The Survivor Thread

[RPS]

Yeah I've rewatched China 1 or 2 times. It's a great season simply because they focus so much on the characters and everybody to an extent is likeable. Even Jean Robert, who is a complete tool, is enjoyable at times. We know a bit about everybody and everybody seems to have a great storyline throughout the whole season. They cast the season perfectly and whoever edited did a great job of cramming everybody in. And the final 3? Probably the best final 3 the show has had in terms of anybody could possibly walk away the winner.

Edited June 30, 2011 by RockPaperScissors

[GoGo Yubari]

I'm enjoying Jean Robert quite a bit, but then I've known him for a couple years now due to watching the World Series of Poker Main Event on ESPN where he usually gets some attention both from having been on Survivor and also occasionally having a deep run (last year I think he placed somewhere around the top one hundred, which doesn't sound great until you factor in that that's out of like eight thousand).

Only people I outright don't like are Leslie (I am very, very sick of castaways who bring up Christianity every other confessional), and Denise just because, well, what's to like? I don't think she's gotten more than one confessional in the three episodes I've watched.

EDIT: Holy shit, the merge episode. Hysterical.

[The Quasi Juice]

Jaime is so annoying.

Jean-Robert in the merge episode <3 If he wasn't so shit in the social game he would be a pretty good Survivor player. He saw Todd has the ultimate power, not Amanda.

[GoGo Yubari]

Yeah, his social game was awful, and I think he leaned on his skill as a poker player too much, thinking it would translate to being good at Survivor (his "I'm going to do nothing and then start surprising them by doing more" idea in particular is something that seems very obviously adapted from poker strategy, but it doesn't take into account that first impressions on Survivor seem to go a long, long way). Plus he had a bad read on... basically everything post-merge, up until he had the right one and Todd got paranoid or something. I'm not done with the season yet but I definitely want to read into Todd's full strategy for this season because it's a mix of both really ambitious and occasionally really impulsive.

I also remember reading long ago that Jean-Robert was their second choice for a poker pro to put on Survivor. First was Daniel "Kid Poker" Negreanu, and that would have been incredibly interesting because whereas Jean-Robert was a strong challenge player Negreanu would have probably been a tremendous social player (but then, he also probably would have come into conflict with Todd early because they're both tiny cunning guys).

EDIT: One thing I find funny about the season is that it's basically a season chock-full of assholes and people willing to talk shit about everyone else. Especially Jean-Robert, Courtney, Todd, Sherea, and James.

[The Quasi Juice]

Hahahaha JR being drunk was awesome, 'the American Immunity Idol' :lmao:

Negreanu would probably have been recognized and they would have known he already has made millions, whereas JR is a lot less known. So I think JR was probably for the better.

Also, fuck Denise.

[bill_da_bill]

Finally finding time to watch season 8 - all-stars. Down to the final 5 now. I think the Rob/Lex thing got a little overblown. Rob did use him, but it wasn't as bad as I always heard that it was.

I found it rather funny watching Shii-Ann's attempts to "shake up the game" before being eliminated. She only lasted as long as she did cause she wasn't a threat to anyone and no one ever cared enough to vote her off.

[GoGo Yubari]

Well, to be fair to Shii-Ann her Immunity win and the fact that it led to Alicia going before her was pretty fantastic. The fact that she made a pretty tough endurance challenge look like a cakewalk whilst the likes of Rob and Rupert were looking miserable trying to beat her was awesome. I actually came out of All-Stars really liking her, a lot more than nearly anyone else who made it post-merge, possibly because she didn't really have a reason to be miserable and bitter; Survivor fucked her over way worse in Thailand than it possibly could have in All-Stars.

[bill_da_bill]

Yeah, I shouldn't make it sound like I hate her. I just found that tribal council to be kinda funny. As I keep watching though she may have been on to something cause these people are on EDGE. Her immunity win was one of the more impressive ones I have seen cause no one expected her to pull that out and she did it. And the fact that she butted heads with Jenna was also enjoyable. I don't dislike her, but I'm not really a fan. It was very easy to forget she was in the game until her number was up and than it was like, oh Shii-Ann is playing. Not an awful strategy I suppose, just not entertaining.

