Formula One 2009

[KoA]

About bloody time, too.

[NotoriousGTT]

I think it was pretty obvious that they were going to find a compromise one way or another. Glad to see everyone on the grid next year, at least now we can get down to the business of crowning Jenson the champ.

[Adam]

F1 breakaway plans still in place

Eight of the major Formula 1 teams are continuing with plans to set up a breakaway championship next year.

F1 was thrown into confusion when the eight teams in the rebel umbrella group Fota were told on Wednesday they were not entered in the 2010 championship.

"We have to keep our options open," said BMW F1 boss Mario Theissen. "We are working in both directions.

"It is part of the ongoing negotiations and we can only hope it will be sorted out," he added.

Theissen said the teams had been caught by surprise when FIA technical delegate Charlie Whiting told their engineers in the meeting that they could not have an input into a discussion on finalising next year's rules because they did not have entries.

Whiting's statement contradicted an announcement by the FIA's world council on 24 June which listed the eight Fota teams - McLaren, Ferrari, Renault, BMW, Toyota, Brawn, Red Bull and Toro Rosso - as confirmed entries.

That statement had come after Max Mosley, president of F1's governing body the FIA, had reached a compromise deal with Fota chairman and Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo and F1 commercial boss Bernie Ecclestone.

As part of that agreement, the outline of next year's rules was set, the teams agreed to commit to F1 until 2012, Mosley's plan for a £40m budget cap was replaced with an agreement to reduce costs to "mid-1990s levels" by Fota's methods and the FIA president agreed not to stand again for the governing body's presidence in October's elections.

Theissen said: "It's somewhat confusing to have been accepted as an entrant and then suddenly it looks different again."

Fota said in a statement after Wednesday's meeting that the FIA's new stance had "put the future of Formula 1 in jeopardy".

But after the FIA put out a lengthy statement on Thursday detailing its side of the argument, the bosses of the Fota teams were taking a more conciliatory line as they arrived at the Nurburgring ahead of Sunday's European Grand Prix.

Theissen described the FIA's latest move as "irritating", but added: "I wouldn't exaggerate it."

It is understood that the teams are trying to negotiate a new commercial settlement with CVC, the venture capital group that owns the commercial rights to F1, at the same time as finalising with Mosley and Ecclestone a new Concorde Agreement, the document that binds them to the sport and which enshrines their rights.

The FIA statement ended by saying: "At present, it seems probable that a final draft of the 2009 Concorde Agreement will be agreed and be ready for signature in the coming days."

But Fota insiders insist they will break away from F1 if Mosley tries to renege on what was agreed in Paris last month.

After the Fota teams left the meeting on Wednesday after it was made clear to them that they would not be allowed to participate in discussions, the remaining teams rubber-stamped all the rules that had been proposed and agreed by the F1 Teams' Association.

Those left at the meeting were current teams Williams and Force India and the three new teams - Manor, US F1 and Campos.

Manor technical director Nick Wirth, who has a close relationship with Mosley, told BBC Sport: "The five teams left, all agreed it unanimously. I can see, despite hubris, that there is commonality on the technical side.

"There is discussion about a new Concorde Agreement but the fact is the technical regulations are an appendix of the Concorde Agreement - so if you want a new Concorde Agreement, you need to agree technical regulations. It's almost like a chicken and egg (situation) at the moment.

"There is a lot of tension and antagonism but I hope everything will calm down.

"Actually, I am quite confident it will. I'm confident on technical agreement - we will not have two sets of rules - and I hope and believe we will have progress in the next few days."

Additional reporting by Ted Kravitz

I'm quite close to just giving up now tbh, it's getting even more ludicrous than ever. It's making american racing in circles look like an attractive proposition.

[Katsuya]

Well that was a rather epic qualifying session. Huge props to Webber for finally getting pole having not really looked anywhere during Q1 and Q2; I have a feeling though that one way or another, it's not going to be a "good" result - because this is probably one of the last few places for Rubens to get a win, but I also really want Webber to finally get his first ever victory. So we shall see...

Oh, and Sutil in 7th <3333.

