. Having this buffer also allows a switch if circumstances call for it, such as Axel taking on a gimmick that requires him to be a heavyweight in the game, or if he wins a lightweight title (WWE would have to bring one back first, but hopefully, everyone understands what I'm saying). -Bill

A few things to keep in mind: A: Just because nobody debates a suggestion doesn't mean it "becomes edict," as you suggest. If something about the suggestion seems out of line, I usually don't make the change, unless I get or find more info to back the suggestion. Even without debate, in a lot of cases, if someone suggesting a huge bump in something, I'll only go partway with it. B: As you said, most of these are "complete randoms." Again, how is suggesting to lower someone's wage and/or overness for a worker who has had zero suggestions made for them in seven years inaccurate? Is it really that big of a ballbuster if a worker that hasn't had a suggestion made for them in over seven years has his overness lowered from 4 to 2? Because, that's a big bulk of what his suggestions are. C: Again, this isn't the first time someone has made a long list of suggestions. I'd rather have long lists of suggestions than have 3 1/2 pages of pointless back and forth arguing that ultimately, accomplishes nothing. -Bill

Wow... I can't leave you guys alone for five minutes... I'm honestly at a loss on where to even start with this.... I do know that, when Fusion started posting changes for workers that were pretty obscure, I made a post saying something to the effect of "I'd rather do this sort of thing than go back and forth on a one point change in Randy Orton's charisma every month." Keep in mind, I'm the one who has to go through all of these posts and decide whether or not to make changes based on the suggestions made. If I'm not bothered by it, why are some of you? It's not like he's suggesting wholesale changes to the WWE, TNA and ROH rosters, either. Many of these workers he's made suggestions on, I'd be willing to bet, many of you have never even used and/or didn't even know they were in the game to begin with. Please explain to me how taking a worker many have never heard of and dropping his overness and/or wages is "inaccurate info"? That's a big bulk of the suggestions being made. Nothing real crazy. I'll let you in on a little secret: Many of these workers that he's made suggestions for haven't had a single change done to them since I started working on the data back in 2006... That's 7 years where nobody has made a suggestion on these workers. How many people honestly think that workers who many have probably never heard of should have the exact stats and wages as they had in an update made over seven years ago? I also realize that Cagematch isn't always 100% accurate. I've used Cagematch for years and nobody has bitched about it. I also use Genickbruch (wrestlingdata.com in german, don't ask me why I don't use the English site), on top of old fashioned Google Searches and anything else I can get my hands on. Unfortunately, sometimes, there's only one source for info. The alternative would be to delete the worker altogether, which some of these obscure workers will likely see that fate in the coming months. I try not to do that too often, as I figure the minute I do, someone will complain that their "favorite Backyard to Global guy" got removed. The main thing is, keep in mind that this is all just suggestions. Believe it or not, other posters in years' past have made pretty long lists, similar to the ones Fusion has made in the past couple months. Remember to attack the post, not the poster. If you see something out of whack, you're encouraged to make your own suggestion to the initial suggestion. But, make your suggestions and leave it at that. Also, if someone else disagrees with your suggestion, don't take it personally. I've been in many a discussion on here with members that disagreed with something... I don't take it personal and sometimes, the person wins me over to their side of the argument... But, not too often... In short, TheWho's post summed this up pretty well: FWIW, I have now spent over two hours in this thread, reading, taking notes on stat suggestions (what few there were) and formulating a response to all of this. That's time that I was planning on working on the data, that has pretty much now gone to waste. To be honest, this fiasco has wasted far much more time than any suggestion on stats ever has. -Bill

October thread has been up for about a week: Please post any further suggestions there. Thanks. -Bill

Before I forget, I experimented a bit and this seems to be the effects on morale from hiring or firing people with relationships in the game: Hire a Blood Relative: +20 Morale Fire a Blood Relative: -25 Morale Hire a Dislike: -20 Morale Fire a Dislike: No Change Hire a Friendship: +10 Morale Fire a Friendship: -25 Morale Hire a Hate: -40 Morale Fire a Hate: No Change Hire a Love: +20 Morale Fire a Love: -25 Morale Hire a Loyalty: +10 Morale Fire a Loyalty: -25 Morale So, as an example: Brie Bella and Daniel Bryan have a "Love" relationship in the game. So, if you had Brie on your roster and hired Bryan, Brie's morale would go up by 20. If both were on the roster and you fired either, the one that you kept would have their morale drop by 25. Firing a Loyalty or Love also has the chance that the person you don't fire will leave as well, especially if they are only under an open contract. Hopefully, this helps some when suggesting to add relationships into the game. Are two people really "friends" enough that they'd drop 25 points in morale if you fired their "friend"? Is a trainer "loyal" enough to a student that they'd drop 25 points in morale and perhaps even leave the promotion, if you fired their trainee? Hopefully, this fine tunes the criteria for adding relationships. -Bill

