NBA Thread 2011-12

[Maxx]

You'd be murdering college basketball.

[Blitz]

By making people who are going to leave after one year stay a second?

How so?

[Maxx]

Because none of them will go to college.

[Blitz]

I think a good numbers of athletes will still go to college. The competition will be better in college than it would be in the NBDL, meaning the 20 year old coming out of University of Kentucky will be considerably better than the 20 year old coming out of the Bakersfield Jam. I'd argue that being on a stage like the NBDL, the way it's currently configured, would stunt a player's growth and he might never meet his potential.

[thuganomic]

I just don't see why the owners would want this when they already have a minor league system with better coaching in the NCAA. They could just make players go to school for 2 years and not provide the NBDL alternative.

[naiwf]

I think a good numbers of athletes will still go to college. The competition will be better in college than it would be in the NBDL, meaning the 20 year old coming out of University of Kentucky will be considerably better than the 20 year old coming out of the Bakersfield Jam. I'd argue that being on a stage like the NBDL, the way it's currently configured, would stunt a player's growth and he might never meet his potential.

You can't get paid in college, and you have to "attend/pass classes" in college. Why would anyone worth a damn go to college for two years when they could get paid to play hoops instead? The Brandon Jennings approach isn't going to become the norm, but I don't see how he'd be any better off having gone to some big time college program for a year playing against guys who won't get into the league at about a 90% or greater clip. Also, the guy coming out of UK is a BETTER talent than 95% of the guys slumming in the NBDL. D-Rose didn't really learn anything at Memphis that he couldn't have learned in the NBDL, a Euroleague team or straight in the NBA. The vast majority of the superstar players don't get considerably better in their first few years in the NBA. How many years did it take LeBron to develop a post game? He wasn't going to learn that by just being so dominant athletically that he would have spent his entire freshman year dunking over fools at Duke or OSU.

[Maxx]

I believe LeBron was going to attend Memphis.

[naiwf]

That would have been an even larger gap between LeBron's talent level and everyone else in the league. Going back to the previous point, if you look at most of the top guys in the league right now their biggest weakness is shooting the ball. That's turrible and wouldn't be changed by another year or 3 in college. Guys like Rondo, Westbrook, Rose etc just dominate their opponents because they can get wherever they want to on the court. Other than guys who are "athletically changed", most NBA players are pretty inept at the fundamentals of the game on one side of the court, or both.

[gunnar hendershow]

I believe LeBron was going to attend Memphis.

I always read Ohio State but thinking back to where the program was 2003 I find that hard to believe.

Anyway, to add my piece to the debate. There are a massive amount of talented basketball players in the world, but only a handful of superstars. The NBA has taken a long time to build up the NBDL because a lot of guys are either good enough to spend one year in college before finding a home on an NBA roster, good enough to make more money and have more playing time overseas, or good enough already to not need development. Yes the majority of American players lack fundamental skills and get by largely on either one talent (rebounding or 3-point shooting being the best examples) or just superior athletic gifts that allow them to jump over or run by anyone in their way, and college coaches have zero interest in taking these guys and making them better for the NBA. They just want to win. It's not a minor league system at all. The only reason surefire NBA talents go there is because they have to for at least year. Brandon Jennings isn't the blueprint for high school talents trying to get paid right away, but he's very much the blueprint for borderline NBA talents trying to get paid instead of wasting away time in the ups-and-downs of a minor league system.

Minor leagues work in baseball. It's a sport that day-in and day-out requires practice and precision. Nobody can get by on their athleticism. It can turn average into good and good into great, but without the repeated practicing of the game's fundamentals a player would not be on a roster. In the NBA this isn't the case. Guys know they don't have to practice every single part of the game. They either have their prized talent or they have their athletic ability. The NBDL instead turns into a place for guys to just play and get paid, hoping for an injury or trade on an NBA affiliate. There has been a small amount of players who have toiled away in the NBDL for more than a season who have actually done anything of note in the NBA for a reason.

[sahyder1]

I believe LeBron was going to attend Memphis.

I always read Ohio State but thinking back to where the program was 2003 I find that hard to believe.

I remember hearing Ohio State back then too.

[Blitz]

I guess the system I have in mind is more for intended to create league depth. Sure, there are those that can make it in the NBA based soley on their athleticism or size. But if players were slowly integrated into the NBA instead of thrust into the league with high expectations they may stand a better chance of succeeding.

It would be interesting to see what two years of development and maturity could have done to guys like Sebastian Telfair, Darko Milicic, and Shaun Livingston.

[gunnar hendershow]

Well for Darko at least those 2 years would have allowed him to possibly avoid Larry Brown as his head coach and that would have likely turned a lot of things in a different direction right away.

[Blitz]

Well for Darko at least those 2 years would have allowed him to possibly avoid Larry Brown as his head coach and that would have likely turned a lot of things in a different direction right away.

Yea, Darko's confidence was shattered during his tenure in Detroit. He had monumental expectations put on his from draft day, not just because of his position, but because of those around him. He never averaged more than seven minutes per game while he was there, but after getting playing time on the Magic he started 7.6 PPG and 2.1 BPG in just 20.9 minutes. Those are solid averages for just under two quarters, especially for a guy who was basically left for dead by the league.

[gunnar hendershow]

Darko's come around to be a serviceable player made more important by his size. He could have been a lot more. Who knows what would have happened if Carmelo, Bosh, or Wade had ended up there.

[bill_da_bill]

Darko's come around to be a serviceable player made more important by his size. He could have been a lot more. Who knows what would have happened if Carmelo, Bosh, or Wade had ended up there.

Thinking about what if the Pistons had taken someone else still keeps me awake some nights, haha. What a crushing thought for a Pistons fan.

In fairness to Joe Dumars though it was never Chris Bosh or Dwayne Wade being considered, it was always Darko or Melo. Most people were shocked the Heat picked Wade when they did. Still the thought of Melo on that Pistons team is troubling. The one thing that kept that team from winning another title was always the lack of a go-to scorer.

[Quom]

Darko showed what he could be in a game this season. His main problem is motivation. He's unfit, I don't know how you can be unfit when one of the main requirements of your profession but he is. I truly believe that with the right coaching he could have owned the defensive low block. But he's definitely not a banger and he's not a typical euro guy with impressive range. He's a Vlade Divac without the passing. He's not a number 2 draft pick, but he could have been a really, really good player. I think the weight of expectation was just too much. Plus that was the worst possible team for a player of his style.

[Blitz]

Why did Detroit even want another big man? Didn't they still have both Wallace's under contract?

[Maxx]

Nag, they didn't get Rasheed until 2004.

[gunnar hendershow]

Yeah they just had Ben Wallace, the debate was whether to take a young scorer or a young big man. Most of the time the latter decision wins out.

[thuganomic]

Yeah they just had Ben Wallace, the debate was whether to take a young scorer or a young big man. Most of the time the latter decision wins out.

I would hope that after Bowie over MJ, Darko over Melo, and Oden over Durant...that it wouldn't happen again, but Hasheem Thabeet was drafted 2nd overall