2010/2011 NBA Thread

[sahyder1]

LOL. Keep buying the hype, sahyder. You'll get yourself a job on ESPN with that shit.

If he cared about winning, he'd have gone to Chicago or the Clippers. MIAMI DOES NOT HAVE A ROSTER. They have FIVE players under contract, one of whom is unlikely to be there next year (Beasley). Miami CANNOT build a roster that will win a championship. Shaq's not coming, that bridge is burned. Chris Paul's not going there, they can't afford him. This team will have NO bench, NO inside presence, and will NOT get out of the East. A bunch of vet minimum dudes, two of the top five players in the league, and Chris Bosh.

Sound and fury meaning nothing. Excuse me if I'm not excited that Cleveland has been destroyed as a franchise and Toronto has been shut down again. The only team that came out of this that has truly done anything smart is New York, who improved, and didn't break their shit to do it. Chicago got better as well.

Where did the Knicks improve? Just swapping for Amare for Lee does them no good. Yes, the Bulls have a better bench right now but count on guys taking minimum money for a year. Who said the system isn't broken. I've been saying that for year. That is nothing new. The system was broken when Kobe worked a deal out of Charlotte too. System was broken when Francis didn't play in Vancouver or when Billups worked a trade out of Toronto.

We can all sit back and laugh at the possibility of CP3 playing there for less than the max but none of us thought these 3 would get together either. They'll fill up a good enough bench. This isn't 3 washed up guys getting together. I'm not saying they'll win the next 5 titles but people said the same thing about the Celtics bench and that was an older team.

[Fait Accompli]

Isn't that how the NBA has been in the last like...30 years since the expansion of the league? I mean it's always been a 4-8 team race to see who would win the championship as only 8 teams in the last 30 years have won the title. There's not parody in this league and there probably won't ever be any parody until the owners and the players decide to structure it like the NFL so that teams can have a legit chance at winning.

I'm usually not one to rip someone's spelling but I think it's awesome you talked about how this league has no parody, when that's exactly what it is becoming, a cheap knock off of a professional league. Parity isn't part of the NBA, but there have been a lot of teams that contended for a title in the '90s even though they didn't win one (Ewing's Knicks, 'Zo's Heat, Miller's Pacers, Stockton/Malone's Jazz, Barkley's Suns, etc). Now we're talking about Conferences that only go 2 or 3 deep at most and we're dangerously close to the majority of the league being farm clubs for LA, Boston etc. In a few years what are the odd that John Wall leaves Washington and decides to go play with LeBron or someone like that?

If we're being honest? I think that if they're in the same boat they've been in for the last few years (meaning they're out of the playoff picture by January), then yeah, I fully expect John Wall to bolt to somewhere much more attractive than Washington. As it stands, Washington is in rebuild mode after having a team that for the last 5-7 years was criminally underachieving and a star that was overpaid for only playing one regular season's worth of games over the last 3-4 years. John Wall might bring them improvment, he might not; all we know is that he's got the potential to be something good.

Edit: And the teams that went all in for this summer knew that this was an all or nothing gambit that they were undertaking when it came to trying to get any one of these three guys. The gutting of Cleveland and Toronto was something to be expected, especially after LeBron didn't win the title two years straight. It was one of those consequeneces (or in this case, occupational hazard) that came with the whole Summer of 2010 free agent frenzy.

Edited July 9, 2010 by Fait Accompli

[Colossus]

The things some of you guys say "wow" me. I think we just saw what can happen when 3 of the league's best players unite... hello anyone remember Boston? People were saying the same thing about the Celtics as they acquired their big 3... and look what they were able to do. And those 3 guys were all in their 30's by the time they got together, none of these 3 guys have even hit 29 yet! If you don't think there are going to be vets lining up to play for these guys. Hell, they might even be able to convince Allen Iverson to swallow his pride and join the team. That's probably a longshot, but I'm willing to bet he can get his act together to play and produce behind those guys. I know he's stunk in his past few situations, but all those were doomed to fail from the beginning.