[GoGo Yubari]

Yeah, the thing about All-Stars is that both Kathy and Shii-Ann are completely right about the Chapera alliance and completely powerless to do anything about it. It's kind of a dire season post-merge, and that's why Shii-Ann gets a lot of goodwill from me for shocking everyone and temporarily delaying the inevitable.

And the other thing that watching All-Stars and Redemption Island has made clear to me is that the show doesn't have enough time to really get across just how brilliant a manipulator Boston Rob is. He's probably even better than Brian Heidik, really, because Brian had an easier assortment of people to mindscrew.

[bill_da_bill]

What Rob has done thus far in All-Stars tops what he did in RI in my opinion. In RI he led a bunch of gullible rookies to do whatever he wanted. In All-Stars he literally convinced everyone he needed to convince that he had their best interests in mind, than chose which ones suited his interests and went that direction. The reason no one listened to Kathy and Shii-Ann is that they all believed Rob was going to take them to the finall 3 or 4 and they thought they could make their move at that time.

I know inevitably he doesn't win, but he ran this game. He had some help with other tribes taking out some of the stronger players pre-merge, but he controlled a game with a bunch of fantastic players, impressive.

[bill_da_bill]

(Y) to Shii-Ann for her jury speech.

(Y) to Hatch for shutting Lex up at the reunion show.

(N) to Jerri for being an f'ing retard.

Edited July 4, 2011 by bill_da_bill

[The Quasi Juice]

I wish Hatch returned one more time, I think he'd do really well. He was plain awesome during All-Stars; one of the few guys that actually had fun out there and didn't look miserable 24/7. They got rid of him because he's Hatch, that's it. Whereas in HvV people were like; let's take former winners with us. I did agree that Ethan needed to go, he's waaaay too nice and good in challenges so he's one of those guys that could win twice.

Edited July 4, 2011 by The Quasi Juice

[GoGo Yubari]

If Hatch could have returned for HvV, he would have. He wasn't legally allowed to leave the country and seeing as he's back in jail again he'll probably never come back unless Survivor lasts long enough and actually does a season somewhere where he could actually play (Hawaii?). He had some fun moments on Celebrity Apprentice this year, though (bullying David Cassidy and being Borneo!Hatch in the first episode, returning for the final couple episodes as a team member for one of the finalists and treating it like he did All-Stars; "hey, it's a bunch of stuff I don't really care about, let me sit back and be snarky about it").

Also, Jerri had every right to react the way she did even if it was about as melodramatic as... well, everything Jerri does, that crowd was fucking awful. I loved the irony of her trying to point out that they are, in fact, human beings and not just the characters the edit makes them out to be only to get drowned out by boos. Oh, Jerri, you're the one who deliberately played villain in Outback.

I'm nearing the end of China now. All in all this is a really good season, with a much more well-developed cast than any season since... god, maybe Palau? Palau or Guatemala. A lot of this has to do with the fact that they mercifully trimmed it back to 16 castaways and they edited well enough that the people who went out early had proper focus (Ashley, Crazy Dave, Chicken, and Leslie were all really well developed before they went).

EDIT: China COMPLETE.

I agree with RPS' assessment of China's final three being the best one I've seen thusfar, but that's not the hardest accomplishment. Genuinely surprised that Courtney got more than one vote, even in spite of the fact that I assumed Frosti would vote for her and having watched Denise's speech. That being said, Amanda completely deep-sixed herself at Final Jury. Best final two post-All Stars for me is still Yul vs. Ozzy but in terms of actual final 3, China wins in a cakewalk.

Todd absolutely deserved the win, of course. No question.

On a related note to the Final Jury and just Final Jury in general, I am so amazed that people keep starting their speeches with "And I'd like to thank you all for being part of this magical adventure and helping me get to the final two." It's such a stupid thing to say.

EDIT II: Starting on Micronesia immediately and first thought is what the fuck, Jonny Fairplay seriously cleaned up for this season. Pity I already know what happens with him because for the first and only time he doesn't look like entirely like a scrawny verminous guy. Very strong lineup of returning players; I pretty much agree with everyone included.

