Terminator Salvation

[Romero]

Saw it tonight. It was as pretty good continuation of the franchise. My only beef with the film is..

Spoiler: Click here to view

John Connor seems to not recall a single thing that happened to him in the past. He questions the presence of flesh over machine, saying he's never seen anything like it before... Arnold says hi. He seems to have no "insider" information. Shouldn't he have been spilling that eventually the machines will develop a liquid metal compound? He seems to be completely in the dark about what Skynet is capable of, only learning about the company and the war from tapes left by his mother.

[zero]

Spoiler: Click here to view

I think you missed the point of Marcus. It's not that he was flesh over machine, he had organs and believed he was human, that was what Connor had never seen. In the beginning, when they found the plans for the T-800, the troops with him said it was "just like you told us." Obviously they're not at the liquid metal phase yet as Skynet is very primitive in terms of cyborg development. It's 2018 in this movie, which is a ways off from 2029 when Kyle Reese is sent back in time to save Sarah Connor.

I thought the movie was exactly what it needed to be and it finally got that foul taste of T3 out of my mouth. I've heard a lot of negative feedback on it and I honestly don't get it; it's obviously not going to win any Oscars, but it was exactly what I was hoping for out of a Terminator movie set during the war.

[Hellfire]

As I told a friend, the movie was explosion porn. The plot brought the characters from one explosion to another. It did exactly what it was supposed to do though and I thoroughly enjoyed the movie. I hope the next one does a bit more plot wise, without losing all the awesome special effects from this one. As long as you don't go into it expecting it to be an oscar winning movie, you'll have a good time and enjoy it.

[Gabriel]

I heard that there's a severe lack of John Connor in this. Is that true? Because the real reason I was excited was because of Christian Bale.

[thatblindgeye]

Hopefully Ill get to watch this movie soon since Ive always liked the Terminator franchise and hoped that there would be more after T3, but something that Zero said.

Why do people consider T3 to be such a bad film? Personally Ive always enjoyed it. It continued the franchise and it continues the whole plot of the franchise well I thought. You have John Connor thinking hes stopped armageddon/the rise of the machines, he has kind of turned into a useless/lifeless drone, and he needs to get his ass back in shape to save things once again.

Is it the acting that people hated? If so, I can understand why.

[zero]

I heard that there's a severe lack of John Connor in this. Is that true? Because the real reason I was excited was because of Christian Bale.

Yeah, without giving too much away, the movie is way more about Sam Worthington's character than John Connor.

[EndOfAnEra]

There's still good amounts of Bale though.

I really liked the subtle ways they linked the movies together, such as

Spoiler: Click here to view

Kyle Reese using the sawnoff shotgun with the string tied around his arm, Connor using GNR's You Could Be Mine to attract a Terminator, how he gains access to a room using the swipe card similar to the ATM, how John got the scars they showed him having in the future in T2. There were lots of cool little touches, and the writers definately paid attention.

I thought this was great. My girlfriend, who doesn't even follow Terminator, loved this movie as well. I'm not getting the hate on this film. Really well done, both from the perspective of a fanboy and a filmgoer.

Edited May 23, 2009 by EndOfAnEra

[StevenRichardsRules]

It was pretty awesome.

[mattman1624]

I really loved the continuity and relationship to the previous films, as well. This movie was well done, and I hope we do get more.

[Mysterio2000X]

I heard that there's a severe lack of John Connor in this. Is that true? Because the real reason I was excited was because of Christian Bale.

Yeah, without giving too much away, the movie is way more about Sam Worthington's character than John Connor.

Which really isn't a bad thing. The John Connor character is pretty blah, really, and Bale himself wasn't really on point, so I'm glad the entire movie didn't revolve around him. Especially since they got a pretty great supporting cast for this flick, with Anton Yelchin, Moon Bloodgood and Worthington all turning in very, very good performances that definitely carry the flick, and help make it more than just your run-of-the-mill summer fare.

Don't go in expecting an instant classic or anything, or you'll be thoroughly disappointed. It IS a very good, very entertaining movie, though, and definitely a great way to start up another trilogy (that's the plan, isn't it?). A lot of the long shots McG threw in reminded me of Children of Men, which is not a bad thing at all, either.