[Fry_4000]

Glock's been demoated to 20th from 19th for blocking Alonso, not really much of a punishment in my view. Congrates to webber as well for his 1st ecer pole.

[Slogger]

Webber got pole? About damn time! Who was the last Aussie to get an F1 pole?

and Adam? Don't knock NASCAR till you've watched it

[Adam]

The last aussie to compete in F1 was, I think, Alan Jones, so I dunno how successful he was.

Great result for Webber, but the race is all to come yet. Hopefully Sutil can finally get Force India some points!

[Slogger]

The last aussie to compete in F1 was, I think, Alan Jones, so I dunno how successful he was.

Great result for Webber, but the race is all to come yet. Hopefully Sutil can finally get Force India some points!

Alan Jones won an F1 Championship, But now that I got off my lazy ass and checked, David Brabham was the last Aussie to race in F1 before Webber, In 1990 and again in 1994.

[Katsuya]

The fuel adjusted grid has it as Webber from Vettel by about 0.2 seconds, then Hamilton in 3rd about 0.5 behind Webber, then the two Brawns and then Sutil - who's fuelled the heaviest out of the top 10, meaning he actually outpaced the Ferrari's.

Lots of rumours about people moving cars, too:

- Bourdais is said to be out after this Grand Prix, with Alguersiari (probably wrong) or Sebastien Loeb being a shock replacement. Algu-whatever is probably going to get the Toro Rosso drive next year though.

- Kovalainen's contract is apparently running out and he's hardly set the world on fire in the McLaren, with his only win being a kind of lucky one - Glock is rumoured to be maybe heading that way, but he's saying he's sticking at Toyota. One would imagine either Rosberg or Sutil, Hamilton's friends, might be drafted in as the replacement (those three, if I recall, were the ones McLaren wanted ahead of Kovalainen in the first place).

- Tonio Liuzzi was hinting on the BBC that he's been in contact with a current F1 team for next year - maybe a move back to Toro Rosso or Red Bull, or he might get the race seat with Force India if Sutil leaves.

- Alonso and Vettel are being hinted as the new Ferrari team for 2010, although it seems more likely for Alonso to jump ship, which would put Massa or Kimi out of a race seat: common sense kind of says that Kimi leaves and also leaved F1, since that seems to be the way he's going.

- Jacques Villeneuve wants back in to F1, although USF1 don't want him according to reports, which means he's either going to go to Campos or Manor if he does come back. Campos, however, appear to have Pedro de la Rosa on their list, which makes a lot of sense (apart from the fact he's got to be like, 40-odd now or something). Marc Gene is another one they're looking at, reportedly. They've also got a female test driver, Natcha Gachnang, who is Buemi's cousin.

- Rosberg is also a contender for a BMW drive.

- USF1 are reportedly evaluating Marco Andretti, Jonathan Summerton, AJ Allmendinger, Scott Speed and Danica Patrick. Speed, of course, has the F1 experience...

So...yeah. The grid, therefore, might look like this (this is just a random guess, more than anything, but...meh, might as well see how right I am next March)

BRAWN: Button & Barrichello (possibly Button & Senna)

RED BULL: Vettel & Webber

TOYOTA: Glock & Kubica (Trulli can't be around much longer, can he?)

MCLAREN: Hamilton & Sutil

FERRARI: Alonso & Massa

RENAULT: Kovalainen (I imagine they'd welcome him back ala Alonso) & Romain Grosjean (rumoured to have been replacing Piquet mid-season)

WILLIAMS: Nakajima & ??Liuzzi??

TORO ROSSO: Buemi & Algueseariaiaiaiaia

BMW: Heidfeld & Rosberg

FORCE INDIA: Fisichella & ...some guy.

CAMPOS: de la Rosa & (insert Spanish GP2 driver here)

MANOR: Villeneuve & di Grassi

USF1: Speed & Patrick

Which takes Trulli, Piquet and Kimi out of the equation. Seems about right, me thinks.

[hugobomb]

Trulli retire?

You'll have to prise that steering wheel off his cold dead hands before he leaves F1

[hugobomb]

Trulli retire?

