The 2010 NFL Thread

[mystikz]

they also have Charlie Frye and Kyle Boller.... and while they suck they are still better than Russel. I can't see them going in with 5 qb's.

Edited April 24, 2010 by mystikz

[Syrjis]

Bryant McFadden re-joins the Steelers after one season with AZ. Cards traded 195th pick and McFadden for Steelers' 155th pick.

[naiwf]

Oakland has had some terrible drafts recently based solely on 1st rounders that didn't light the world on fire (Robert Gallery, Russell, DHB), but I think they could legitimately contend in the AFC West next season. Denver's first rounders are projects and they gave up their best WR, the Chiefs are atrocious and that leaves Oakland/SD for the division crown. I don't think they'd make any noise in the playoffs, but it's certainly better than being the league laughingstock.

[Gene Kiniski]

They're the Jets. Do we really need an explanation for why they settle for mediocrity?

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

That is an awesome fucking trade for Oakland.

Go look up Campbell's stats. Dude can play.

EDIT: Am I just a homer, or are the Raiders killing this draft? Where is my old Al Davis?

Being a Dallas fan I naturally take every opportunity to bash Campbell, but I am intrigued to see what he can do in Oakland. I would overly enjoy if he went over there and tore it up and McNabb went downhill in Washington.

[naiwf]

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

Do you mean that this season they'll miss the playoffs entirely instead of barely getting into the playoffs because the Colts pussed out on their pursuit of perfection?

On a serious note, it amazes me that your average Jets fan in the greater NY area completely forgot that they were a Peyton playing half away from going 8-8 and having a "ho-hum" first season for both Rex and the "Sanchize".

[Mysterio2000X]

You must have missed the point where I stated that I watched the guy in college. Being a Florida State fan, an ACC fan, and living in ACC territory has allowed me to witness his last two years. I saw 8/9 of the guys games each of the last two years. I didn't judge anything by a highlight reel. All that was, was a compilation of him doing the exact things you said he couldn't. I didn't evaluate him by a highlight film but rather by watching about 20 of his games. What did you see on TV that wasn't on Sportscenter ?

And uh, this FO Metric crap ? Really ? How do you go from yanking on me with the "40's don't mean shit otherwise there'd by a bunch more 2000yd backs" to pulling that crap ? You're right stats don't tell the full story but it's idiotic NOT to say that the kid doesn't line up with Johnson. He's the exact same build and only a half step slower. Hell, even their college performance is scarily similar. They both have exceptional speed, agility, vision, and "playmaker" ability. Spiller was even given credit for his blocking efforts (something Johnson wasn't noted for). If you look at film of both guys in college they look like the same back. Making the comparison isn't idiotic or a stretch even ... it's the only person Spiller lines up with.

Of course, I asked what it was that Johnson had/has that Spiller didn't ... and didn't get an answer. Spiller has every tool (and actually a couple more) that Johnson had coming out of school. That's fact.

But unless you can actually bring something to the discussion instead of re-stating the same sentences over and over ... we're done.

Football Outsiders's stats are compiled off of actual, in-game production, and are adjusted for the level of opponent you faced and the talent of your supporting cast (in this case, the offensive lines). To dismiss them as being just as pointless as the 40 yard dash in in-game situations, when the stats they used to come up with those metrics are nothing BUT in-game stats, is obnoxious and stupid.

You said it yourself, CJ Spiller IS a half-step slower than Chris Johnson, only I realize that that half-step makes a world of difference in the NFL when everybody you face is faster, stronger and smarter than any defense these prospects faced in college. You're delusional and seriously overrating CJ Spiller, but are too obnoxious to see anything but what you want to see.

Is CJ Spiller slow? Fuck no. Can he change directions quickly? Yes. Can he do some of the things CJ can? Yes, and I never said he couldn't. But can he do those things at the absolutely elite, Chris Johnson level? No, I don't see that when I watched his games, and the stats clearly don't show that. But, you've inflated your perception of what Spiller is to a point where I doubt anything I say or anybody else says will make you change your mind, so continuing this is utterly pointless.

