Official Premier League 2010/11 thread

[stokeriño]

You seem to have failed to grasp the difference between Real officially quashing "speculation of an imminent move", and them being linked to a Summer 2011 move as is inevitable in the tabloids.

[-A-]

I'm not sure whether he was ruling out Real or checking them off the list of clubs to be linked with him.

[stokeriño]

If it's the latter it would seem redundant, since I had already done so in the post he quoted.

[Crybaby Bunting]

I don't understand why he'd go to Man City anyway. Moving from Manchester United away from the constant media speculation to go... to the other side of the city?

Considering there's only 18 months left on his contract I could see his pricetag being much lower than people are speculating (so not £40m, about £20m) which would actually open up loads of different teams that you wouldn't expect. Juventus? Inter? Bayern? Valencia? There's more than just Barce and Madrid who would distance him from the media.

[Colly]

I thought it was easy to see why Liverpool aren't anywhere near the team of two years ago.

If people can bitch about Rooney having a rediculous lack of form then I don't understand how Torres and Gerrard can get away with playing so woefully. Unfortunately, Gerrard's skill was being a brilliant link up player, and with no clear quality around him he suddenly possesses the ego to shoot from 40 yards EVERY TIME HE GETS THE BALL.

Carragher is useless, he was probably the sole reason why Liverpool collapsed so drastically last season. They bought Johnson to paper over a small crack only for a larger one to occur that would destroy their chances of defending a lead at all.

The left back situation is dire, Joe Cole is a poor mans Ricardo Fuller, Johnson is awful, Merides is alright, Poulson is laughably bad, Babel is 'just lacking form' according to a minority of retards, Ngog is alright but no better than an average league striker like Shola Ameobi or Dave Kitson.

Newcastle and Leeds have gone down with better squads than this, Liverpool isn't a team it's just a selection of players that doesn't fit together at all.

What a ridiculous fucking statement. I don't even see the point in arguing it because it's that stupid. Johnson awful? Judging Poulson on barely fucking viewing him? Acting like Cole is worst than Fuller? And to cap it off, trying to claim Newcastle ( ) or even Leeds had a better squad when they went down? Good god, I know it's easy for people to take shots at Liverpool right now, but that's just beyond moronic.

Johnson is pretty poor though. Seriously. I've rarely seen him have a good game outside of a decent run of form at the start of last season IIRC. He wastes possesion all too often, leaves defences exposed due to this coupled with his progression up the pitch, and his defensive abilities are simply OK.

And the Leeds comment was one thrown out by someone else in the past couple of days.

Robinson, Paul

Milosevic,

Carson, Scott

Defenders

Kelly,Gary

Harte, Ian

Camara, Zoumana

Radebe, Lucas

Roque Junior, Jose Vitor

Matteo, Dominic

Duberry, Michael

Domi, Didier

Richardson, Fraser

Midfielders

Bakke, Eirik

Barmby, Nick

Batty, David

Johnson, Seth

Keegan, Paul

Lennon, Aaron

McMaster, Jamie

Milner,James

Morris, Jody

Olembe, Salomon

Pennant, Jamie

Wilcox, Jason

Woods, Martin

Strikers

Chapuis, Cyrile

Johnson,Simon

Viduka, Mark

Smith, Alan

To be honest, it isn't a bad little team, and was a team that should have done better than get relegated. I wouldn't argue that they are better than the current Liverpool side, but they are better on paper than a fair few teams in the Premiership at the moment.

That was said by Robbie Fowler on Sunday, and I would agree with him. Thats the team that went down, but don't forget that in the summer and January of that year they'd had to have a massive firesale to balance the books including Woodgate, Bowyer, Ferdinand, Fowler himself and I've no doubt I'm missing a few more. Robbie Keane? Thats from memory so don't murder me if my dates are wrong.