Wanted to get this out real quick, need to finish up going through last months notes before moving onto next month's update. -Bill MediaFire: FULL: http://www.mediafire.com/download/g7kh98jq22thk3x/OCTUPDATE.zip DATA: http://www.mediafire.com/download/9b9wv2n21knhm9i/OCTDATA.zip BEGINNERS: http://www.mediafire.com/download/t5thb52tx3v6u7b/OCTBEGINNERS.zip

I have a workaround for that: Rightclick the link, click "Properties" Copy the URL, click "cancel" Open a new window, paste the address, hit enter. Works everytime for me. -Bill

Well, again, if I'm being honest, GTA V could very well be a reason why all of your suggested changes aren't done in time for the October update... Although currently, I'm having a bit of an issue with my player diving out of the car at random. Tried a different controller and have issues with the cell phone popping up and the radio station changing at random... Never had a problem on any of my other games, but might be time for new controllers... -Bill

I'll be honest here... I'd rather make different changes, such as the one's he's proposing, as opposed to making the same 1-2 point changes regarding things such as Randy Orton's charisma every month... Also, just because these are all suggested, doesn't mean that they'll be at the top of the list to change. I jump around a lot when making changes, as opposed to just going down a list. I certainly won't simply forget everything else just to work on his suggestions. I try to make changes based on "sense of urgency." Meaning, things that are non-debatable (like title changes, hirings/firings, etc) take priority over boosting subjective things like worker's stats. -Bill

Quick question: Where are you pulling all of this info for these people? Just at a glance, I'm seeing that many of them are, for the most part, relatively unknowns. Not that I mind the suggested changes, per se, just wondering what is leading you to the conclusions, since I assume little to no info is available for many of them... Or, am I just not looking in the right place? Just genuinely curious as to what is prompting you to suggest all of these changes on relatively unknowns is all. -Bill

Wanted to make some notes while I had a chance to: He's actually on both the NXT and main rosters on the website. He's also been the color commentator for Superstars since the end of June. We'd have to uncheck menacing, as the Rich Snob gimmick requires menacing to be unchecked. Superstars is taped at the same time that RAW and SmackDown are. While the same is true for Main Event, Main Event is actually on TV (Ion) where Superstars is only on WWE.com. EWR suggests to have a max of 3 shows per promotion... Superstars is just the "odd man out" in that situation. The name doesn't fit... It's too long. All three of these workers are already at their three promotion limit. I listened to this myself. Keep in mind the context. When Portia said "I hate Serena," she was talking about a match where Portia and a midget would face Serena and a midget, as opposed to Portia and Serena being on the same side, facing two midgets. In EWR, when two people have a "Hate" relationship," they don't want to work together at all, not even as opponents. I stated before that Serena and Portia just had a lengthy feud in Shimmer as well. If Portia truly hated Serena (in an EWR sense) she wouldn't want to work with her at all, much less work with her many times to have a lengthy feud in Shimmer and to work a match with midgets. Genickbruch has at least 17 matches that have taken place between Serena and Portia... Doesn't sound like two people that aren't willing to work together to me. Again, listening to the context here, Portia said that she had met Del Rey exactly once before they lived together. While I'm not saying that they aren't friends, wresting has a way of pairing people who aren't necessarily friends together, especially when it is beneficial to the people involved. The arrangement could very well have been just a way for the two of them to save money renting a place while in Mexico... Personally, I don't think just because two or more wrestlers share a car, rent, hotel room, etc, automatically means that all parties involved are friends, per se... Sometimes, they simply do it to cut their costs in half... Mick Foley is a perfect example of this. After researching this a bit, it appears as if both of these shows still are shown on Televisa, which is a sister company of Galavision. I'm thinking the more accurate thing to to would be to simply rename the Galavision US TV network to Televisa... I mentioned this before... Spliting the two would hurt the rosters, due to many workers already working for three promotions without splitting them. There are currently at least 12 workers that have 3 promotions already and have worked for both Shimmer and Shine. Another thing to keep in mind is that, while Shimmer only meets for two weekends a year, they tape 4 DVD's on both of those weekends, for a total of 8. Add in the WrestleCon show this year and that'll be 9 shows that Shimmer runs this year. If you're arguing for the promotion to read "Shine/Smimmer" instead of "Shimmer/Shine," my guess would be that, Shimmer is still the more popular of the two promotions, as people travel from all over the world to go to the Shimmer tapings... I just don't see that happening with the Shine shows. Think that's all I got for now. -Bill

Heading out of town for a few days, so I'll plan on discussing the update sometime next week. -Bill MediaFire: FULL: http://www.mediafire.com/download/o8az0tm8i89pp17/SEPUPDATE.zip DATA: http://www.mediafire.com/download/c4fpo5pbj9d1oqa/SEPDATA.zip BEGINNERS: http://www.mediafire.com/download/ah2u7vr4a7b9v1b/SEPBEGINNERS.zip