EDIT -

The reason Faneca got cut, as I understand it, is because he can't pass block to save his life, and he's only really special when he's pulling on running plays nowadays. Given the big ass amounts of cash he was supposed to make, it just wasn't worth it (even in an uncapped year).

And McFadden got exposed in Arizona - he's slow, has poor instincts, cannot man up, and was by far our worst single starting defender, period, last year. He was going to be replaced by Greg Toler this year, so it didn't really make much sense to keep him around at $5million for the year. Being able to trade him to move up and get John Skelton's awesome, though I would've preferred Jarrett Brown over him for sure.

Edited April 24, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[sahyder1]

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

Do you mean that this season they'll miss the playoffs entirely instead of barely getting into the playoffs because the Colts pussed out on their pursuit of perfection?

On a serious note, it amazes me that your average Jets fan in the greater NY area completely forgot that they were a Peyton playing half away from going 8-8 and having a "ho-hum" first season for both Rex and the "Sanchize".

8-8 would still have been a good step forward with a rookie QB. It's not like they went one and done in the playoffs. They were also one half away from the Super Bowl.

I was at the Rutgers Spring Game today to get a taste of some football....can't wait for the season to start.

[DMN in the House]

The Jets have an awesome defense, and that division is within their reach, depending on Sanchez.

[naiwf]

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

Do you mean that this season they'll miss the playoffs entirely instead of barely getting into the playoffs because the Colts pussed out on their pursuit of perfection?

On a serious note, it amazes me that your average Jets fan in the greater NY area completely forgot that they were a Peyton playing half away from going 8-8 and having a "ho-hum" first season for both Rex and the "Sanchize".

8-8 would still have been a good step forward with a rookie QB. It's not like they went one and done in the playoffs. They were also one half away from the Super Bowl.

I was at the Rutgers Spring Game today to get a taste of some football....can't wait for the season to start.

The Jets barely made it into the playoffs and their season ended giving up 24 unanswered points to the Colts. Most teams would take a look at that season and consider it a step forward. Jets fans are acting as though it's a given that they make it to the Super Bowl next year and, many of them expect to be the favorite because there's no way Sanchez or the defense might regress and they also assume everyone will remain healthy. That's an awfully brash position to take when you only made your run because another team sat their starters and gave you a game.

It's the same type of thinking that Vikings fans have when they basically act like they lost the Super Bowl last year because a penalty wasn't called on that Favre hit. It's like it's just a foregone conclusion that the Colts would have lost to the Vikings, although there's not a chance in hell that Childress would have had the stones to make some of the calls Payton did amongst a myriad of other variables that went into the outcome of that game.

My whole point is that the Jets fanbase is now looking at the upcoming season as a failure if they don't win the Super Bowl, and I don't see how the hell they arrived at that conclusion when a few months ago they were looking at the team as the "Same Old Jets".

[Hellfire]

AFC East is going to be real fun to watch next year. Jets loaded up on talent, Dolphins added Marshall, Patriots still are one of the better teams in football and Buffalo...uh...well maybe Buffalo will decide to run the option or something.

[HailtotheYo]

Football Outsiders's stats are compiled off of actual, in-game production, and are adjusted for the level of opponent you faced and the talent of your supporting cast (in this case, the offensive lines). To dismiss them as being just as pointless as the 40 yard dash in in-game situations, when the stats they used to come up with those metrics are nothing BUT in-game stats, is obnoxious and stupid.

You said it yourself, CJ Spiller IS a half-step slower than Chris Johnson, only I realize that that half-step makes a world of difference in the NFL when everybody you face is faster, stronger and smarter than any defense these prospects faced in college. You're delusional and seriously overrating CJ Spiller, but are too obnoxious to see anything but what you want to see.

