Maynard Finds Jesus?

[thatshortguy]

Because when a guy like Maynard sings very intelligent songs about how religion is bullshit and he speaks very intelligently about the same thing, but then goes and "finds Jesus" it's very depressing to people like myself who agree that religion is bullshit. So yes I would lose respect for him because he became a Christian just like I would lose respect for any of my friends who suddenly become jesus-freaks.  Would I hate them?  No.  Would I refuse to see them ever again?  No.  Just like if this is true and Maynard continues to play with Tool or APC, I probably won't stop listening.

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I didn't really need the proof, but you are just as intelligent as I thought you were. Tool stood for something. They stood for the abstract, and still do. The idea that maybe the preconcieved notions of the worlds *aren't* the "correct" way to think...or even that there is a correct way to think. I'm not saying Maynard is a bad person if he becomes a devout Christian...but I will view his work with a much more cynical eye.

I always thought a song like Judith was explicitly about religion.

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As stated on the APC DVD during the commentary for the video, Maynard talks about how "Judith" was about how his mother could remain so faithful while she suffered through what ultimately became her last days. Maynard wondered how she could stay so dedicated to the God that was allowing her to remain in pain.

[EndOfAnEra]

First, that's a really common shirt for Anti-Bush people. And second, that doesn't really have anything to do with arrogance. But I suppose it's your perception of how he speaks and the stuff like that, that would lead you to believe he's arrogant or something.

[Lowerdeck]

I wonder how one would find God. Like if all of a sudden they think "Hey...God's cool." And you'd think the people close to him would notice a change in his attitude/actions if it wasn't an all of a sudden deal.

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Yeah, generally God would come along and bring the presence of His spirit into an individual. And from there, they choose to live their lives for Christ or not.

Those last couple sentences may be hard for some people to believe. But honestly, that's what I believe.

I've always believed in God. Considered myself saved, not really in close relationship with God. And very recently, I believe I was told by God to come back. To church, to the faith. Stop living in the insanity of the world around me, pretending to be and doing what I shouldn't. Led to a church, then an empty parking lot 15-20 miles away in Brewster, New York - asking for forgiveness. </tangent>

Why say that last paragraph here? God works in strange ways. Some of you may not want to believe this report for whatever reasons. If MJK did get saved, I'd be all happy for him. For those of you pissed with Keenan's decision, enjoy the music he's already put out and just be happy with the fact he's happy.

[Pepsi]

Never said I wasn't going to still listen Tool or APC cd's. Look at the flip side, let's say there's a famous priest who has gotten famous for preaching the word of god, blah blah blah. Suddenly he comes out denouncing his faith and basically saying that he's discovered there truely is no god. There would be an uproar from the religious right. They'd basically smear his name like crazy.

But when someone who has spent their career saying how bad religion is to suddenly find god, you ask us to just simply accept this as the "fact he's happy."

Did I mention I really hope this is a joke?

[Underage Politician]

Because when a guy like Maynard sings very intelligent songs about how religion is bullshit and he speaks very intelligently about the same thing, but then goes and "finds Jesus" it's very depressing to people like myself who agree that religion is bullshit. So yes I would lose respect for him because he became a Christian just like I would lose respect for any of my friends who suddenly become jesus-freaks.  Would I hate them?  No.  Would I refuse to see them ever again?  No.  Just like if this is true and Maynard continues to play with Tool or APC, I probably won't stop listening.

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I didn't really need the proof, but you are just as intelligent as I thought you were. Tool stood for something. They stood for the abstract, and still do. The idea that maybe the preconcieved notions of the worlds *aren't* the "correct" way to think...or even that there is a correct way to think. I'm not saying Maynard is a bad person if he becomes a devout Christian...but I will view his work with a much more cynical eye.

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I can't believe you think that's intelligent. I like Tool, but it's not as if people can't change. To want him to stay the way you like him in spite of him being happy is just selfish.

[Pepsi]

Because when a guy like Maynard sings very intelligent songs about how religion is bullshit and he speaks very intelligently about the same thing, but then goes and "finds Jesus" it's very depressing to people like myself who agree that religion is bullshit. So yes I would lose respect for him because he became a Christian just like I would lose respect for any of my friends who suddenly become jesus-freaks.  Would I hate them?  No.  Would I refuse to see them ever again?  No.  Just like if this is true and Maynard continues to play with Tool or APC, I probably won't stop listening.

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I didn't really need the proof, but you are just as intelligent as I thought you were. Tool stood for something. They stood for the abstract, and still do. The idea that maybe the preconcieved notions of the worlds *aren't* the "correct" way to think...or even that there is a correct way to think. I'm not saying Maynard is a bad person if he becomes a devout Christian...but I will view his work with a much more cynical eye.

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Edited April 5, 2005 by Pepsi

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

SO all Christians are religious hypocrites? ALL of us?

[fineintent]

SO all Christians are religious hypocrites? ALL of us?

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[Pepsi]

Exactly what he said...

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

I certainly see what you mean, but hypocrisy would really mean that if I, as a Christian, spoke out against murder and then went and attacked a group of Jews on some kind of "Holy Crusade".

This guy seems to have come to a new decision, changed his mind which we are surely allowed to do as humans, whether it's through personal changing minds or "Divine Intervention". If he continued to sing songs or talk about how religion and 'blind faith' are bad, then he would be a hypocrite.