And while we're on it, Liverpool aren't much better than Newcastles relegation season barring Torres and Gerrard. Granted again we sold Milner, N'Zogbia, Given etc etc in the run-up, I've no doubt that had we been bought out prior to Christmas we might've survived just off the back of Shay Given.

Thats not to say Liverpool will go down, I don't think they will, but to mock the idea that they aren't as good as the Leeds team at the start of their relegation season is ridiculous.

[therockbox]

"Liverpool aren't much better than Newcastles relegation season barring Torres and Gerrard."

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

[Liam]

Yeah, I'd thought it was Robbie Fowler, but I'd struggled to find the quote specifically, so didn't want to attribute it to him just in case.

But yeah, the argument isn't as far fetched as JP makes it sound, like you said.

EDIT: I'd never make the Newcastle argument, though, admittedly >_>

Edited October 18, 2010 by Liam

[Pesci]

And that right there is why people should never compare Liverpool fans and Newcastle fans when they're talking about delusion.

[therockbox]

This summer just gone, I bought a car. I don’t want to reveal the manufacturer, but it was one of those old, revered badges that always make you turn your head on the road. True, they’ve not produced anything desperately brilliant for the last 20 years or so – other than one model which overperformed completely despite being tested against more expensive motors – but there’s still a lingering respect, a residual gleam to the name.

Anyway, I got this car on the cheap, to be honest. It had been going really nicely until the previous summer, 2009, and had actually seemed to be getting better with every service since he’d bought it in 2004. It was running beautifully a year ago, the guy who sold it to me told me. Firing on all cylinders. Literally, if a metaphor can ever be literal. It was going faster than pretty much anything else around it and with an effortless grace, too. Moved up through the gears really nicely. Still wasn’t the best car around, but a bit of tweaking in the engine and he’d have been flying, though definitely not literally.

The problem was that, last year, he’d had to get some parts exchanged. He’d not had the money to go to the official dealer – which are always overpriced anyway, he said, and he was spot on, or at least he would have been if this wasn’t a metaphor – but he’d had to change the fuel injection, because it wanted to bring its kids up in Spain, wasn’t a fan of high tax rates and they’d had a few disagreements anyway. He’d bought a new one, a fancy Italian one, but he wasn’t quite sure where it would work and how soon he could get it fitted. He’d upgraded the driver side rear tyre, too, but that seemed like a sensible move, what with the homegrown regulations the DVLA had brought in.

Sadly, though, it didn’t quite work. When he first drove the car after coming back from holiday in 2009, it spluttered a bit when he turned the ignition on and it just couldn’t get going. Every time he thought he was getting somewhere, a piece fell out, or broke, or tore an adductor, and it started struggling again. He said he’d made a few mistakes along the way, too, including telling some of the more important parts that they really should start behaving like important parts and taking it to Reading, while he had a bit of a habit of driving through potholes.

So I bought it off him. I replaced some of the parts, too, though I kept hold of the most important ones, even if one had to leave because its wife couldn’t settle here. The ones I bought were all of my own choosing, though, even if I did accidentally buy two fanbelts but forget to mend the steering wheel. The guy who sold it to me said it maybe wouldn’t be able to get up to 100 miles an hour without major, expensive surgery, but that it should certainly be capable of going fast enough to get it to Europe, though probably not the nice bits. Now, though, it just won’t go at all. It’s barely moved for the last couple of months. I’ve driven it very badly, none of the parts are working and I’ve put a couple of them in the wrong place. The passenger side rear tyre, for a start, is completely bald. It’s a diesel engine, but I’m running it on petrol, just to see how it goes.

Yet, to be honest, I think it’s the previous owner’s fault. I mean, how can I expect to drive it well when it wasn’t perfect in the first place? If he’d left it in a better state, I wouldn’t have had to buy all those new parts, which just don’t work. True, he wouldn’t have sold me the car, but that’s by the by. Of course, it’s a bit of a puzzle why a car that could do 70mph last year can only do 19 now, but that strikes me as being because of the changes he made two years ago, not the ones I made this summer, or the way I’ve put the car together. Definitely. It’s his fault. I’m doing the best I can, under the circumstances, really.