You'll have to prise that steering wheel off his cold dead hands before he leaves F1

[erperro]

Jaume Alguersuari.

[Adam]

Didn't Danica Patrick recently declare that she had no desire to join F1 right now as she prefers the IndyCar series? If we see a woman on the grid, I don't think it'll be her. Natacha Gachtang, on the other hand, maybe. I can't see Nico Rosberg going to BMW as, right now, that'd be a complete backwards step. I'd prefer Glock to join Hamilton at McLaren, then I can hate every single thing/person about the team as opposed to every single thing/person about the team save for Kovalainen.

And the safest bet of all of that lot must be Kimi leaving the sport altogether. He's even competing in a WRC event later this year! I reckon Alonso will step into his spot as he must be getting frustrated with Renault's lack of competitiveness-plus there's been loads of rumours that he already has a deal to drive for them!

[Zaz]

BRAWN: Button & Barrichello (possibly Button & Senna)

RED BULL: Vettel & Webber

TOYOTA: Glock & Kubica (Trulli can't be around much longer, can he?)

MCLAREN: Hamilton & Sutil

FERRARI: Alonso & Massa

RENAULT: Kovalainen (I imagine they'd welcome him back ala Alonso) & Romain Grosjean (rumoured to have been replacing Piquet mid-season)

WILLIAMS: Nakajima & ??Liuzzi??

TORO ROSSO: Buemi & Algueseariaiaiaiaia

BMW: Heidfeld & Rosberg

FORCE INDIA: Fisichella & ...some guy.

CAMPOS: de la Rosa & (insert Spanish GP2 driver here)

MANOR: Villeneuve & di Grassi

USF1: Speed & Patrick

Which takes Trulli, Piquet and Kimi out of the equation. Seems about right, me thinks.

Would be an amazing comeback for Senna if true.

[Hobo]

Would be an amazing comeback for Senna if true.

Quite

Edited July 12, 2009 by Lord Hobington

[maninblack]

Shit, didn't even realize there's a race this weekend. Webber leading, possibly to win? Another sign of the Apocalypse!

I kid, I kid. Would actually be very cool to see Webber finally win one, though I'll admit I was hoping Vettel would take this race.

EDIT: Awesome that his dad's there to share this victory with him. You could feel a weight being lifted off his back through his victory cheer.

Edited July 12, 2009 by maninblack

[maninblack]

EDIT: Gah, doublepost.

Edited July 12, 2009 by maninblack

[Adam]

Since I stayed up for the UFC last night and went to bed at half 5, I've slept through the Grand Prix and missed a race for the first time in ages. Gutted...as the highlights show it was one I would have enjoyed! Delighted to see Mark Webber finally get a race victory, he deserves it, and if Red Bull keep this up we're gonna have a great title contest after all. Plus, Hamilton messing it all up in turn 1 and ruining his own race was hilarious, he can't help but prove how incompetent he really is. Shame for Sutil yet again with Raikkonen, Force India are destined to never win a point it seems.

Rubens has had a right outburst at the Brawn team for messing this race up for him, he's really upset. He said "I guess the strategy... it was a good show from the team on how to lose a race today. I'm terribly upset with the way things went. I did all I had to do. I went first on the first corner and then they made me lose the race. If it is really what's going on, we're going to end up losing both championships. I feel sorry for myself, the team. To be very honest, I wish I could get on the plane and go home. I don't want to talk to anyone in the team. It will be all 'bla bla bla' and I don't want to hear that."

[Katsuya]

WEBBER!!! Yay, such a good win and so, so long in the making. Played the drive-through perfectly, and just...so good. Yay!

Also, BOOOO Kimi for once again fucking over Sutil. It would have been about, what, 4th or 5th for Sutil otherwise (he was right behind Massa and, arguably, quicker). Oh, and Rubens = sour cunt. "Today was how to lose a race"...well, yes, it was, and mainly by you. Couldn't pass Massa for about 10 laps, and says he did all he could? Maybe you should have done more, Rubens.

[Zaz]

Wahey! From Minardi's first ever points in his first ever race to his first ever win. Well done, Mark.