League vs Union

[DoubleX]

Oh, I see there's a bit of a misunderstanding here.

I'm not referring to any particular teams. I'm aware of the state of the ARU.

I'm talking about from a player's perspective. I've played both League and Union, and I much prefer Union. I've heard of League scrums that push, but not seen one myself. Perhaps I was mistaken.

Oh, and we may stop, yes, but only for a brief second before the forward packs come crashing in and fight to push one away. Ball comes out, we continue. Whereas in League, you're tackled, stop, stand up, play the ball, dummy-half passes it out.

I dunno, I guess I see more in a Union tackle than a League tackle (not counting brutality of tackles; I've seen some crunching hits in League).

EDIT:

your forwards are a bunch of overweight nuffies.

*cough*MATTDUNNING*cough*

Edited March 20, 2006 by DoubleX

[Zaz]

Name other one, I dare you

But generally, your forwards are exactly that. League has gone moved away from the big powerhouse forward who lacks mobility to those who are still big, but are more fit and stuff >_>

And yes, your rucks are continuous movement etc. but, what, the defence line only has to go back five metres? It means they're tackled again soon after, unless they get a kick away and then the game becomes more like AFL then Union

And yeah, we don't push that much in scrums, but we haven't the need to since balls went in through the second row rather than through the hooker. And by we I mean League players

While we're at it, I hope the NRL does raise the salary cap, meaning we can keep more of our existing players rather than losing them to Union and England. The constant "going after League players" mentality the ARU has also has a bad effect on the state of Union in Australia, as their juniors will probably see more of a chance of playing Union at a national level by going through League, rather than Union itself, as there is more chance to get yourself on the main scene in League due to the amount of teams going around.

[Mj3]

Since Liam pretty much covered it, why not move on to a slightly different topic, namely which of the two do you prefer? I always liked Union better simply because it was less complicated, and particularly since the Quins are kicking arse.

Oh how I laughed at seeing them relegated.. Happy Days.

I've grown up with Union so always prefered it but most likely through that main purpose. It just seems more fluid to me and there are some stupid rules in Lewague. The whole, if you kick it and our man charges it down we still get the ball one being perhaps the most laughable of the lot, come to thingk of it Uriah Rennie used that in the Spurs game yesterday...

Laughable rules? how about turn the scrum 90 degrees you either win a scrum or conceding a penalty depending on how the ref feels? or the rediculous amount of advantage after a knock on? and theres a lot of those in union.

Ps. the rule is known as a "charge down" and they have them in union too.

[Zaz]

Well, 15 teams from 3 states, 1 territory and New Zealand actually, but whatever >_>

Jamie Lyon isn't second-rate, no, in fact he's probably the best centre in the world. And he's hot favourites to come to Manly next year

But, we do have second-rate/retired players over there going very well. Darren Alberts (2nd rate ever since the 1997 Grand Final, the drug cheat. We'll be taking his head off this round though), Chad Randall (useless hack who only got into first grade because of his father, suppose he was a good defender though), Ian Hindmarsh (right?), Andrew Walker (he was alright I guess, but then he got done in for drugs), Bret Dallas, Scott Donald etc.

And North Queensland rely on their back 3 plus Thurston to take them to Premierships. And Thurston is a grub who should be locked up in gaol rather than playing League

[Mj3]

Well, 15 teams from 3 states, 1 territory and New Zealand actually, but whatever >_>

Jamie Lyon isn't second-rate, no, in fact he's probably the best centre in the world. And he's hot favourites to come to Manly next year

But, we do have second-rate/retired players over there going very well. Darren Alberts (2nd rate ever since the 1997 Grand Final, the drug cheat. We'll be taking his head off this round though), Chad Randall (useless hack who only got into first grade because of his father, suppose he was a good defender though), Ian Hindmarsh (right?), Andrew Walker (he was alright I guess, but then he got done in for drugs), Bret Dallas, Scott Donald etc.

And North Queensland rely on their back 3 plus Thurston to take them to Premierships. And Thurston is a grub who should be locked up in gaol rather than playing League

[The LBTN Express]

League is way better than Union in my opinion. It's usually decided upon where you live really over here anyway it seems. If your from up North you're more likely to like League, if your from down south you're more likely to like Union.

On the whole NRL/ESL debate. I don't think there's much difference between the teams. The ESL is more hottly contested than ever before with the lower clubs really starting to improve, like Warrington and Salford who have made great starts this season and are really playing well. I do watch a lot of the NRL (usually two games a week) and I don't notice much difference in class. Plus the English game has Stuart Fielden which makes every debate null and void .

EDIT: And on the second rate thing, yeah they do, do well but none of them are really outstanding and are usually squad players who are signed to fit with the salary cap. The only ones to really make a huge impact are Lyon and the Bulls NZ's like Hape, Vainikolo and Paul who is now at the Giants, plus a couple more.