[Colly]

"Liverpool aren't much better than Newcastles relegation season barring Torres and Gerrard."

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Bear in mind I never said anything at all to do with Newcastle being better, but if you look at squad depth with those two removed its not as hilarious as you think, and watching Liverpool play so far this year compared with our squad prior to that first mental transfer window when we sold Milner and brought in Xisco etc its even less clear cut. We'd been in Europe two seasons prior so its not that far fetched. Same points after 8 games too and we'd already played Man Utd and Arsenal.

Edited October 18, 2010 by Colly

[Crybaby Bunting]

The Newcastle example was probably a little far fetched

At the time, it made no sense that a team with some proven winners and some up and coming talents could somehow collapse so drastically. I guess the point would have worked more if almost every Newcastle player from that season that got sold didn't dissapoint their new club. Martins didn't work at Woilfsberg, Owen got a few goals but failed at United, Bassong is an expensive rotation player for Spurs, Duff managed to break himself every other week at Fulham.

But the point was, when the season started it was widely assumed that the team would just click and they'd live up to their potential... history has since proved that most of the players in that squad weren't anywhere near as good as they thought.

Retrospectively, we could see the same happen with Liverpool IF they get relegated. I listed a bunch of players who appeared to be past it already at the club, and even other teams 'salvaging' players from the relegated squad could find themselves with fools gold. Players with potential that doesn't appear to exist anymore, players who were broken that no longer live up to their hype, and the odd one or two good players that do well that no-one actually expected to do well.

But that's just absolute speculation, Hodgeson could click next week and go on a mad 20 game winning streak or something. My point is that everyone just assumed things would get better for Newcastle at the time... and even buying players in January (like Nolan, Ryan Taylor) didn't do the job they expected to do. Just because the owners now have money doesn't mean that they'll buy players that instantly click.

And in a case like this, Newcastle can be a decentish comparison to Liverpool. Torres is a brilliant player... but then again, so was Owen. Torres has had so many hamstring injuries that he might have damaged himself a little too much to ever get his immense form back, only time will tell if this is actually true or not.

[EddieG]

Didn't Fowler say the team is worse than the Leeds team that got relegated?

[Liam]

Didn't Fowler say the team is worse than the Leeds team that got relegated?

Yes, which is what was being said >_>

[Asuka's Gonna Kill You]

Yeah, I'd thought it was Robbie Fowler, but I'd struggled to find the quote specifically, so didn't want to attribute it to him just in case.

But yeah, the argument isn't as far fetched as JP makes it sound, like you said.

EDIT: I'd never make the Newcastle argument, though, admittedly >_>

The arguement was far fetched though. Judging people like Poulson so early and then trying to compare the Liverpool squad to the Newcastle one, now that's far fetched. Liverpool are a very good squad in one hell of a slump, it's that simple. The club is going through a hell of a lot, the entire squad seems to lack confidence and the manager doesn't seem to be getting enough out of everything. It's a combination of many things, it's not because they have a shit squad. I don't get why people are saying Johnson is shit, he's very good going forward and has recently been improving on his defensive work. Gary Neville was once one hell of a right back, but he wasn't amazing all the time at the back.

Shitting on people like Ngog and then calling Joe Cole a 'poor mans Ricardo Fuller' seems complete madness to me. Cole hasn't been all that good since arriving at Liverpool, but it hasn't helped that the entire team is under a slump. Cole was performing at a top level under Chelsea, acting like he's worst than Fuller is kind of bizzare. Wont even go into the Poulson matter, judging him already is again bizzare.

