NBA Thread 2011-12

[naiwf]

Nice fair comparison there. Clearly Miami will win because i'd take D-Wade over Sefolosha any day of the week.

If you actually watch Miami play close games, guys like Chalmers, Haslem or Battier end up with the big shot at the end if it's a one possession game. LeBron passes the ball like his life depends on it. Chalmers has the assassin gene that LeBron lacks. Unfortunately for Mario, the rest of his game kinda sucks.

[Benjamin]

How the hell would LeBron be immortal if he went to the Knicks? Because they're a glorified big market team?

Also, anybody saying that LeBron is the best or even the second best is fooling themselves.

[Maxx]

If he signed with New York and brought them a title, yeah he'd be immortal.

Odds are that wouldn't have occurred. Though if you swap LeBron and Melo, I think both of them would be in a situation more suitable for winning a title.

[naiwf]

If he signed with New York and brought them a title, yeah he'd be immortal.

Exactly. He's going to need to win 3 or 4 titles in Miami to accomplish the same thing he would have done with just one in either New York or Cleveland (assuming he had stayed his whole career with the Cavs).

[gunnar hendershow]

Being the guy to end half a century of suffering in Cleveland would have given him a certain level of immortality, winning a title for the Knicks would have done the same, nothing short of a dynasty in Miami will have the same effect.

[bolleje]

Exactly. He's going to need to win 3 or 4 titles in Miami to accomplish the same thing he would have done with just one in either New York or Cleveland (assuming he had stayed his whole career with the Cavs).

It's not like he didn't try at Cleveland. I saw some of his playoff games... he really did about all he could for the team (proven by how much he was loved back then by their fans). It kinda just didn't work out and I guess he didn't want to risk getting eliminated with his one-man team every single year of his career.

When hearing people say the 'it's not that he left, it's the way he left'-argument, I can't help but think of 'that friend' that got dumped by his girlfriend and now tries to convince you that 'it's not that she left me... it's the way she did it'. And then you have to tell him: "SMS, Facebook, by phone... who the hell cares how she left you? The only thing that matters is that she left you. Now, learn to deal with it'. And offcourse there's allways this guy or girl who allready hated her beforehand and is now telling everyone: "See, I told you what a bad person she was! She used to be a prick! Just ask people!"

That's about how I look at the situation with Cleveland & Lebron James. People can't deal with the disappointement and then start searching for all kind of stuff he did wrong, so they can blame him instead of dealing with their disappointement. And a lot of people hated him before and use the situation to prove that 'they were always right. He's a prick'. But the situation wouldn't have been any different if he went to NY or Chicago or wherever. Well, maybe some people that hate him now wouldn't then and vice versa (based on location). We've had guys in the NBA that brought guns to their locker, started fights, commited nasty faults and were mentioned in sexual assualt cases and the guy we're supposed to hate made an hour of 'bad television'...

[Fait Accompli]

What bugs me about the whole narrative on LeBron in late game situation is the notion that we're supposed to think he's "not as good as advertised" because...he's looking for the open man in situations where he's more than likely gonna be double or triple teamed? Let's be real here, most star players in those hero ball situations are shooting like...under 35%. I love Kobe but in those clutch moments that everyone believes he'll be golden in, he's been very hit or miss in the last couple of years.

So what is it? The willingness of LeBron to play hero ball and chuck up last-second shots? If that's the case, I'd hope he doesn't do that for the sake of having his critics shut up about this one thing - they won't because should he miss it, they'll continue on with the narrative of him not having the clutch gene or whatever. To be honest, I'd much rather the star player look to for the better basketball play as opposed to forcing it because when you force a shot...you're gonna miss it more often than not.

Edited June 12, 2012 by Fait Accompli

[naiwf]

What bugs me about the whole narrative on LeBron in late game situation is the notion that we're supposed to think he's "not as good as advertised" because...he's looking for the open man in situations where he's more than likely gonna be double or triple teamed? Let's be real here, most star players in that lose hero ball situations are shooting like...under 35%. I love Kobe but in those clutch moments that everyone believes he'll be golden in, he's been very hit or miss in the last couple of years.

So what is it? The willingness of LeBron to play hero ball and chuck up last-second shots? If that's the case, I'd hope he doesn't do that for the sake of having his critics shut up about this one thing - they won't because should he miss it, they'll continue on with the narrative of him not having the clutch gene or whatever. To be honest, I'd much rather the star player look to for the better basketball play as opposed to forcing it because when you force a shot...you're gonna miss it more often than not.