Is CJ Spiller slow? Fuck no. Can he change directions quickly? Yes. Can he do some of the things CJ can? Yes, and I never said he couldn't. But can he do those things at the absolutely elite, Chris Johnson level? No, I don't see that when I watched his games, and the stats clearly don't show that. But, you've inflated your perception of what Spiller is to a point where I doubt anything I say or anybody else says will make you change your mind, so continuing this is utterly pointless.

Ah, the classic use it when it fits my opinion/point of view but dismiss it when it doesn't routine. Lovely.

And Spiller being a half step slower than Johnson is like Deion Sanders being a half step slower than Darrell Green and thusly saying that Sanders wouldn't be able to cover the NFL WR's like Green because the NFL WR's are all faster. When you reside in the level of speed that these guys do, one being a half step slower than the other is irrelevant because everybody else is in a category of speed lower than theirs.

[Gene Kiniski]

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

Do you mean that this season they'll miss the playoffs entirely instead of barely getting into the playoffs because the Colts pussed out on their pursuit of perfection?

On a serious note, it amazes me that your average Jets fan in the greater NY area completely forgot that they were a Peyton playing half away from going 8-8 and having a "ho-hum" first season for both Rex and the "Sanchize".

8-8 would still have been a good step forward with a rookie QB. It's not like they went one and done in the playoffs. They were also one half away from the Super Bowl.

I was at the Rutgers Spring Game today to get a taste of some football....can't wait for the season to start.

The Jets barely made it into the playoffs and their season ended giving up 24 unanswered points to the Colts. Most teams would take a look at that season and consider it a step forward. Jets fans are acting as though it's a given that they make it to the Super Bowl next year and, many of them expect to be the favorite because there's no way Sanchez or the defense might regress and they also assume everyone will remain healthy. That's an awfully brash position to take when you only made your run because another team sat their starters and gave you a game.

It's the same type of thinking that Vikings fans have when they basically act like they lost the Super Bowl last year because a penalty wasn't called on that Favre hit. It's like it's just a foregone conclusion that the Colts would have lost to the Vikings, although there's not a chance in hell that Childress would have had the stones to make some of the calls Payton did amongst a myriad of other variables that went into the outcome of that game.

My whole point is that the Jets fanbase is now looking at the upcoming season as a failure if they don't win the Super Bowl, and I don't see how the hell they arrived at that conclusion when a few months ago they were looking at the team as the "Same Old Jets".

What I said, again:

I feel that the Jets can still repeat what they did last season if not seal the deal this time around. They have the momentum behind them and while they do make some odd moves all of those moves seem to finally falling into place. If anything they are probably the best example of a team tweaking and fine tuning as they go and not just hoping for that instant, fly-by-night fix.

-I'm a Dallas fan, not a Jets fan. I have a soft spot for them, but by far a Cowboys fan.

'If' was purposely implied there. There is no reason why they shouldn't have a solid bit of steam built up going into the upcoming season. They caught some breaks, no doubt, but they made some wise moves to get to those places.

I'm not sure if you were implying your comments directly to me, but I didn't say that it was set in stone they would go all the way, I said that I felt they could get back to the same, progressing, stage they were last season. 8-8 or not, they still got as far as they did. Remember, the Pats went 11-5 and missed the playoffs so that winning record meant nothing that season. In the same sense, breaking even and going to the championship game doesn't mean any less than if they had went undefeated. Making it to the AFC Championships IS progression and that is what I was referring to it as. Hence the "moves seem to finally be falling into place" - they are progressing to better places.

Go, Cowboys.

[Mysterio2000X]

Ah, the classic use it when it fits my opinion/point of view but dismiss it when it doesn't routine. Lovely.

And Spiller being a half step slower than Johnson is like Deion Sanders being a half step slower than Darrell Green and thusly saying that Sanders wouldn't be able to cover the NFL WR's like Green because the NFL WR's are all faster. When you reside in the level of speed that these guys do, one being a half step slower than the other is irrelevant because everybody else is in a category of speed lower than theirs.

....

No. Just.. no.

