NFL 2008

[naiwf]

Top QBs are born for the most part. They don't learn on the sidelines. Smith only played in 32 of 64 games, and while he played he was terrible. A -12 TD/INT ratio is bad enough (19/31), but then add in that he fumbled 27 times (13 were lost) in those 32 games and you're looking at a turnover machine. As if THAT wasn't enough, his completion % were 50.9/58.1/48.7 which is just not up to par. If you can barely complete more than half of your passes, don't throw TDs, and cough up the ball almost 1.5 times per game there's no reason for you to have a job. He was the # 1 overall pick which makes matters that much worse.

[livid]

Uhhh what? Not all QB's start from day one and those that do often end up on the unemployment list sooner rather than later. Those who wait until the latter part of the year, if not the entire year or even multiple years, tend to have better careers because they sit back and learn the system before they go out and face defenses that are significantly more efficient and talented than they saw in college, especially if said QB comes from a smaller school.

Not to mention, let's go back to Smith's 2nd year. He had Norv Turner as an Offensive Coordinator and most of all, he was healthy. He had a 77 some QB rating and while I understand that some people think that the QB Rating is overrated, it's still a meaningful stat when determining a QB's career as it's the sum of most of the parts that people spew off at random times. That's pretty good for a 2nd year player with his 2nd Offensive Coordinator. Especially when you consider that his WR's were Arnaz Battle and Antonio Bryant. He single handily beat the Seahawks in the 4th quarter in Seattle (often considered one of the toughest places to play in the NFL) that year and his improvement that year lead to all of the hype surrounding the 49ers before last season to go along with the offseason that they had.

Smith's talented, he just hasn't been given the tools or the time to develop into a decent NFL QB because he happens to have a Head Coach that knows absolutely fuck all when it comes to the offensive side of the ball. If he did, he wouldn't have hired a retard like Jim Hostler last year and he wouldn't have called the guy (Smith) he's ultimately tied to when it comes to how much of a success his career was, out like a fucking retard. I mean, I like Mike Nolan. I think he's a good defensive mind, but I'm becoming increasingly frustrated with his moves done as a Head Coach.

I mean, I don't know if you can really consider Smith a true bust year because he's only played one full year. And injury prone is still a long shot. I mean, it'd be one thing if he had a different injury than last year but it's the same exactly fucking shoulder so it obviously didn't heal which could be the reason why he looked so poor in the preseason this year.

He's probably out of San Francisco (Nolan probably is as well unless something drastic happens this year) but he'll find a place where he can sit for awhile and eventually come in after he's learned the system. He just needs a chance.

Edited September 11, 2008 by Livid

[naiwf]

Uhhh what? Not all QB's start from day one and those that do often end up on the unemployment list sooner rather than later. Those who wait until the latter part of the year, if not the entire year or even multiple years, tend to have better careers because they sit back and learn the system before they go out and face defenses that are significantly more efficient and talented than they saw in college, especially if said QB comes from a smaller school.

A guy like Brady didn't become good because he was Bledsoe's caddy and got to be the clipboard jockey for a few years. That's my point. Alex Smith could study at the feet of Peyton Manning for a couple of years and he'd still be a mediocre at best QB because he lacks the tools to be anything better than that. He is inaccurate, fumble prone, throws too many picks AND he has small hands. As far as not being injury prone, he'll have played in 32 of 64 games and was just about an immediate starter in the league. Basically he's missed 2 of his first 4 years in the league due to injury and if he returns he'll have done so with a twice surgically repaired throwing shoulder, so how is he not injury prone? Titanic busts like Tim Couch, David Carr and Ryan Leaf just didn't have the skills necessary to be anything more than they were in their first few years. I can't really think of highly drafted QBs who sucked for the first four years of their careers while they got PT and then did any better later on after moving to a new team.

Edited September 11, 2008 by naiwf

[Guest Kou]

TAMMY FUCKHAN BRADY

[NobBe Nobbs]

Uhhh what? Not all QB's start from day one and those that do often end up on the unemployment list sooner rather than later. Those who wait until the latter part of the year, if not the entire year or even multiple years, tend to have better careers because they sit back and learn the system before they go out and face defenses that are significantly more efficient and talented than they saw in college, especially if said QB comes from a smaller school.

