Hearts of Iron

[NotoriousGTT]

Just so i dont hijack the GPS thread i thought id start a seperate one for HoI.

Anybody else playing it?

I just got Anthology on Monday and im somewhat confused, there is so much to do and so little help. Ive done all the tutorials etc yet still have a very limited understanding of how things work.

[METALMAN]

It's alright. Probably my least favourite Paradox game though. It's a bit too war driven for my liking.

They're making a sequel now as well.

Edited December 11, 2008 by metalman

[stokeriño]

I can't say I prefer either HoI or Europa Universalis over the other - it just depends on the mood. I'm certainly in a HoI mood at the moment, though I haven't played it since the weekend for various reasons.

As I said before, the learning curve is damn steep, and tutorials rarely help a great deal in games like these.

I'd rather not attempt to explain everything you need to/can do, but if you have specific questions I can certainly try to help...

And metalman: you say HoI is too war-orientated, but war is the best part of their other games like EU. For there's only so much enjoyment you can squeeze out of a) endlessly sending batches of colonists overseas, b) waiting years to gain anything by diplomacy, c) heaven-forbid, running a merchant-orientated game, d) and so on. >_>

Edit:

They're making a sequel now as well.

Yeah, in a year or so. I guess like EU3, HoI3 will be more a matter of tweaking and polishing than any kind of massive shifts in gameplay/scope.

Edited December 11, 2008 by stokeriño

[METALMAN]

Well maybe but it's a lot better when it finally does come along in EU.

And war is the least interesting part of Crusader Kings.

[stokeriño]

I certainly can't agree that war in EU is better than it is in HoI. Given that the majority of EU's battle mechanics revolves around the simple rotatation of 'shock' and 'fire' phases until someone's morale runs out. >_>

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

Hearts of Iron makes my head hurt. Sadly I picked it up while I worked at Gamestation for 99p. Beautiful.

Only played it a couple of times though and felt like I was drowing

[METALMAN]

I certainly can't agree that war in EU is better than it is in HoI. Given that the majority of EU's battle mechanics revolves around the simple rotatation of 'shock' and 'fire' phases until someone's morale runs out. >_>

Yeah I know HoI is generally more complex and there is more to do but it doesn't beat the feeling of waiting around half a century for a war in EU3 and that "here we fucking go" feeling that comes with it.

Oh and Victoria was a game where I'd generally try and avoid war. I remember in my last game as the United Kingdom I was just happily footering around with the government taking turns between Whigs and Tories and later on Liberal and Conservative. The largest wars I'd have would be when I'd pick off the odd underdeveloped Indian, South-East Asian or African state, much like Britain in real life at the time.

To avoid major wars I refused all alliances apart from those with satellite states. Then the newly united Germany and their new friends Austria-Hungary come along and declare war on me and I am fucked.

[stokeriño]

I tried playing Victoria. I failed to be interested by the industry/economy-based gameplay at all.

but it doesn't beat the feeling of waiting around half a century for a war in EU3 and that "here we fucking go" feeling that comes with it.

Believe me, if you start your game in 1936, you get the same feeling. Especially if you're playing as Germany or Russia and you're nervously tapping your fingers: "He's going to declare war...I know he is. Should I do it first and catch him off-guard? But I'm not ready! Just a few more months, just a...oh BALLS, he declared war. Prepare for ultimate pain."

This is only beaten by the moment playing as the British or Americans when, usually circa 1944, Facism has been defeated and Europe carved in two...and you could touch the tension with a knife. All of a sudden, boom: WW3. >_>

[NobBe Nobbs]

Currently, my Swedish empire covers half of Europe, and I've done it all without ever having a war I didn't want to participate in. I'm very proud.

[stokeriño]

Currently, my Swedish empire covers half of Europe, and I've done it all without ever having a war I didn't want to participate in. I'm very proud.

In HoI? I call shenanigans. Sweden sucks too much cock to do that without cheating.

On EU, of course, that's all perfectly possible.

[Toe]

I love playing HoI, being a country like Hungary or Romania, and then conquering the rest of the countries around you before Germany can come while also preparing for the war with Russia that inevitably comes your way.

Also, playing as France and seeing just how awful you infantry is at the start of the game when compared to Germany.

[NotoriousGTT]

So is it recomended i take a larger nation like the UK or Germany etc or should i take a smaller nation (Romania, Turkey etc) and watch whats going on around me?

[cmb211087]

Playing HoI2 at the moment, as Russia.................Finland are a lot stronger than they look!!! Very hard game, don't have a clue what I'm doing to be fair but hey I am enjoying it. 6 more months until Germny decide to invade, my tanks are ready.

[NobBe Nobbs]

Currently, my Swedish empire covers half of Europe, and I've done it all without ever having a war I didn't want to participate in. I'm very proud.

In HoI? I call shenanigans. Sweden sucks too much cock to do that without cheating.

On EU, of course, that's all perfectly possible.

Oh, EU. 2, specifically.

[stokeriño]

I suppose you could pick a small country and just faff about for a while to try and learn some of the basics. Watching what's going on around you won't help very much on account of the fog of war, etc.

Of the big countries, Germany's probably the best one to try first. You get a bunch of 'historical events' which gradually lead you towards war, and even then you get your war experience in piecemeal (i.e. Czechoslovakia first, then Poland, and so on).