[naiwf]

I wasn't talking about you specifically Gene Kiniski. I live in NYC and the airwaves have been inundated with Jets fans drawing up preliminary preparations for a parade down the Canyon of Heroes next February. These same fans were crying in their beer along with Rex with two weeks left in the season, and now they're full of bluster and bravado because they see no way that the Jets can underperform next year. This is not like the NBA where a team has to "learn how to win" in the playoffs and rarely goes from lottery team to NBA Champion. Sometimes you just get hot and have a terrific run, followed by a year or more of mediocrity. You'd think people who live in this area would see that considering the recent string of seasons the Giants have had -> no playoffs, no playoffs, 1 and done, 1 and done, 4-0 on the road and the streak buster, 1 and done, no playoffs. 2007 appears to be a blip on the radar, not the start of a dynasty as some were predicting.

Granted none of the Jets are likely to shoot themselves out in a nightclub while they have the best record in the league next year, but stranger things have happened.

[sahyder1]

I like to give Jets/Mets fans a break when they go ridiculous on WFAN just because they have been the ugly stepsisters for so long. Living in this area you're obviously aware that most Jets fans are also Mets so the past 40 years haven't exactly been friendly to them. That being said I still don't like your "they got lucky to get in" argument. I'd be completely on board with what you said had they gone into the playoffs and absolutely get lit up in the Wildcard round. That didn't happen. Losing to the Peyton Manning in the AFC Championship game is nothing to be ashamed of. With a rookie coach and a rookie QB they DID make the run. Woody Johnson has gone out there and spent money the past couple of years to improve the team.

[naiwf]

I like to give Jets/Mets fans a break when they go ridiculous on WFAN just because they have been the ugly stepsisters for so long. Living in this area you're obviously aware that most Jets fans are also Mets so the past 40 years haven't exactly been friendly to them. That being said I still don't like your "they got lucky to get in" argument. I'd be completely on board with what you said had they gone into the playoffs and absolutely get lit up in the Wildcard round. That didn't happen. Losing to the Peyton Manning in the AFC Championship game is nothing to be ashamed of. With a rookie coach and a rookie QB they DID make the run. Woody Johnson has gone out there and spent money the past couple of years to improve the team.

I'm not saying that they didn't have a nice run, but this was a team that lucked out in that Indy sat Peyton with a lead, won 2 straight games against the Bengals who overachieved, and had one great win in the streak in San Diego. Their season was fairly similar to the 2007 Giants and 2008 Cardinals. Neither of those teams made the Super Bowl the following year and both are in less than stellar situations heading into the 2010 season. All I'm saying is that getting to your Conference Championship game unexpectedly doesn't necessarily mean you're heading on some Pats run of 3 Super Bowls in 4 years.

Edited April 25, 2010 by naiwf

[Blaze09]

http://ow.ly/1CGCS

List of Undrafted Rookies to sign so far, updated when a new person signs.

[Powerhart]

According to ESPN, the Seahwaks acquired RBs LenDale White and Leon Washington from the Titans and Jets, respectively, from trades. What the Seahwaks gave up wasn't mentioned.

Hmm. Somewhat surprised the Titans were the ones to draft Myron Rolle. What I've seen of him (wich isn't much, to be honest) he looks great and is quite smart (obviously) hopefully he can play instead of Michael Griffin.

[sahyder1]

According to ESPN, the Seahwaks acquired RBs LenDale White and Leon Washington from the Titans and Jets, respectively, from trades. What the Seahwaks gave up wasn't mentioned.

Hmm. Somewhat surprised the Titans were the ones to draft Myron Rolle. What I've seen of him (wich isn't much, to be honest) he looks great and is quite smart (obviously) hopefully he can play instead of Michael Griffin.

Jets got a 5th rounder this year. The White trade was a 6 player/picks trade. You can check out all the trades from today here. NFL.com also put together a list of the "best available" undrafted guys.

[JStarr]

http://ow.ly/1CGCS

List of Undrafted Rookies to sign so far, updated when a new person signs.

Good to see Stafon Johnson getting a look. If he makes any roster, the Titans' or anyone else's, it'll be a pretty good comeback story.