The whole thing about LeBron is that you can't bill yourself as "King James" and/or "The Chosen One" and look for Mario Chalmers to hit the shots that Jordan, Kobe etc took and made more often than not in the big spot. The greatest player to ever play in every professional team sport that I know of was/is at their best in the biggest moments. LeBron has not been that guy, regardless of his teammates.

It's not like he didn't try at Cleveland. I saw some of his playoff games... he really did about all he could for the team (proven by how much he was loved back then by their fans). It kinda just didn't work out and I guess he didn't want to risk getting eliminated with his one-man team every single year of his career.

In NBA culture, that's worse than bringing guns to the locker room. Every other superstar that ever played the game had to get eliminated year after year until they finally broke through and won their title(s). LeBron led an orchestrated effort to team up with 2 other superstars in another city. There's not a single guy who played before him that is going to respect that decision. Everyone else took their lumps and fought through it. LeBron took a short cut. It's as simple as that.

Edited June 12, 2012 by naiwf

[Maxx]

Yeah, its only acceptable to sell your soul and start chasing rings in the twilight of your career. Karl Malone gave Utah 18 years of his career before moving on, and that was only after Stockton retired. Payton gave Seattle 13 seasons. LeBron decided he was too lazy or too entitled to have to earn it on his own and paired up other all stars in his prime. If that's how you want to play it, don't expect people to think of you on the same level as the other greats.

There is just an incredible arrogance about LeBron and every decision he makes. That's what rubs people the wrong way, and it's compounded by the fact that he's done nothing to actually merit such arrogance.

[Colossus]

Exactly. That's why a lot of people don't have a problem with Boston's Big 3 but they have with Miami's. In Boston, you had 3 guys that had been forced to carry bad team after bad team on their backs. That was their last chance to get a title. And not a single one of them was a top 10 player anymore. In Miami, you have a guy that had just choked a series against a team that they should've beaten teaming up with one of his main rivals. If you play pickup basketball, the 2 best players never play together. That's why, It's no fun just having the 2 best guys and owning the game

[Maxx]

It is strange to be rooting for Derek Fisher.

Wow, bullshit technical on Westbrook. Battier acts like a dick and they both get T'd up? Ridiculous.

[gunnar hendershow]

Harden's been neutralized so far, but at the same time Durant has been left wide open on multiple occasions. So Miami's defense isn't flawless, and the 3rd quarter has shown me OKC is figuring out their opponent.

This crowd reminds me of Indiana in the mid-90s or Sacramento in '02. It's definitely something I haven't seen for a long time in the NBA.

Also, it was pointed out to me today that if OKC wins the title Fisher will have 6 rings to Kobe's 5 and Shaq's 4. I found this hilarious and awesome.

[Panni]

Two fucking terrible calls against Collison in a row.

And another terrible call...this time on Sefalosha.

[Fait Accompli]

Two fucking terrible calls against Collison in a row.

Getting in the way isn't playing defense. While it was questionable whether or not it was a charge or a block, I'm okay with them calling the block - too many players do that last-second slide in the way move when someone drives.

[gunnar hendershow]

Durant and Westbrook have just been showing off on offense in the 2nd half. Thabo and Collison have been solid on defense all 2nd half. This could not have possibly gone better for OKC, Miami has a lot of things to solve in the Thunder armor before Thursday.

Also, I need a .gif of Riley and Alonzo standing in the sea of blue.

[Panni]

I'm happy with what I saw here at Game 1. Over the past two years I've constantly rooted against the Heat, and in all of their series they've seemed like the better team. That's not the case here...the Thunder are clearly more dangerous.

For once the Heat are playing against the explosive, fast-paced team. It's very surprising.

[Mofoticon]

LeBron just got completely neutralized in the 4th by Thabo and Wade was horrible all game...OKC wins in double figures with only 5 points from James Harden?

OKC has got this easily.

[naiwf]

Getting in the way isn't playing defense. While it was questionable whether or not it was a charge or a block, I'm okay with them calling the block - too many players do that last-second slide in the way move when someone drives.

I believe they call that play "The Shane Battier"

Durant did about what I expected late . . . and so did LeBron.

[Fait Accompli]

Getting in the way isn't playing defense. While it was questionable whether or not it was a charge or a block, I'm okay with them calling the block - too many players do that last-second slide in the way move when someone drives.

I believe they call that play "The Shane Battier"

Durant did about what I expected late . . . and so did LeBron.

I think Bob Ryan said something about it on PTI last week, calling it the "Duke Charge" or something to that effect. It's just awful.

[gunnar hendershow]

As a Maryland fan I am all-too-familiar with that play. It's the centerpiece of Coach K's defensive strategy. Only year Terps won the National title they had Tahj Holden who could flop better than any Blue Devil at the time.