A guy like Brady didn't become good because he was Bledsoe's caddy and got to be the clipboard jockey for a few years.

How the fuck do you know that? You hand down this great proclamation without a shred of evidence supporting it and expect us to take it as gospel, when it is utter bullshit. Brady was a sixth-round pick who did well in college, and like the pick of Henrik Zetterberg by the Red Wings, the Patriots did not have him scouted as this phenomenal prospect from the beginning, they did not sit on their hands throughout the first five rounds giggling to themselves about how stupid the other teams were, they took him on a flier from Michigan based solely on his good college career and hoping they could make something of him. Once he was picked, he got a year of sitting on the bench and watching Bledsoe do his work and then, to the best of my knowledge, got to step into his shoes with the same offensive scheme the next year. In what way is that even close to Smith's situation?

He is inaccurate, fumble prone, throws too many picks AND he has small hands

Inaccurate? Too many interceptions? Who were his receivers again? Who were his offensive linemen? He did not have the Cowboys' linemen in front of him giving him three and four seconds to make passes, he had turnstiles who only served to let people through. Find out what percent of incomplete passes he threw were actually dropped, then you might have a little more credibility.

Alex Smith could study at the feet of Peyton Manning for a couple of years and he'd still be a mediocre at best QB because he lacks the tools to be anything better than that.

Again, you have nothing to support that. OK, maybe Brady can rack up huge numbers with crappy receivers but he has a phenomenal offensive line in front of him giving him nothing but protection. You'd have a point if he'd been put into the Indy offense and still been a bad quarterback because he then had no excuse, but in 'Frisco, that's just not possible.

[LL!]

Who the fuck calls it Frisco?

[DeeJam]

Who the fuck calls it Frisco?

A majority of Californians

[jase12881]

No, but the fact is he was impressive enough in the workouts (which I think teams put way to much weight into compared to college performance) that he obviously has some talent. And while he has under-performed and he is injury prone thus far, who's to say if he signs a deal with a team like the Lions and actually gets to learn an offense for a couple years from the sidelines and has the same system that he might not turn out to be a reliable starting QB?

Woah woah woah......hold the phone. Did you just actually imply that someone could sign with the Lions and revive their career?

Are you insane sir? The Lions are where careers go to die. This is especially true at QB. Sure Kitna has proven that he's solid enough to be a backup on most teams, but for the most part being a Lions QB is taking a paycheck to get beat up and booed.

And I fully expected the Lions defense to be (somehow) worse than last year...but if they play as badly the entire year as they did in that first game, the Lions might just as well forfeit the rest of the season.

[LL!]

Who the fuck calls it Frisco?

A majority of Californians

Be that as it may (SEE WHAT I DID THERE?), Be is not from California and it is a stupid way of saying San Francisco. If you wanna shorten it say San Fran like everyone else.

[VerbalPuke]

No, but the fact is he was impressive enough in the workouts (which I think teams put way to much weight into compared to college performance) that he obviously has some talent. And while he has under-performed and he is injury prone thus far, who's to say if he signs a deal with a team like the Lions and actually gets to learn an offense for a couple years from the sidelines and has the same system that he might not turn out to be a reliable starting QB?

Woah woah woah......hold the phone. Did you just actually imply that someone could sign with the Lions and revive their career?

Are you insane sir? The Lions are where careers go to die. This is especially true at QB. Sure Kitna has proven that he's solid enough to be a backup on most teams, but for the most part being a Lions QB is taking a paycheck to get beat up and booed.

And I fully expected the Lions defense to be (somehow) worse than last year...but if they play as badly the entire year as they did in that first game, the Lions might just as well forfeit the rest of the season.

See, Lions fans agree, if our defense is worthy of forfeiture of the season. Jase, do you also find it peculiar that our first and second round draft picks are not starters when we needed them to be starters? Do you also find it a bit strange that they are probably better players than the incumbents they were drafted to replace, and yet are still on the bench? I'm having serious questions about Marinelli's ability to evaluate talent.

[DMN in the House]

Who the fuck calls it Frisco?