You can book the Heat now for the 2011 NBA Championship. Probably 2012, and 2013 as well.

No, you cannot. How in the world are they gonna defend the Magic? Or the Celtics? Or the Lakers? Or the Thunder? Or the Mavs? Or, hell, even the Bulls.

The Heat are NOT going to win next year.

[naiwf]

I hate to be East Coast DMN, but Lakers vs Heat looks like this to me

Bosh/Wade - Gasol/Kobe is a push at best, if not an edge to LA since Bosh has never won a playoff series.

LeBron will get his against whoever LA puts in his path, but who on Miami is going to guard Artest/Odom/Bynum?

LA will have an edge at the point and every spot on the bench.

Honestly that looks like a 5 game series, 6 if everything goes Miami's way since "the big 3" will have to play 40+ minutes a night to keep that team in the mix in the postseason.

My whole thing with Wall is that if he sees the writing on the wall, he bolts from Washington ASAP and hooks up with Miami or OKC in a few years. That's the only way he'll be able to win a title in the current system.

[SeanB]

Defend the Magic? Who on the Orlando Magic draws multiple defenders? Dwight no post moves Howard? They'll get a big to throw on him. You act like Wade and LeBron aren't all NBA defenders, they are(Wade was 2nd team, LeBron was 1st team). They'll probably play the best perimeter defense of any team in the league. The Celtics are old... I'm surprise they were able to even make a run this year. They were not the best team in the East.

Are we seriously gonna even consider teams like The Mavs or Bulls? Who scares you on their roster other then Dirk or D. Rose? No one.

The only... and I mean only team standing in Miami's way next season are the reigning NBA Champions. You watch next June... we'll be in South Beach for the Finals.

You seriously just asked how they were gonna defend the Mavs. LMAO. You'd been better off just stopping at The Thunder.

[SeanB]

Bosh/Wade - Gasol/Kobe is a push at best, if not an edge to LA since Bosh has never won a playoff series.

Since you wanna go there... remember Gasol had never even won a playoff GAME until hooking up with Kobe. Look it up... he got swept in 3 consecutive series from 2004-06.

[Colossus]

Yeah, how are they gonna defend the Mavs? The only thing I see is moving Bosh to the 3 point line, to guard Dirk

And yes, LeBron and Wase are all NBA defenders, but you need a CENTER to stop D12. You are not going to stop him with Bosh or Beasley, that's for sure...

[DMN in the House]

I agree the system is broken, even if my team has benefited from it. Though, the Lakers have traditionally been built through the draft. Kobe getting out of Charlotte wasn't on him, it was on LA. That was nothing like this. The Gasol thing was because of Jerry West, and no one can say different. Shaq was a legit signing. None of that was like this.

This team will not win a title, barring injury/implosion to LA, Orlando, OKC, Boston, Chicago. It's a three man team, three very good to great players, but no matter who decides to coat-tail, they aren't going to have the bench, or inside presence to get it done.

Its a big story, and rightfully so, but they aren't anything more than a contender, and they're not even close to being the best team in the league.

I haven't even got started on how this absolutely destroys LeBron's legacy. GOAT? He came to Dwayne Wade's team, not the other way around.

[sahyder1]

How great was LeBron's legacy going to look staying in Cleveland and not winning? Who cares where he went....he's still a top 3-5 guy in the league.

Kobe getting out of Charlotte wasn't on him

Really? Him refusing to play in Charlotte wasn't on him?

As for the Gasol trade, wasn't West still in charge in Memphis at the time and gift wrapped him to LA?

Edited July 9, 2010 by sahyder1

[naiwf]

Bosh/Wade - Gasol/Kobe is a push at best, if not an edge to LA since Bosh has never won a playoff series.

Since you wanna go there... remember Gasol had never even won a playoff GAME until hooking up with Kobe. Look it up... he got swept in 3 consecutive series from 2004-06.