Edited March 21, 2006 by LBTN™

[Chris the Human]

As for advantage, the slower pace of league means that there's no advantage to a knock on, the ball comes to you and you're tackled and left with 4, not advantage is it?

Edited March 21, 2006 by The Misanthrope

[Mj3]

To weigh in with the whole ESL vs. NRL debate, the NRL is currently a good distance ahead of the ESL in terms of genuine quality. Whilst the World Club Challenge typically goes the way of the ESL side it's important to note that they're playing a home fixture, generally play warm-up games, and take it deadly serious. Whilst some sides have taken it seriously in recent years (most notably Sydney and Melbourne), most do just treat it as a trial. I don't deny that Bradford, St Helens, and Leeds could compete in the NRL - but they'd not be able to match it up consistently with the likes of Sydney, Canterbury, Newcastle, North Queensland etc.

[Zaz]

Newcastle's success is determined soley on Andrew John's fitness. With him in the side, the rest of the team don't think they can lose and their confidence rises heaps as a result. When he's out, they don't think they can win, all confidence goes out the window and they start playing like wooden spooners. It even had an effect on NSW and Australia. Granted, Johns is the best player in the world (in my opinion), but it's what he adds mentally to the rest of the team that gets them over the line.

And if Manly don't smash Cronulla this week in revenge for a) last year's smashing; b) Darren Alberts; we're in for a long season methinks.

Edited March 22, 2006 by Zaz

[draggx]

If cronulla play like they did last week manly are sure to thrash them dont worry..

I cant stand the NQC but god damn i think im gonna have to go to the gamne this weekend and watch the Storm thrash em...

again.. GO the Broncs in 06

[Chris the Human]

Johns is the best player in the world. I think it's gone well beyond personal opinion. Nobody even bothers to argue anymore, although that crazy Stevo does claim Fielden is. But he's crazy, and clearly has some kind of man-crush on him.

What frustrates me as a Newcastle fan is that the team relies on Johns not so much as a playmaker (we've got Buderus and Gidley to fill the role), but as a talisman. He's not there and guys lke Simpson, who has played for Australia, go missing.

[Mj3]

Stevo claims a lot of untrue things, but he's not that big an idiot to say Fielden, a prop, is the best in the world, I've heard him say he's the best prop in the world though, between him and Webcke.

And a note on Webcke, fookin awesome! people talk about HHH bringing his A-game around 'mania time, this guy doesnt have an a-game, its his only game, same with Fielden.

[Chris the Human]

Oh, no doubt Fielden is one of the game's finest props (although I think Luke Bailey is more consistent) - but Stevo clearly claimed that Fielden was the best during the World Club challenge.

Webcke's not as good as he used to be. I rate Ryles, Bailey, O'Meley, and even Perry ahead of him at the moment.

Speaking of Perry, did merry old England get the Knights vs. Bulldogs game? If we weren't premiership favourites going into the game, we certainly were after racking up a 46-22 scoreline against the Dogs.

[Mj3]

So what do you reckon to Britains finest winger Brian Carney?

[draggx]

Oh, no doubt Fielden is one of the game's finest props (although I think Luke Bailey is more consistent) - but Stevo clearly claimed that Fielden was the best during the World Club challenge.

Webcke's not as good as he used to be. I rate Ryles, Bailey, O'Meley, and even Perry ahead of him at the moment.

Speaking of Perry, did merry old England get the Knights vs. Bulldogs game? If we weren't premiership favourites going into the game, we certainly were after racking up a 46-22 scoreline against the Dogs.

[Zaz]

Perry and Ryles ahead of Fielden? That was like Perry's first good game ever. Hell, I think he even deliberately missed the Sea Eagles game last year to keep away from Leuluai

And Ryles is a cat. Gives away too many penalties and gets carried by Bailey.

[Chris the Human]

ok 3rd victory out of 3 games for the knights but their problem is they are still letting points be scored against them.. 58 points have been scored against the knights in the last 2 games and i dont remember their first games score. but they clearly still have a problem in defence. all another team needs to do is lock down their defence and a victory against the knights is only 80minutes away.sure their attack is hell good but their defence is still B-Grade..

Edited March 25, 2006 by The Misanthrope

[draggx]

Good Win by manly this weekend, sure they scraped fewbut defence held up when they needed it the most

Im Happy as hell to see my beloved broncos pull of a hell of a win

great to see the warriors get their first as well

was annoyed with the Storm VsCowboys result as i honeslty believed storm could of won it comming into the game

[Chris the Human]

Parramatta's inability to put away the grandpa Broncos cost me my perfect round

[IAceI]

I always preferred league. Mainly because theres some twats who always say "Union is much better, League is way too stop and start." that I know, which is a pain considering all your rucks and scrums in Union.

What I do like about Rugby in general is the referee's are badass and despite all rugby players being hard nuts they listen to the guy. Unlike football where they all assrape the referee yet dive constantly because they need to :-\.