Oh, but remember to move troops into the Rhineland early on. I just happened not to once and had already conquered Poland by the time I started to move troops towards France, and all of a sudden got this historical event pop-up "Germany moves troops into the Rhineland", like it was a big deal by 1940, rather that its intended time of 1936. >_>

Playing HoI2 at the moment, as Russia.................Finland are a lot stronger than they look!!! Very hard game, don't have a clue what I'm doing to be fair but hey I am enjoying it. 6 more months until Germny decide to invade, my tanks are ready.

They are indeed.

Conquering tip: You only need to capture the provinces which have 'victory points' to win. (Victory Points or VP being the number inside a star that appears in the info box of an important province. One of the map types also highlights all VP provinces for simplicity's sake.

So with Finland, all of their provinces which have VP are along the southern/western coast, I believe. Obviously you can't just race through towards them with a single army because they'll cut off your supply and encircle you - but you can make these provinces your objectives. Once you've captured these (even if there are other large sections of the country still under Finnish control), you can annex the country outright via the Diplomacy screen.

Oh, and try not to go on the offensive during the winter (sometimes you can't help it, of course, because you can't just sit around doing nothing for 4 or 5 months). If you choose the Weather map and the province is white (meaning 'frozen'), your attacks are either going to be very slow and costly, or they're going to fail outright. Hence the prime offensive time is April - October.

Edited December 11, 2008 by stokeriño

[METALMAN]

I've had so many games where the Soviets take years to get past Finland.

Edited December 11, 2008 by metalman

[stokeriño]

I have to say, the Romanians and Bulgarians are a fickle lot. They switched sides (from the Axis to the Comintern) after barely losing a couple of provinces.

Ah well. Now that the continent has thawed (it's currently May 1940) my advance westwards is going well. I've captured Prague and Vienna, and am probably about a week away from taking Munich. The Germans are defending Berlin like bastards though, as I've had three large armies camped just outside it for months and all assaults have failed. Grrr.

[stokeriño]

Yes, I will bump 7.5 year old threads without remorse (since the alternative of the Steam/PC thread would interrupt the usual Steam Sale kind of talk).

Got myself Hearts of Iron IV last week and have quickly established:

        a) I am still pretty bad at these games

        b) Starting a coup in France is not as fun as it sounds

        c) Trying to force your way across the Danish Great Belt in medium tanks is a Stupid Idea

        d) You can pretty much win the Spanish Civil War single-handed if you send over three volunteer divisions of light tanks

        e) If you turn the 'AI makes historical choices' option off then some highly entertaining stuff can happen

Suffice to say, there are a tonne of dramatic improvements since the last version of HOI I play (which was probably HOI2, although I briefly played HOI3 and just couldn't get started at all). The national focus tree, the construction/production methods and the way you group armies and set them objectives are the main standouts (in the case of the latter, you can literally paint a target line across the map and tell an army of 20+ units to 'aim for that', which is a lifesaver considering all the individual unit micromanagement you used to have to do).

Am currently trying to do something a bit different - after my early attempts as Germany, I started an Italy game but am not going to be joining the Axis. Instead I went for the 'Italy First' route in the National Focus tree and so am now the leader of a new/separate faction called the Novus Imperium Romanum... Just me and Bulgaria in it at the moment, but I should be able to add Nationalist Spain to it soon. Hoping I can at least get a Non-Aggression Pact with Germany so that I can turn all my attention to a war with Britain.

What is a little hilarious though is that a rebellion of Soviet officers has suddenly caused a brand new 'Russia' to declare independence in the Kazakhstan/Caucuses area. A second Russian Civil War? That should be fun to watch.

[JasonM]

I've played some HOI4, and I personally feel it needs a lot more patches before it truly becomes good, because right now the AI is shockingly bad at even the most simple tasks.

- You're practically guaranteed aerial supremacy with only little effort
- Troops don't react to encirclements, naval invasions, or anything other than directly being attacked. I enveloped and overran 50 American divisions when Benito so expertly allowed them to land next to Rome.
- Once you break through a line, you can easily just rush through a bunch of panzer divisions and end Barbarossa in under a year by just encircling and not stopping until you hit Moscow.
- AI Germany is shockingly bad in every way on historical, because they will declare war as long as they have a war goal. So even though Germany was getting pushed back by the Dutch, they still decided to declare on Denmark/Norway, and the Russians too. Needless to say, it didn't go well.
- AI Italy is just as bad if they join the Axis, but at least Benito's incompetence is somewhat realistic.

Additionally there are other annoyances in the game, like production becoming a chore once you get a big army going. Having 5 full lines making just small arms is a chore, and when you hit a new tech it resets the efficiency by half, which makes sense but in general it needs to be cleaned up. It needs to be pruned down to just having one line and being able to select an infinite amount of factories to work on said line, as opposed to just 15 per. Because especially as Germany you never have enough guns, and that means you got 50+ factories working on making just that, and that means just filling up the production page with only gun creation.

^ This shouldn't be a thing in production. Why can't they just let me choose a number of factories, rather than being limited to 15 or less. Because when you have an army of over 3 million souls, it takes a lot of work to put guns in all their hands.

As someone who was utter gash at the previous HOI's, I was able to threaten England with 20 Irish divisions because they barely reacted when I invaded Scotland, and only my own incompetence stopped me from taking over the entire island. With Germany I trucked through Europe, Britain, Africa, and Russia. Not because i'm an elite strategist, but because right now the AI is just plain bad.

But knowing Paradox, they'll fix it... It'll take 2 years for the game to be just right, but they'll fix it.

[METALMAN]

How did you find it? I like the idea apart from all the military strategy. I'm rubbish at that and find it all a bit too much micromanagement. But is there an automation option? I know given the nature of the game that wouldn't leave me with a whole lot to do. :/