Right, but it took them more than a season to get it done as Boston whooped that ass in year one of their partnership. If Miami and LA meet this year, I'd expect Miami to run into a brick wall and then possibly contend in 2012 when they may be able to make some other moves.

[DMN in the House]

I don't remember him refusing to play in Charlotte, but that's probably because I was 14 at the time, and that was a lifetime ago. Still, you can't blame LA for that, unless you believe they orchestrated the move.

Also, I said that the Gasol trade was all West. It wasn't as lopsided as some try to make it out to be, but it was pretty bad.

Nothing like this. If three owners had gotten together, the Players' Union would be crying bloody murder. I guess what's good for the goose isn't good for the gander.

As for LeBron, if he cared about his legacy, or about being the GOAT, he'd have either stayed in Cleveland, or gone to New York. Traditionally, the top stars in the NBA don't change teams. Off the top of my head, the only ones I can really think of are Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Bird, Magic, Jordan, Kobe, Russell, Dr. J. They all stayed in one place, made it there. LeBron could have done that. Winning a title in Cleveland would have meant SO much more than 'selling out' to go to Miami. Same in New York. James would have been the biggest star in the world. He could have rivaled Jordan. Turn the Knicks around and he becomes a fucking icon. And not one of those bullshit ones, a real one. Jordan, Magic, Bird, Russell.

In Miami, he'll never be 'the guy'. Dwayne Wade is 'the guy'. LeBron James is second fiddle. They could win the next ten championships, and Wade would always have one more. Ah well, so much for being 'The King'.

Also, the difference between Boston's 'Big Three' and Miami is that Boston already had roleplayers and a bench. They had a team, and there was no stand-out team in the league at that point. LA wasn't what they are now. The situations are completely different. Miami has nothing outside the 'Big 3 deux'.

[naiwf]

Just saw this on FB and thought it was funny as people were referencing LeBron's lack of humility, "He needs the Iron Shiek to break his back and make him humble."

I was just flipping through ESPN and saw where LeBron said he was going to "lead Miami to a 2nd title". Wade might want to get the memo that Miami is now LeBron's team, because I'm pretty sure he thinks it's his.

[sahyder1]

I don't remember him refusing to play in Charlotte, but that's probably because I was 14 at the time, and that was a lifetime ago. Still, you can't blame LA for that, unless you believe they orchestrated the move.

He refused to play in Charlotte. All pro leagues need to address this. You can go play where you want when you are a free agent but you play where you are drafted. Don't like it, tough. Sit at home. This would obviously go hand in hand with a rookie pay scale.

In Miami, he'll never be 'the guy'. Dwayne Wade is 'the guy'. LeBron James is second fiddle

No, he won't be second fiddle. They'll be 1 and 1A. Each will have their share of games where they will take over. LeBron's merchandise will still sell like crazy.Tees are already available and probably area already selling like crazy.

Miami has nothing outside the 'Big 3 deux'.

Last I checked it was also July 8th. Guys WILL come play for the minimum and play.

Nothing like this. If three owners had gotten together, the Players' Union would be crying bloody murder. I guess what's good for the goose isn't good for the gander.

There's a big difference between 3-4 guys agreeing to take less money to play together and 3-4 owners low balling players in order to control salaries.

Just saw this on FB and thought it was funny as people were referencing LeBron's lack of humility, "He needs the Iron Shiek to break his back and make him humble."

I was just flipping through ESPN and saw where LeBron said he was going to "lead Miami to a 2nd title". Wade might want to get the memo that Miami is now LeBron's team, because I'm pretty sure he thinks it's his.

He was more then fair to Wade and Bosh during the interview. He said they would ride the hot hand on a given night. He said it's just not about them 3 either and said others who would need to step up.

By the way I love Dan Gilbert's open letter.

[Guest JukeboxHero]

As a Cavs fan living in Cleveland, I'm gutted. Basically, it sucks.

I see why he's going there, but I can't help but feel betrayed.