That's fine, as long as it is updated consistently and one or more people on the board here are willing to help keep it up-to-date by posting about things going on in the promotion. I'm not big on social media at all, so without them updating their website, this would be one of those promotions where, if someone doesn't mention something about it here, I'm probably not going to know about any changes that have taken place. Again, I just don't want to put them in the game and then get zero info regarding updating it as the months go on. I looked them up on Cagematch and it looks as if they have only had 2 shows so far this year (June and July). I've also seen where they originally didn't allow fans to show up and their shows were basically done just in front of other wrestlers... I assume this has changed as well...? I put WSU with CZW for a couple reasons. First, as I said, since the new ownership has taken over, every WSU event (with the exception of the very first one) has been a double header with CZW and I've learned tonight that their next Show in October will be a double header with them as well. Also, with Beyond Wrestling already being listed as CZW's Development Territory, it just made sense to me to put WSU there. If we were to add Beyond as a standalone promotion, we could have WSU be a roster split with them. -Bill

From the article I read, she's paid by appearance and the door has been left open for her to be back at any time. That was the reason I let her on an open deal. I didn't want to have her as "unemployed" and then show up on TV randomly. It could end up with removing her and adding her back quite often, obviously depending on how much she is used in the future. On top of that, my guess is, if you're not playing as WWE, she's released rather quickly in the game anyway. If you are playing as WWE, having her on an open deal means that you can release her with no consequences. Just thought that an open deal was the best way to go all around. He is already in CZW/DG-EVO/FIP He is already in PWG/PWS/FIP Unless I missed him, Hama isn't in the game as of yet. "The Brain" gimmick requires that the worker be a heel... I've set Ellering to the Mentor gimmick, unless others have a better idea. She's said herself that she is a tweener. When asked if she was a face or a heel, she said "both." -Bill

I wanted to post before this, but the past week and a half or so have been a bit hectic. But, wanted to make some notes/comments on things that have been posted so far this month and last month: I'm not against it, per se, but looking at their website, the last update appears to be may 20. Their roster page says "under construction." My main concern would be, first, where is the info on the promotion coming from (am I missing a new website or something?) and how long is that source of information going to be reliable? I just don't want to put them in this month or next, only to see the information regarding them dry up and the promotion be out of date quickly, with no way to update it. Currently, Beyond Wrestling is listed as a development territory for CZW. This past week, I did move WSU into CZW, making WSU a roster split of CZW, since every WSU event this year has been run as a double show with a CZW event. Drew Cordeiro (WSU owner) has been changed to a Road Agent and is listed as the booker for the Beyond Wrestling development territory. Again, I'm not against the idea of making Beyond Wrestling their own promotion, if we can get accurate info on it and if we're confident that that info will continue to be accurate and accessible. I haven't heard this, but I'd about bet that this was said in kayfabe. Portia and Serena recently had a pretty bitter feud in Shimmer just before Serena was sidelined with injury. In short, no. To be quite honest, splitting them would cause more issues for some of the worker than it would help. Here's what I mean: That is the list of workers that are in SWA-SW currently that have all three promotions slots filled and are in the Shine roster split as well. The ones with the "X" next to them have appeared in both Shine and Shimmer. So, if Shine and Shimmer were split, that'd be 13 workers that we'd have to pull out of one of their three current promotions. On top of that, there are workers like Christina Von Eerie and Veda Scott that are already not in promotions that they should be in, due to being limited to three promotions. Splitting Shine and Shimmer would mean that they'd not be in yet another promotion that they should be in. FWIW, there are currently 9 workers that have worked for both Shimmer and Shine (in addition to the ones above) that have 2 of their 3 slots filled already as well. Meaning, if we split Shimmer and Shine, all three spots of those workers would then be full, meaning that if they worked for another promotion, or we added a new promotion that they are in, we'd again have to decide which one to pull them from. I realize that the "3 promotions" thing is a part of the game and that those decisions are sometimes necessary regardless, but to be honest, I don't see a large amount of people caring if Shimmer and Shine are together. My guess is, they'd rather have a totally separate promotion take that slot, as opposed to having two promotions with semi-similar rosters on them. Besides, if someone wants to play as Shine, all's they have to do is release all of the workers in shimmer not in the shine roster split. for those who download the Beginners update, I've even left the Shine banner and logo in so that they can replace the Shimmer banner and logo, if they want to play exclusively as Shine. I'll start a new post for the July thread. -Bill

In a hurry, but wanted to get this out today. Plan to be back at the start of next week to discuss. FIP and FWE have both been added to the game this month, for anyone curious. -Bill MediaFire: FULL: http://www.mediafire.com/download/0s1ryn9u5wcnbiw/AUGUPDATE.zip DATA: http://www.mediafire.com/download/gp6ta01tav0i1dg/AUGDATA.zip BEGINNERS: http://www.mediafire.com/download/z9ua4rk91gadfa7/AUGBEGINNERS.zip