League of Legends Thread

[Ruki]

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1802415751/211824965?tab=builds

This was a bit lopsided.

...why the hell did Wukong build a Spirit Visage against you?

Hai has stepped down from Cloud 9.

I'm an emotional wreck

Ehh, I expected it. After C9 faltered this season (even though they finished 2nd...their regular season was hit or miss) and his injuries, I figured it was only a matter of time.

[gunnar hendershow]

Wukong and Lissandra lane swapped actually so I was against her. It was a rough matchup and she killed me twice early despite me playing passively. After getting Sunfire Cape since its passive is OP on Garen I rushed Merc Treads and shortly thereafter laning ended.

But let's discuss them going for Baron. We baited them onto it, realized we were gonna lose the fight and ran into our jungle. They immediately start going for Baron, so we drop a couple wards and charge in once their health has dropped a bunch. I'm at full health for this btw. Easiest quadra in my entire time playing League. I hadn't even bought Brutalizer yet!

[Plubby]

I actually disagree with first build Sunfire Cape against that comp >_< It was an interesting choice.

[gunnar hendershow]

Down in cs? Sunfire Cape first always. I was down to a Lissandra, ranged champs have field days with Garen early so I had to play it very safe. The Sunfire Cape snowballed me as soon as I got it.

Anyway, another wacky game tonight. We had lost all 3 inhibitors when suddenly a power outage struck and saved our asses.

[Plubby]

That can't be right. Sunfire doesn't help you down to a Liss - It just means she has to wait for one more cooldown - and you'll be skirmishing/outright teamfighting soon and Garen sticks to the threats in this comp not well, they're too mobile. Vayne in particular kites you for days. I'd have considered Randuins or even Thornmail if you needed armour.

A first build Spirit Visage means you can go into lane, freeze it, retreat into brush or whatever, then it boosts your passive. It seems much better against your direct lane opponent and much more synergistic with your kit in the context of the opponents you had.

[Plubby]

Oh my god support Kennen is fun...

[Ruki]

Oh my god support Kennen is fun...

I tried it once. It was unpleasant for me.

But! I'm a badass as Irelia. About 44lp in Silver 1. I've almost achieved the dream. And I think I've started to get good with Smite/TP Shyvana top.

[Plubby]

Who was your ADC? I got Kalista, and ulti-into-ulti is almost always a double kill. We crushed our lane We had five kills by about 10 or 12 mins, all onto Kalista. Much fed, many wow.

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/OC1/87519301/201042280?tab=overview

[Ruki]

Can't remember. I just kept getting chunked down, gave up first blood.

[gunnar hendershow]

Kennen support typically only excels with a Kalista. She plays to his strengths super well.

That can't be right. Sunfire doesn't help you down to a Liss - It just means she has to wait for one more cooldown - and you'll be skirmishing/outright teamfighting soon and Garen sticks to the threats in this comp not well, they're too mobile. Vayne in particular kites you for days. I'd have considered Randuins or even Thornmail if you needed armour.

A first build Spirit Visage means you can go into lane, freeze it, retreat into brush or whatever, then it boosts your passive. It seems much better against your direct lane opponent and much more synergistic with your kit in the context of the opponents you had.

Here's why you build Sunfire on Garen if you're not at like Diamond, opponents are going to lay off of you when you charge in with E giving you an entire free minion wave because of Sunfire's passive. As soon as they go in you just Q, retreat and farm again on their cooldowns. It's how I turned my lane around. The worst part of overthinking your build at lower elo (where we all are) is nobody has the skill to actually make the most of it. It's better to take the stuff you know works instead of trusting all your teammates and opponents to be at a certain level where you need to tailor your builds exactly to them. I'm a bigger fan of Spirit Visage as well but we rush it when my opponent isn't good enough and I can get free farm and then 5 minutes later destroy? The worst teammates are the ones who always think they're "one step ahead" in their build when their skills aren't there for it. I try not to be that guy. Getting the farm on Garen is huge when you're down early, in fact if you can't get it you won't get anywhere. That's why it's recommended to build Sunfire first in so many builds. I don't play at a level where I need to tailor my build except in extreme circumstances, so I don't usually bother.

Of course against a heavy AD comp I'll build Thornmail but the passive isn't worth it unless I'm against that. Players typically don't have the skill where I need to worry about kiting. Gold and below in NA is virtually the same until you hit the very bottom barrel of Bronze. You move up typically by having better mechanics than I do, not by smarter builds. So I'm stuck here forever .

[Plubby]

Here's why you build Sunfire on Garen if you're not at like Diamond, opponents are going to lay off of you when you charge in with E giving you an entire free minion wave because of Sunfire's passive.

Not true. Her W is a hard counter to your E if you're using it to push your opponent out of lane. So long as she's standing in the right spot in the first place, she doesn't even have to move.

As soon as they go in you just Q, retreat and farm again on their cooldowns.

Lissandra's Q is the shortest cooldown of the two champions and harrasses you out of lane, even when you're behind your minion wave. Add in that her passive grants her natural sustain to farm with said Q.