My favorite part definitely has got to be the machine designs, though. The 'bots, especially the T-600's, just look, feel, and sound massive, and they're down-right frightening.. Zero said the movie wouldn't be picking up any Oscars, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it pick up some awards for the sound, though I'm sure he was talking more about performance-awards.

That being said, is the movie really 2 hours long? Seriously, is it? I've seen it twice now, and both times time seemed to just fly by.

[EndOfAnEra]

They did a great job of making the T-600's look out-dated, didn't they? My one complaint was the lack of the main Terminator theme.

[zero]

The John Connor character is pretty blah, really, and Bale himself wasn't really on point,

I think that's supposed to be the point:

MAJOR ENDING SPOILER

Spoiler: Click here to view

Hence the ending with Marcus giving him his heart... a machine helps John find his humanity. Remember, this isn't John Connor, hero of the resistance in 2029, this is only his beginning. He's lost, confused and his only guidance are the words of his mother. Of course, then we get into the craziness of time travel where the question of "did 2029 Connor who sent back Kyle Reese, always have the information that his mother gave him?" has to be asked.

[Mysterio2000X]

The John Connor character is pretty blah, really, and Bale himself wasn't really on point,

I think that's supposed to be the point:

MAJOR ENDING SPOILER

Spoiler: Click here to view

Hence the ending with Marcus giving him his heart... a machine helps John find his humanity. Remember, this isn't John Connor, hero of the resistance in 2029, this is only his beginning. He's lost, confused and his only guidance are the words of his mother. Of course, then we get into the craziness of time travel where the question of "did 2029 Connor who sent back Kyle Reese, always have the information that his mother gave him?" has to be asked.

Or it's possible that "prodigal son who will save human race" just isn't that good of a character to write or work with. I get what you're saying, but they seemed to make a pretty big point of showing Connor as being just a bit more human and compassionate than his superiors throughout the film, so I'm really going to have to disagree with you here.

Spoiler: Click here to view

And wasn't that ending some thrown together one that was hatched up once the original (John dying, and his skin being grafted onto Marcus's body or something) was spoiled?

[caucasianheat]

I was really amped to see this for about a month, went on opening night and was let down. Spoilered partly because it spoils the movie and partly because people probably don't want to read all the long-winded reasons that this just didn't do it for me.

Spoiler: Click here to view

There's a real lack of interesting characters and a good chunk of that falls on the writing. Kate Connor is, for whatever reason, largely irrelevant but still around constantly. She does the surgery and sets up "I'll be back" and I think that pretty much covers her contribution. Bloodgood's character is there for action scenes and that's fine, but there's exactly fuck-all in the writing that makes me care about how she fares in those scenes and her performance does little to help. I literally know nothing about the character Common plays other than what is readily apparent: he's in the resistance and follows Connor. That's really not compelling, so why bother including this character? Helena Bonham Carter's character is the closest thing to a real antagonist in the movie and she has exactly two scenes. That's such a huge fundamental problem and surprising given that the first two Terminator movies function on the strength of great antagonist characters.

Connor's status as a polarizing force in what's left of the human race is only really alluded to and never shown until he uses that power to stop the attacks on Skynet. The beginning of the movie tells us in text that some people don't like John Connor, but we never really see it until much later. You'd think that kind of conflict would manifest itself more, but it doesn't. Again, that's bad writing.

The evil plot of programming Marcus to lure John Connor to Skynet by holding Kyle Reese as bait is really convoluted and poorly thought-out. By seeking out and holding Reese specifically, it's clear that Skynet knows why he is important. So why not just try to kill him straight away and theoretically be done with John Connor?

Aside from a moment between Reese and Connor, the final scene sucks. The idea of Wright just sort of giving up his heart on a whim and John Connor accepting happens in about two minutes flat. This could have been something that drove a large part of the film, but it's addressed and resolved in basically the same breath. It's also bad characterization when the guy we've been made to sympathize with as a human being willingly gives up his life without emotion. Furthermore, it's equally bad that the man interested in preserving the human race would allow it to happen and deny the resistance a potentially important weapon. I understand the symbolism of Connor restarting Wright's heart after he's crushed by the T-800 and Wright returning the favour, but it just doesn't seem to fit even still.