The Newcastle example was probably a little far fetched

At the time, it made no sense that a team with some proven winners and some up and coming talents could somehow collapse so drastically. I guess the point would have worked more if almost every Newcastle player from that season that got sold didn't dissapoint their new club. Martins didn't work at Woilfsberg, Owen got a few goals but failed at United, Bassong is an expensive rotation player for Spurs, Duff managed to break himself every other week at Fulham.

But the point was, when the season started it was widely assumed that the team would just click and they'd live up to their potential... history has since proved that most of the players in that squad weren't anywhere near as good as they thought.

Retrospectively, we could see the same happen with Liverpool IF they get relegated. I listed a bunch of players who appeared to be past it already at the club, and even other teams 'salvaging' players from the relegated squad could find themselves with fools gold. Players with potential that doesn't appear to exist anymore, players who were broken that no longer live up to their hype, and the odd one or two good players that do well that no-one actually expected to do well.

But that's just absolute speculation, Hodgeson could click next week and go on a mad 20 game winning streak or something. My point is that everyone just assumed things would get better for Newcastle at the time... and even buying players in January (like Nolan, Ryan Taylor) didn't do the job they expected to do. Just because the owners now have money doesn't mean that they'll buy players that instantly click.

And in a case like this, Newcastle can be a decentish comparison to Liverpool. Torres is a brilliant player... but then again, so was Owen. Torres has had so many hamstring injuries that he might have damaged himself a little too much to ever get his immense form back, only time will tell if this is actually true or not.

You're talking about at Manchester United? Not sure if you meant Newcastle or Man United, but if it's the latter, how the hell has he failed with us? He's still with us. Last time I checked he also rescued us a few weeks ago to savage a draw for us. He's actually a great player to have in our squad and has earned his place too. We've in the process of also developing young players in Hernadez and also Macheda, while Berbatov has finally found form, so it's no surprise Owen isn't always starting. He's far from failed though.

[stokeriño]

Argh, I swear to God.

Talking on a Chelsea forum about atmosphere/singing/the usual things people on football forums complain about, and mentioned my dislike for some of the less tasteful anti-Tottenham songs that Chelsea fans sing, including the "Tottenham Hotspur went to Rome" one.

The next post: "Eh? What's wrong with that song?"

Honestly? :/

For those unaware, the lyrics go like this:

The Yids from Tottenham Hostpur went to Rome to see the Pope,

The Yids from Tottenham Hostpur went to Rome to see the Pope,

The Yids from Tottenham Hostpur went to Rome to see the Pope,

And this is what he said: FUCK OFF!

This is after having to spend the Villa match stood next to a bunch of teenagers who spent 90 minutes chanting "You're all muslims at Villa Park", "You're all terrorists at Villa Park", "Smells like curry (?!?) at Villa Park", etc.

They're a small minority of Chelsea fans, but they really are utter fucktards.

[Colly]

Yeah, I'd thought it was Robbie Fowler, but I'd struggled to find the quote specifically, so didn't want to attribute it to him just in case.

But yeah, the argument isn't as far fetched as JP makes it sound, like you said.

EDIT: I'd never make the Newcastle argument, though, admittedly >_>

The arguement was far fetched though. Judging people like Poulson so early and then trying to compare the Liverpool squad to the Newcastle one, now that's far fetched. Liverpool are a very good squad in one hell of a slump, it's that simple. The club is going through a hell of a lot, the entire squad seems to lack confidence and the manager doesn't seem to be getting enough out of everything. It's a combination of many things, it's not because they have a shit squad. I don't get why people are saying Johnson is shit, he's very good going forward and has recently been improving on his defensive work. Gary Neville was once one hell of a right back, but he wasn't amazing all the time at the back.

Shitting on people like Ngog and then calling Joe Cole a 'poor mans Ricardo Fuller' seems complete madness to me. Cole hasn't been all that good since arriving at Liverpool, but it hasn't helped that the entire team is under a slump. Cole was performing at a top level under Chelsea, acting like he's worst than Fuller is kind of bizzare. Wont even go into the Poulson matter, judging him already is again bizzare.