But in the 7 years he's been in Cleveland, we've won no championships. However, 7 other teams didn't have LeBron and managed to win rings. Perhaps you don't NEED LeBron to win a championship.

I love Dan Gilbert's open letter as well. Best thing I've read all week.

[Blaze09]

This is past the nWo now, the Miami Heat are the IWA-MS of the NBA. DRINK THE KOOL-AID WHILE YOU CAN!!!

I think it's safe to say they won't beat the Lakers this year barring injuries, OKC is gonna sneak up on them once or twice, and someone is gonna come out of nowhere to win the title (it's about due time for that to happen again). So we are looking at 1-2 titles tops out the group, and LeBron rewrites his legacy in the process (because he can't be talked in the same breath as MJ or Kobe or even Isiah, because they were the man on thier team, while he went to Miami screaming HELP bascially.

[Fait Accompli]

Reading Dan Gilbert's letter and seeing the reactions of people who believe LeBron did Cleveland dirty made me think of something: Professional sports is a business, and LeBron treated it as such. Could he have gone about announcing his destination in a better way? Of course, but I think that was partly ESPN's doing to have the hour-long special to grandstand before the announcement. Gilbert had the man for 7 years and put around him a team that was overachieving in 2007 when they made the Finals and ultimately got swept, and in the last two years was a bonafide beast in the regular season that wasn't good enough for the playoffs (an aging Shaq, Mo Williams, Delonte West, and Antawn Jamison does not constitute a team that would be a threat to go deep in the playoffs against the likes of Orlando, Boston, and the Lakers). And just like in any other business, you look at what is beneficial to you and your family in your career. Now, I'm not a staunch LeBron fan - I think he's a pretty good player who still needs to prove himself - but I think he upgraded himself by going to Miami as opposed to staying in Cleveland. He would've been in a better position if he went to Chicago but, eh...what can ya do?

[sahyder1]

I love how people love to ignore the business aspect of this when their teams lose a star or don't end up with a star. Sports are a business. Cavaliers fans would have been celebrating if they had signed Bosh. They lose their guy so they want to moan and groan about "loyalty."

Naiwf, you seriously want to tell me right now that you didn't want LeBron to sign with your Knicks? Did you have the same reaction when Mets made move for Santana? For Beltran? For Delgado? Piazza?

[maninblack]

I love how people love to ignore the business aspect of this when their teams lose a star or don't end up with a star. Sports are a business. Cavaliers fans would have been celebrating if they had signed Bosh. They lose their guy so they want to moan and groan about "loyalty."

Can't be helped, to a point. James was a native son, and the biggest athlete they had. Couple that with Cleveland's dire run at trying to win a sports title, and they get a sympathy pop.

[naiwf]

I love how people love to ignore the business aspect of this when their teams lose a star or don't end up with a star. Sports are a business. Cavaliers fans would have been celebrating if they had signed Bosh. They lose their guy so they want to moan and groan about "loyalty."

Naiwf, you seriously want to tell me right now that you didn't want LeBron to sign with your Knicks? Did you have the same reaction when Mets made move for Santana? For Beltran? For Delgado? Piazza?

Yes, I despise Cabron James and wouldn't root for any team he's on. On the other hand, I liked all of those guys who ended up playing for the Mets before they got here. I never wanted A-Rod on the Mets and would have shitted on that signing had it ever happened. I'd rather not win with a team I can't stand, which is why I've never rooted for the Yankees even though I went to more Yankees game as a kid because my relatives preferred them to the Mets.

I've been a D-Wade fan since his final season at Marquette and was ecstatic when he won the title in '06, and now I hope his team dies in a fire. Shit happens.

EDIT: Beasley's apparently going to the T-Wolves for a 2nd round draft pick next year. In other words, he was tossed aside for cap space.

Edited July 9, 2010 by naiwf

[Toe]

Sad to see Bosh go, but it will be fun to watch if Colangelo can build the Raptors up without him. I feel like this draft was a good start.