Not all of the failings of character can be pinned to the writers. I thought some of the performances were straight-up bad. Moon Bloodgood, Helena Bonham Carter, Common and the guy playing General Ashdown were all pretty wooden and unconvincing.

I'm not going to be a dick and say there's nothing redeemable about this movie. I think they had some great stuff in place and more than anything, I'm disappointed it didn't come together well and meet the hype. The production - both sound and visuals - is unreal and probably worth an industry award. CG Arnold got a real buzz in the theatre and had me going for a very exciting split second. A lot of the action scenes are very well-put together. Anton Yelchin as Kyle Reese is brilliant casting and he's easily the star of the film and maybe the only character I was interested in seeing more of when I left the theatre. Sam Worthington I thought brought it for the most part and did his best with some pretty poor dialogue (particularly the opening scene).

I don't think they achieved the goal of rebooting the franchise, as I don't see this movie as being remotely better than the very underrated Rise of the Machines. I'd say giving someone else the reins for directing and writing the next Terminator is a must, as the biggest problems with this film overall were with the story and pacing.

Edited May 25, 2009 by caucasianheat

[Mysterio2000X]

http://chud.com/articles/articles/19577/1/...TION/Page1.html

Massive spoilers, but there's an article on what the original script for the movie looked like. It's.. interesting, to say the least, especially the third act, but I'm fairly certain the Skynet City part wouldn't of worked in any way, shape or form. The best possible movie that this could have been would be one that combined elements from both the original script, and the finished product (obviously?), but that likely would've pushed the running time to some TDK levels, and I'm not sure the studios were looking for that.

[Hellfire]

Jesus Christ, that seems terrible. I mean really...terminator landscapers? Terminators should be doing only one thing and that is fucking up people, not pulling weeds and mowing grass. The Skynet city being a real city just boggles the mind too. How are they supposed to make Skynet, who wanted to destroy everyone and dropped a fuckload of nukes, into an organization that wants to save mankind. I'm just amazed. Maybe next time they will hire people that aren't fucking retarded and have actually watched a terminator movie to write the script.

[EndOfAnEra]

Spoiler: Click here to view

And wasn't that ending some thrown together one that was hatched up once the original (John dying, and his skin being grafted onto Marcus's body or something) was spoiled?

Everything I've seen has pointed to that supposed ending as being a lie.

*edit* after reading that posted article though, now I'm not so sure. Whatever. I thought it was stellar, and most of the response I've heard has been strongly positive.

Edited May 26, 2009 by EndOfAnEra

[wolves]

I saw the movie yesterday and quite enjoyed it. While it's a far cry from the noir like influence of the first one and the sheer awesomeness of the second one, it holds it's own as a solid film. One thing I did like is how different it was from the others. The first was basically a hunter/hunted type deal, the second was a race to change the future, the third was... well a generic action movie, and this one was a war movie. You get the feeling of giants against man quite well with how they did the Terminator's in this film. The action sequences were absolutely stunning, no doubt about it. The CGI was fantastic to boot. A very good movie that doesn't try to be more than what it is. It's a good set up to what should be (hopefully) an excellent fifth movie. I was reading about what "McG" (what a goddamn stupid name for a movie director) wants to do with the next movie and it seems to be pretty solid.

On a side note, when I was on the wikipedia page for the movie looking up what other movies the cast were in, someone edited in that Bruce Lee via CGI will be the bad guy in the next film. If only...

I'm now off to watch the first three movies over again.

[noblefreakv2]

I have definitely got to see this now. With all the whining I saw regarding T3, I still enjoyed it.

[Herr Matzat]

it's obviously not going to win any Oscars, but it was exactly what I was hoping for out of a Terminator movie set during the war.

Well, the good Terminator Movie did win Oscars so obviusly you were expecting less than what you had already seen. :-p

I think this movie is a realy sad way of milking monney of a franchise. Timetraveling always brings porblems... but the first two movies dealed good to very good with it...T3 only had nice action and pritty much redid the second movie with some continuety problems... salvation is just a big clusterfuck wen it comes to the story. action was ok, nothing to special, nothing iéd recomend spending 6-7€ on.