NBA Thread 2011-12

[naiwf]

But anyway, we're forgetting the Chicago Bulls 2013 World Champions banners that have already been printed.

Are the Bulls somehow trading Boozer for something other than dead weight? Thibs is going to kill his players going after the # 1 seed again, and they'll end up struggling to score 80 in the postseason. You guys have a better balanced version of the NY Carmelo Anthonys.

[gunnar hendershow]

But anyway, we're forgetting the Chicago Bulls 2013 World Champions banners that have already been printed.

Are the Bulls somehow trading Boozer for something other than dead weight? Thibs is going to kill his players going after the # 1 seed again, and they'll end up struggling to score 80 in the postseason. You guys have a better balanced version of the NY Carmelo Anthonys.

I'm not a Bulls fan, I'm just saying that this probably would have been Chicago in The Finals this year had Rose not gotten hurt in garbage time. Chicago was close last year, a year away if you will. They'll be there next year.

[naiwf]

I'm not a Bulls fan, I'm just saying that this probably would have been Chicago in The Finals this year had Rose not gotten hurt in garbage time. Chicago was close last year, a year away if you will. They'll be there next year.

How were they going to beat Miami who pistol whipped them last year? They lost in 5 and averaged about 83 a game after winning Game 1 103-82. LeBron on Rose = defeat. The only way they get there next year is if the championship hangover hits Miami as hard as it does most teams. The Bulls are a marginal team with a superstar on the squad. They're not capable of beating a marginal team with 2 (or 2 1/2) superstars.

[Quom]

Remember all the times Duran blocked out on the defensive glass and called for the ball in the 4th? Yeah me either. Harden is what is costing them games at the moment, Sefolosha needs to be on the court for defence, Ibaka for limited offence and to shut down the low post then Durant and Westbrook leaving one spot, with two defensive specialists who generally don't offer a huge amount offensively (especially if you aren't wanting jump shots inside the 3-point line) I would be wanting a player who can spread the floor and take the shot if need be. Harden might be that player but he hasn't been this series. For me he's the equivalent of Westbrook for naiwf, I think the team are worse with him on the floor. If Durant has decided rebounding is beneath him I think there would be more valuse in having Collison or Perkins taking up the extra spot on the floor and hoping you can still manage to match up against Miami. But given they aren't opposed to an iso you could potentially rely on the extra big as a help defender or even run a loose zone and push them into jump shooting which hopefully you could contest.

Stupid fouls are stupid though and that's the real killer. Miami are getting calls for everything, it's as if a player misses then there must have been a foul. Just god-awful reffing. There should be some sort of review after this series. I'm not one for conspiracy theories or that sort of junk but the reffing has been consistently inconsistent and entirely balanced in Miami's favour. I don't think it's bias on my part as generally I accept silly fouls and no-calls as just part of the game,, but this has been madness.

[Panni]

Kevin Durant will get a pass this year if they lose, and probably next year as well because he's so young, but after that he'll be the poster boy for the "you're not clutch" people to target.

[naiwf]

I don't know why Harden and Fisher are getting quality minutes late. They suck the life out of OKC on both ends of the court. Durant will get a pass simply because he hasn't won his MVP yet and he's only in year 5. The doubters are coming in full force by the 2014-15 season.

[gunnar hendershow]

It's not like Durant dictates the possession though, that's Westbrook, Harden, and sometimes Fisher and each of them has sucked the life out of this team in this series. The Heat aren't an elite defensive team, but in the final minutes they typically are. That falls on the coaching more than anything, but in any case Durant gets covered, his teammates can't make the play to get him open, and they choke it away. You add some maturity and experience to Westbrook and Harden and I hope that will hopefully change. Right now they're deer in the headlights and their superstar is being suffocated by great defense.

[Fait Accompli]

Stupid fouls are stupid though and that's the real killer. Miami are getting calls for everything, it's as if a player misses then there must have been a foul. Just god-awful reffing. There should be some sort of review after this series. I'm not one for conspiracy theories or that sort of junk but the reffing has been consistently inconsistent and entirely balanced in Miami's favour. I don't think it's bias on my part as generally I accept fould and no-calls, but this has been madness.