The worst part of overthinking your build at lower elo (where we all are) is nobody has the skill to actually make the most of it. It's better to take the stuff you know works instead of trusting all your teammates and opponents to be at a certain level where you need to tailor your builds exactly to them.

I'm not asking you to tailor your build so that you can tank the AP carry only and then you count on someone else to tank the ADC, that requires coordination that doesn't happen in SoloQ. I just think that if you're still in laning phase vs Lissandra you should get some relevant tank stats. No Lissandra who has played this matchup more than once is going to back off once you activate E. They just counter with their W, and get out of range. They don't have to withdraw from the wave entirely, they just kite back to auto-attack range (which is actually quite long) Further, You completed the cape really late in the laning phase and as I said Garen can't stick to anyone on this team. Liss can W you, Fiddle can fear you, Wukong can decoy and Vayne can tumble and stealth. Nautilus WANTS you on him. I mean, I get your point about your mechanics so if the Lissandra can't even "press W" then I guess this whole thing is a moot point.

It's how I turned my lane around.

You need to have another look at all the data from this game because the sunfire cape did not turn the lane around. In fact you lose ground after finishing it.

Of course against a heavy AD comp I'll build Thornmail but the passive isn't worth it unless I'm against that. Players typically don't have the skill where I need to worry about kiting. Gold and below in NA is virtually the same until you hit the very bottom barrel of Bronze. You move up typically by having better mechanics than I do, not by smarter builds. So I'm stuck here forever .

I mostly agree with this but just on it as a general point: Thornmail oftentimes doesn't help against heavy AD comps. For instance if you're against Graves ADC/Zed midlane then it's much worse than Randuins. I really love Frozen Heart as an armour item actually but obviously that's bad on Garen specifically, just commenting that it's my favourite armour item.

In terms of improving via mechanics - yes you're right, that if you have the mechanics you can get into plat/diamond playing AP Zed or whatever (or something equally ludicrous) but as you noted, none of us do. I think...one of us is close to plat? Dan? I just find that in my experience in NA, EUW and OCE (i've only ranked in OCE but played in all of them) that unless there's a vast gulf in mechanics in your individual game then the easiest way to turn fights around is to make things hardest for your opponent.

Incidentally I op.gg'd you just to see out of curiosity and saw that you were in-game on Garen as I was typing so I spectated you and did a recording. That game was precisely when i'd build Sunfire first. Also I feel bad because your Xerath that game was awful And I really liked your flash-R onto Riven. Pity the rest of your team couldn't clean that fight up.

[gunnar hendershow]

In the Garen game I was just hanging out under my tower because I couldn't really venture out against Lissandra, so that's why I got Bami's Cinder and then Sunfire CApe. I would at least get some extra gold out of my situation, which was basically my point in building it. I wanted to stack up the gold for later in the game. I concede towers a lot since my mechanics aren't the best but I make sure to use it to get as much cs as I can during it.

That game was sad, I got no help against Riven early who was a very good player in her own right. Just about everyone was outmatched a bit. The next game was fun we crushed them since Nasus felt like sitting up top and farming his stacks to 500 basically granting us a 4v5. Oh Nasus players, will you ever learn?

Frozen Heart is my favorite armor item in the game, I build it so many opportunities. It's my go-to "okay gonna need some armor here" item. You're right there are certain champs not to build Thornmail against, but against most AD dominant comps I'll have that and Randuins together so I don't usually have to decide between the two.

[Plubby]

I watched and did a voice recording for that game too

You got a nice early lead on that Vayne. You were actually down on gold the whole game but through objective control you managed to get first inhib and then you got a really nice fight into a baron. That was basically game after that.

[Ruki]

One win away until I am in a series for gold.

[Ruki]

Two games so far today...

1st: Top lane Vlad against Kayle. I do well enough in lane (I even get a quad), but we can't transition it into late game and get demolished.

2nd: I am TERRIBLE. One of the worst games I've played in months. I'm Sona and I give up first blood to Graves/Leona. Then I die a second time. And then a third, and I start to tilt. By about 15-20 minutes I've died 5-6 times, most on the team. Thankfully, my team didn't rag on me, at all. I altered my build to get a bit tanky (Frozen Heart), won a few key team fights and ended the game 0-6-16, and they surrendered. Putting me in a series for Gold.

[Ruki]

First promo game is not going well.

[Ruki]

2-2.

Last game isn't looking good. Almost had hope too.

Well....fuck that last game. Mid got camped hard, our jungle wasn't doing too well early and their Nid was a BITCH.

Good thing we managed to come together and win

I also just beat a diamond V in lane...wtf?

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1805066568/202665528?tab=overview

oPayne was their name.

[Plubby]

I have scored one of these sweet, sweet Faker hats! (a red one)

I'm super-excited

[Plubby]

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/OC1/87892309/201042280?tab=overview

KASSADIN VERY BALANCED CHAMPION.

[Ruki]

At lower levels, when people don't know how to play against him? Yeah, he rolls over enemy teams.

I'm just glad they went back on the mega nerf they did to his R.