I used to hate brocolli and told people that it was a disgusting vegetable.

Then one day I tried it again and quite liked it.

I like brocolli now and now say that it is nice.

Does that make me a hypocrite with regards to brocolli even though people might say "I thought you hate brocolli". I haven't said anything against it since I decided I liked it.

Changing your mind is not hypocrisy. Continuing along your old path of reasoning or thought when you outwardly say you've changed IS hypocrisy.

[Pepsi]

So..your comparing changing your mind about brocolli to changing his mind about religion?

hy·poc·ri·sy a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; especially : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion

So as I said, he spoke out openly against religion but now suddenly has had a change of heart thus making him a hypocrite. I never once said I hated him for doing so, I just said I lost respect for him.

[Liam]

Never said I wasn't going to still listen Tool or APC cd's.  Look at the flip side, let's say there's a famous priest who has gotten famous for preaching the word of god, blah blah blah.  Suddenly he comes out denouncing his faith and basically saying that he's discovered there truely is no god.  There would be an uproar from the religious right.  They'd basically smear his name like crazy. 

But when someone who has spent their career saying how bad religion is to suddenly find god, you ask us to just simply accept this as the "fact he's happy." 

Did I mention I really hope this is a joke?

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Just to make a point on this.....he didn't exactly spend his career speaking out against religion. There are a few possibly anti religious sentiments in some of the songs (but they can be read differently as well), and the thing that Trsitof posted, and other then that, he doesn't seem to have been too outwardly critical.

As CSAMH said, people can change, and maybe at one point, he may have thought that faith and beliefs weren't the way to go, but he changed his mind, and decided to be true to himself. That doesn't make him a hypocrite, thats just facing up to a change in his life.

I'm a big fan of his (....massive, even), and I'm not going to be more cynical (like The said) about his future work, or lost respect for him. I'm happy that if he believes that he can live life like that, than kudos to him (and I'm not even religious at all).

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

hy·poc·ri·sy a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not

So now he says he is a Christian you are saying that he does not actually think he is?

He is pretending to be a Christian when he doesn't actually believe in it at all?

So you're saying that from what he has previously said, he could not actually believe what he's saying he does believe because he previously spoke out vocally against what he now says he believes?

[Underage Politician]

I certainly see what you mean, but hypocrisy would really mean that if I, as a Christian, spoke out against murder and then went and attacked a group of Jews on some kind of "Holy Crusade".

This guy seems to have come to a new decision, changed his mind which we are surely allowed to do as humans, whether it's through personal changing minds or "Divine Intervention". If he continued to sing songs or talk about how religion and 'blind faith' are bad, then he would be a hypocrite.

I used to hate brocolli and told people that it was a disgusting vegetable.

Then one day I tried it again and quite liked it.

I like brocolli now and now say that it is nice.

Does that make me a hypocrite with regards to brocolli even though people might say "I thought you hate brocolli". I haven't said anything against it since I decided I liked it.

Changing your mind is not hypocrisy. Continuing along your old path of reasoning or thought when you outwardly say you've changed IS hypocrisy.

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This sums up my feelings on faith perfectly.

[Malenko]

So..your comparing changing your mind about brocolli to changing his mind about religion?

hy·poc·ri·sy  a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; especially : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion

So as I said, he spoke out openly against religion but now suddenly has had a change of heart thus making him a hypocrite.  I never once said I hated him for doing so, I just said I lost respect for him.

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[Pepsi]

What do you mean the definition I gave? It's the definiton of hypocracy.... what else do you want?

And I never said, once again, that I am going to dislike him for becoming a Christian. I said, once again, I will lose respect for him as I would for anyone else who I thought had the intelligence to see through it.

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

The definition you gave is right. Your reading of it seems slightly off.

[tristy]

Never said I wasn't going to still listen Tool or APC cd's.  Look at the flip side, let's say there's a famous priest who has gotten famous for preaching the word of god, blah blah blah.  Suddenly he comes out denouncing his faith and basically saying that he's discovered there truely is no god.  There would be an uproar from the religious right.  They'd basically smear his name like crazy. 

But when someone who has spent their career saying how bad religion is to suddenly find god, you ask us to just simply accept this as the "fact he's happy."

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[Lowerdeck]

Never said I wasn't going to still listen Tool or APC cd's.  Look at the flip side, let's say there's a famous priest who has gotten famous for preaching the word of god, blah blah blah.  Suddenly he comes out denouncing his faith and basically saying that he's discovered there truely is no god.  There would be an uproar from the religious right.  They'd basically smear his name like crazy. 

But when someone who has spent their career saying how bad religion is to suddenly find god, you ask us to just simply accept this as the "fact he's happy."

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I'd like to request one of you Christians come out and speak on this. I'm curious about whether you think it's the same thing or not.

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Ignorant people and/or politicians will do this. They'll get the most attention. The people who are smart just question why they did it and pray for their re-salvation and for a turn back to the faith. They will not get much attention though, so they will look bad to those creating uproar.

[Liam]

The only difference is that it is not as if Maynard was head of the Church of Satan, and has suddenly become a Christian (the reverse of Pepsi's scenario, basically). He was just someone who questioned faith, but for whatever reason, decided to believe recently.