I know you're not saying it but a lot of people - mostly people who hate LeBron and the Heat - are of the thinking that the refs/league are in the pocket of the Heat because they want them to win. My thinking is that A) if the refs/league were siding with a team, it'd be the Thunder, which goes to B) the better story for the league and all the sports sites and channels would be if the Heat lose and the small-market Thunder win.

What's lost is that most of those stupid fouls partly come from the Thunder being a relatively young and inexperienced (in terms of being in the Finals) team who will, at times, show their Finals inexperience.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Fait Accompli

[Quom]

It's not like Durant dictates the possession though, that's Westbrook, Harden, and sometimes Fisher and each of them has sucked the life out of this team in this series. The Heat aren't an elite defensive team, but in the final minutes they typically are. That falls on the coaching more than anything, but in any case Durant gets covered, his teammates can't make the play to get him open, and they choke it away. You add some maturity and experience to Westbrook and Harden and I hope that will hopefully change. Right now they're deer in the headlights and their superstar is being suffocated by great defense.

There isn't much they can do to get him open though. The issue is that plays aren't opening him up and he is an odd size. He's too tall/slow to pop out a few feet and create space from his defender and he's also too small (build wise, not height wise) to isolate down low and kick it in (since he can't out muscle his opponent to gain position). There are few players in the league who would be able to get Durant the ball whilst his feet are set caught in what amounts to a double-team situation. The issue with small ball is that Ibaka is the only guy on the floor who can realistically set an effective screen for Durant. By the time Westbrook has split the D there is little point passing it back out since he does so by getting past his own defender and is generally quick enough that the help is half a second too late and he has a fairly easy shot himself. Beyond which with Miami somewhat sagging it's far easier for him to just take the 15 footer after waiting 10-15 seconds for nobody else to get open. Which isn't me digging Westbrook out, I feel the same way for whichever player brings the ball down the court. Except for Fisher who shot way too early into the clock on quarter chances in the previous game. As much as I dislike Lebron he's a far more complete player than Durant, at least judging by this series.

By far the biggest disappointment for me has been Durant's efforts on defence and Brook's ability to come up with something that's effective for four quarters. Mix in what looks like immature mistakes and laziness getting back and into position on D and the Thunder just don't have what is needed to kill two legitimate superstars, a good/great player and a motley crew, one of which will play well each game. Thunder really needed all of their bit players to play well every game. Each of them (besides Harden and Fisher) have shown glimpses or made great plays, but there hasn't been consistency for a full game. That and Collison to me should be playing more minutes.

Stupid fouls are stupid though and that's the real killer. Miami are getting calls for everything, it's as if a player misses then there must have been a foul. Just god-awful reffing. There should be some sort of review after this series. I'm not one for conspiracy theories or that sort of junk but the reffing has been consistently inconsistent and entirely balanced in Miami's favour. I don't think it's bias on my part as generally I accept fould and no-calls, but this has been madness.

I know you're not saying it but a lot of people - mostly people who hate LeBron and the Heat - are of the thinking that the refs/league are in the pocket of the Heat because they want them to win. My thinking is that A) if the refs/league were siding with a team, it'd be the Thunder, which goes to B) the better story for the league and all the sports sites and channels would be if the Heat lose and the small-market Thunder win.

What's lost is that most of those stupid fouls partly come from the Thunder being a relatively young and inexperienced (in terms of being in the Finals) team who will, at times, show their Finals inexperience.

I disagree. Far too many fouls aren't being called because it's finals basketball with a foul then called in a deciding moment off of what would be a no call in the regular season. The only excuse is if the refs are also intimidated by the bright lights of finals as well. These calls have nearly been entirely in favour of Miami.

[The Buscher]

Well...at least Heat/LeBron haters can take solace in the fact that they still need to win 7 more titles to back up LeBron's ridiculous claim when the big 3 first formed.

[Maxx]

I think I'd be more okay with the Superfriends winning a title if it were happening on a franchise with a better fanbase than Miami.