A majority of Californians

Be that as it may (SEE WHAT I DID THERE?), Be is not from California and it is a stupid way of saying San Francisco. If you wanna shorten it say San Fran like everyone else.

I'm sorry, the proper way to shorten it is 'Yay Area'.

And naiwf is right, QBs aren't made, they just are. Alex Smith is not, and will never be, a good NFL QB.

[livid]

Nobody's saying that they aren't just talented but Alex Smith hasn't exactly had the tools to succeed so far in his NFL career. That's my point.

I'm tempted to label him a bust but considering that he's had one injury that has sidelined him two years (which by the way, naiwf, doesn't make him injury prone. He came back way too early last year and now it's obvious that his shoulder hadn't healed.) and he's had bad personnel around him. You can't say that he doesn't have talent when he wasn't put in a position to succeed.

I'm not saying he'll come back and have a great NFL career, just that naiwf shouldn't write it off just because he's had a turbulent first 4 years in the league. He might not rebound from it, he probably won't, but hold off on the guy until he's in a far better position than he has been in San Fran. And you have to remember that this is coming from a 49ers fan; the guy's had little talent around him.

[MyKILLv2.0]

I don't view Alex Smith a bust... only because I don't think he deserved to be the number one pick in the draft. To me, he's just a quarterback who failed at making the transition from college to NFL.

Happens a lot.

There is NO REASON why Alex Smith should have ever been taken number one, NONE, other then pure stupidity. Coming out of college, he didn't come with the same hype as say a Ryan Leaf, a Carson Palmer, a Peyton Manning, a Tim Couch. And had Alex Smith been drafted with the 20th pick (around where Rodgers were taken) not the first, he wouldn't be a bust in most people's eyes. He would just be a failure. It's not his fault the Niners over drafted him.

And it's really a sad thing too. As a Niner fan, I really think Mike Nolan is a solid coach, and has built up the their defense into a solid unit. He's drafted Patrick Willis, Frank Gore, Manny Lawson, Veron Davis... the list goes on an on. He knows how to build a team. He just missed completely on Smith, and it's a shame that it'll cost him his job more then likely because of it.

Edited September 12, 2008 by MikelSweeten

[mystikz]

it's not like the 49ers have had any decent recievers while he's been there.

[Toe]

A good quarterback can make do, and put up okay numbers. And having bad recievers doesn't explain his horrible TD to INT ratio. Bad recievers may limit the number of TDs and yards, but they shouldn't force him to turn the ball over as much as he has.

Edited September 12, 2008 by Toe

[Guest I'm Ron Burgundy?]

Tom Brady did not have good receivers until 2007, he did alright.

[alldaws1]

Tom Brady's a HOF quarterback. Of course Alex Smith is going to look crap if you keep comparing him to the game's greats. Not every quarterback has to be as good as Brady, Favre or Manning. Not that I'm siding with the pro-Alex Smith people, I think he's a big bust >_>

[NobBe Nobbs]

A good quarterback can make do, and put up okay numbers. And having bad recievers doesn't explain his horrible TD to INT ratio. Bad recievers may limit the number of TDs and yards, but they shouldn't force him to turn the ball over as much as he has.

Again, the pylons masquerading as offensive linemen he'd been playing behind help explain that. Pressure = decisions being forced = interceptions

[Toe]

A good quarterback can make do, and put up okay numbers. And having bad recievers doesn't explain his horrible TD to INT ratio. Bad recievers may limit the number of TDs and yards, but they shouldn't force him to turn the ball over as much as he has.

Again, the pylons masquerading as offensive linemen he'd been playing behind help explain that. Pressure = decisions being forced = interceptions

Good point. That is where a quarterback does need help. You need an offensive line that can give you at least a few seconds to find an open man, or even just give you enough time to throw the ball away.

[LL!]

I saw this the other day, but got lost in the QB talk.

Fuck Reebok.

Tue, Sep 9 Geoff Hobson, of Bengals.com, reports Reebok is the reason Cincinnati Bengals WR Chad Ocho Cinco has to wear Johnson on the back of his jersey. The NFL said Ocho Cinco "has a financial obligation to Reebok, which produces the jerseys available to fans. That has to be resolved before the on-field jersey can be changed." The cost to change the jersey could be $500,000.