The Newcastle example was probably a little far fetched

At the time, it made no sense that a team with some proven winners and some up and coming talents could somehow collapse so drastically. I guess the point would have worked more if almost every Newcastle player from that season that got sold didn't dissapoint their new club. Martins didn't work at Woilfsberg, Owen got a few goals but failed at United, Bassong is an expensive rotation player for Spurs, Duff managed to break himself every other week at Fulham.

But the point was, when the season started it was widely assumed that the team would just click and they'd live up to their potential... history has since proved that most of the players in that squad weren't anywhere near as good as they thought.

Retrospectively, we could see the same happen with Liverpool IF they get relegated. I listed a bunch of players who appeared to be past it already at the club, and even other teams 'salvaging' players from the relegated squad could find themselves with fools gold. Players with potential that doesn't appear to exist anymore, players who were broken that no longer live up to their hype, and the odd one or two good players that do well that no-one actually expected to do well.

But that's just absolute speculation, Hodgeson could click next week and go on a mad 20 game winning streak or something. My point is that everyone just assumed things would get better for Newcastle at the time... and even buying players in January (like Nolan, Ryan Taylor) didn't do the job they expected to do. Just because the owners now have money doesn't mean that they'll buy players that instantly click.

And in a case like this, Newcastle can be a decentish comparison to Liverpool. Torres is a brilliant player... but then again, so was Owen. Torres has had so many hamstring injuries that he might have damaged himself a little too much to ever get his immense form back, only time will tell if this is actually true or not.

You're talking about at Manchester United? Not sure if you meant Newcastle or Man United, but if it's the latter, how the hell has he failed with us? He's still with us. Last time I checked he also rescued us a few weeks ago to savage a draw for us. He's actually a great player to have in our squad and has earned his place too. We've in the process of also developing young players in Hernadez and also Macheda, while Berbatov has finally found form, so it's no surprise Owen isn't always starting. He's far from failed though.

Please note yet again, I never said Newcastle that year were as good as Liverpool (just a little bit of defending my own club if thats a major problem), I did say that that Leeds team was though. I even said I think they'll stay up, but in terms of judging the likes of Poulson, Meireles etc its a very similar situation to Gutierrez, Coloccini, or Enrique, three top players who failed to get used to the Premiership in one season. Poulson and Meireles might, but if they don't that midfield area is a little shaky, especially if Gerrard has a bad run and Joe Cole doesn't rediscover his form. Oh, and ironically the Leeds player I forgot was Harry Kewell

Although thanks to the General for digging me a bit out of that hole. Not all the way unfortunately...

Edited October 18, 2010 by Colly

[Pesci]

There's a lot more El Zhars and Spearings in that Leeds squad than Poulsens and Lucases. I don't really think we're anywhere near as bad on paper. Performance wise probably, but that's not exclusively based on player quality.

[Asuka's Gonna Kill You]

Yeah, I'd thought it was Robbie Fowler, but I'd struggled to find the quote specifically, so didn't want to attribute it to him just in case.

But yeah, the argument isn't as far fetched as JP makes it sound, like you said.

EDIT: I'd never make the Newcastle argument, though, admittedly >_>

The arguement was far fetched though. Judging people like Poulson so early and then trying to compare the Liverpool squad to the Newcastle one, now that's far fetched. Liverpool are a very good squad in one hell of a slump, it's that simple. The club is going through a hell of a lot, the entire squad seems to lack confidence and the manager doesn't seem to be getting enough out of everything. It's a combination of many things, it's not because they have a shit squad. I don't get why people are saying Johnson is shit, he's very good going forward and has recently been improving on his defensive work. Gary Neville was once one hell of a right back, but he wasn't amazing all the time at the back.