[naiwf]

The Hornets have traded Emeka Okafor & Trevor Ariza to Wizards for Rashard Lewis and No.46 pick. lol Washington.

[rocksta]

Hmm how many years were left on Rashard's awful contract? I know Emake and Ariza both have huge ones too but Ariza and Okafor are both solid defensive players and can help with some of the attitude and immaturity issues Washington has.

[naiwf]

Hmm how many years were left on Rashard's awful contract? I know Emake and Ariza both have huge ones too but Ariza and Okafor are both solid defensive players and can help with some of the attitude and immaturity issues Washington has.

This was from the article I saw.

The move is clearly designed as a cap saver for the Hornets, who clear close to $30 million if they buy-out Lewis for $13.8 million before July 1st (via Ken Berger of CBSSports.com). The Hornets just got rid of their two biggest remaining contracts and have more than enough room to match any offer for Eric Gordon in restricted free agency. They can build any team they want to at this point.

For the Wizards...

Yeah, we're not sure what the Wizards are thinking here. It's true that Ariza and Okafor are competent veterans who can play next to John Wall and Nene in a more established team, but those are longer contracts which are overvalued. It clears room for the amnesty of Andray Blatche, but is that worth what they're taking on?

Okafor has roughly $28 million left on his deal, and Ariza has $15 million, with both deals running through 2014. That's quite a bit of money to take on over multiple years. This wasn't about clearing space, it was about adding it. For a team that is still unlikely to make the playoffs.

[DYSI]

Did Michael Jordan get his old job back? Pretty odd deal for the Wiz.

[gunnar hendershow]

Makes zero sense. Nothing like overpaying for defense off the bench!

But as my one friend said today, it's the NBA, the Wizards can surely con some other team into taking on the salary of one or both of those guys if it becomes too much of a burden. NBA GM meetings must be a roundtable discussion of "who can outdumb everyone else in the room."

[Meacon Keaton]

It's the Wizards. No one really cares, though, right?

[naiwf]

Makes zero sense. Nothing like overpaying for defense off the bench!

But as my one friend said today, it's the NBA, the Wizards can surely con some other team into taking on the salary of one or both of those guys if it becomes too much of a burden. NBA GM meetings must be a roundtable discussion of "who can outdumb everyone else in the room."

Isiah Thomas is not walking through that door. . .

[rocksta]

Yah I think it's a better trade for the Hornets. Lewis was a waste of money but he kept them above the cap floor.

The benefit for the Wizard's I think is more of a culture change . With this they get rid of Lewis and are now free to amnesty Blatche which I'm sure gives all 7 Wizard fans a wet dream. That isn't enough to make up for the newfound lack of cap flexibility though. I guess another potential benefit would be that despite not making them contenders or anything it does make them at least serviceable in the East and maybe John Wall won't leave? Maybe?

You're looking at something like

Wall-Beal-Ariza-Booker?-Nene

or

Wall-MKG-Ariza-Nene-Okafor if they want to seal the deal as the worst perimeter shooting team in the NBA.

Ok John Wall will still leave. The rebuilding efforts of Grunfeld are abysmal. You don't just throw it down the toilet in order to add 10-15 more wins, especially when that'll bring you up to about 20-25 wins.

One interesting thing I heard was on the Hornets end though. Waive Lewis>Amnesty Jack> Massive cap room. They would have enough money to offer Deron Williams a max contract and retain Gordon. They have the 1st and the 10th pick they grab Davis and fuckifiknow at the 10 spot plus that 40 whatever pick. Sounds like a solid team don't the road.

Ok Deron Williams won't sign with New Orleans I know but that'd be cool no?

Edited June 21, 2012 by rocksta

[Panni]

So will tonight finally be the night Lebron James officially becomes coronated as King?

I feel like I'm starting to turn the corner on the guy. Last year I hated him. He came off as arrogant, but when the pressure was on he completely shied away. This postseason he has completely answered the call. We all kind of knew he was bound to win a ring at some point, and I'm guessing tonight is that night. My guess...Heat win by like 15.