Shitting on people like Ngog and then calling Joe Cole a 'poor mans Ricardo Fuller' seems complete madness to me. Cole hasn't been all that good since arriving at Liverpool, but it hasn't helped that the entire team is under a slump. Cole was performing at a top level under Chelsea, acting like he's worst than Fuller is kind of bizzare. Wont even go into the Poulson matter, judging him already is again bizzare.

The Newcastle example was probably a little far fetched

At the time, it made no sense that a team with some proven winners and some up and coming talents could somehow collapse so drastically. I guess the point would have worked more if almost every Newcastle player from that season that got sold didn't dissapoint their new club. Martins didn't work at Woilfsberg, Owen got a few goals but failed at United, Bassong is an expensive rotation player for Spurs, Duff managed to break himself every other week at Fulham.

But the point was, when the season started it was widely assumed that the team would just click and they'd live up to their potential... history has since proved that most of the players in that squad weren't anywhere near as good as they thought.

Retrospectively, we could see the same happen with Liverpool IF they get relegated. I listed a bunch of players who appeared to be past it already at the club, and even other teams 'salvaging' players from the relegated squad could find themselves with fools gold. Players with potential that doesn't appear to exist anymore, players who were broken that no longer live up to their hype, and the odd one or two good players that do well that no-one actually expected to do well.

But that's just absolute speculation, Hodgeson could click next week and go on a mad 20 game winning streak or something. My point is that everyone just assumed things would get better for Newcastle at the time... and even buying players in January (like Nolan, Ryan Taylor) didn't do the job they expected to do. Just because the owners now have money doesn't mean that they'll buy players that instantly click.

And in a case like this, Newcastle can be a decentish comparison to Liverpool. Torres is a brilliant player... but then again, so was Owen. Torres has had so many hamstring injuries that he might have damaged himself a little too much to ever get his immense form back, only time will tell if this is actually true or not.

You're talking about at Manchester United? Not sure if you meant Newcastle or Man United, but if it's the latter, how the hell has he failed with us? He's still with us. Last time I checked he also rescued us a few weeks ago to savage a draw for us. He's actually a great player to have in our squad and has earned his place too. We've in the process of also developing young players in Hernadez and also Macheda, while Berbatov has finally found form, so it's no surprise Owen isn't always starting. He's far from failed though.

Please note yet again, I never said Newcastle that year were as good as Liverpool (just a little bit of defending my own club if thats a major problem), I did say that that Leeds team was though. I even said I think they'll stay up, but in terms of judging the likes of Poulson, Meireles etc its a very similar situation to Gutierrez, Coloccini, or Enrique, three top players who failed to get used to the Premiership in one season. Poulson and Meireles might, but if they don't that midfield area is a little shaky, especially if Gerrard has a bad run and Joe Cole doesn't rediscover his form. Oh, and ironically the Leeds player I forgot was Harry Kewell

Although thanks to the General for digging me a bit out of that hole. Not all the way unfortunately...

My post was mostly aimed at General, who claimed Poulsen was laughable bad, despite only playing four games for Liverpool so far. This is the same Poulsen who has played for Denmark since 2001, had a great run at Schalke, made a massive impact at Sevilla in which he was voted the best signing in Spain that season and instantly helped them demolish Barca in the Super Cup and then went on to actually play well in a Juventus team that was being poorly managed at the time. Why shit on a player you've basically barely seen? Why even judge him four games into his career at Liverpool? Not to mention that he hasn't even looked bad since joining them. It's just comments like these that are sheer madness if you ask me.

[ONO]

Interesting piece in the Independent today about how Rooney can buy out his contract for £7.5m in January, £4.5m in the summer under the Webster ruling. Maybe United should have sorted out his contract before the World Cup after all.

United will have it sorted before January anyway. He'll either be sold or will be staying. I think he is off to be honest. The lure of close to £300k will be too much and United can't compete with that. What I noticed over the summer is that generally footballers are greedy bastards. Can't trust a single one.

Edited October 19, 2010 by ONO

[Noah]

Replace Wayne with John, problem solved.