EDIT III: Oh, he did it to impersonate Jeff Probst. That is beautiful. As usual, their utter contempt for each other is transparent and hilarious.

I love the selection of clips they used for the returning players too. Particularly Ami's, because instead of highlighting what a strong player she was in challenges and strategically, it's "oh, hey, remember when it turned out she was dating a girl? LESBIANS!"

EDIT IV: Nevermind, now that the buff's on it's back to normal Jonny Fairplay. God, he's so much fun to watch in this episode, that's the worst part.

FINAL EDIT IN THIS POST SWEAR TO GOD: Man, the Fairplay thing was weird and sudden. I was kind of expecting this big embarrassing affair where he cynically did it to just not be the first person voted out due to reputation and instead it's pretty sedate, and he even forces Jeff Probst to hug him on the way out which was hysterical. It's a pity that this will be the reason used to never bring him back because while I think "you quit, you don't get to play again" is a fair rationale it still means two of my favorites in Fairplay and Sue Hawk won't ever play again.

[GoGo Yubari]

Thoughts on Micronesia through episode five;

One thing I love about this season so far is that it really shows off how badass a successful Survivor veteran can be in terms of wilderness survival. The fact that the Favorites just breeze through shelter-building and food gathering like pros with not a weak link among them in contrast to the comedy of errors that is the Fans tribe. But it does, unfortunately, mean that the fans are at this point really just sort of laughable afterthoughts; it's like watching the Harlem Globetrotters vs. Those Losers the Globetrotters Are There To Beat. When the Favorites win it's because duh, of course they do, when they lose it's chalked up to complacency on their part as opposed to the Fans actually being any good.

Also, one of my favorite things about All-Star seasons is seeing how players adjust to playing a second time and how it works for them. Sometimes it doesn't at all; Lex's attempt at playing a cutthroat style in All-Stars was dreadful and led to him getting taken out by a real cutthroat player, and thusfar Ami's decision to play under-the-radar in Micronesia has only resulted in her being completely and totally out of focus and the only Favorite who hasn't gotten any focus whatsoever. Parvati's not really kicked into second gear yet, so the most interesting tactical change at this point is Cirie who isn't bothering to slide under the radar like she did in Panama and instead is playing really aggressive hardball strategy, and I'm kind of surprised it's worked both times she's done it up to this point. No clue how long she lasts in this one but it's fun to have her around because as a character she's become so well-developed. It's a pity that her moves have come at the expense of Yau-Man, but nobody was going to let him run deep again.

On the other hand, the fact that she got Ozzy and Amanda to flip on Joel was hysterical because holy shit was Joel bad at strategy. Trying initially to get Ozzy to vote out Cirie first was dumb, letting Tracy convince him to vote out Mikey B. over Chet was dumb, and the fact that he's gone whilst Chet is still somehow still in the game is hysterical.

And speaking of people desperately wanting Chet out, Jason at the Tribal Council where Mikey ended up going was so funny. The fact that he actually interrupted Jeff Probst when he was trying to get the vote started, with Probst pulling such a hilarious bitch face in response, was great.

Finally, I would like to properly apologize for ever even remotely dissing on Jonathan Penner. I was wrong. He rules, and the fact that he gives running commentaries on every challenge rules. Thusfar I am really, really enjoying the season. I'm usually fond of watching returning players do their thing, and this is such a strong field of them.

[RPS]

If you like pre-merge FvF, wait till post-merge. It's episode after episode with huge blind sides, so much comedy and about 3 or 4 of the dumbest moves ever on Survivor. It's pretty freaking unbelievable. Every episode is unpredictable.

Edited July 6, 2011 by RockPaperScissors

[Pizza]

Finishing up Vanuatu, I'm glad I watched it. Like you guys said, pre-merge was a struggle to get through, but post-merge was fantastic.

Pretty happy that Chris is going to win, he was a solid enough player and him breaking the girls alliance was pretty impressive. I didn't like him too much pre-merge, but in the end I liked him as a winner better than Vecepia or even Jenna. Eliza was hilarious, reminded me of Heidi. Her demanding apologies at final tribal council was great. Amy played a great game up until she decided to go along with voting Eliza instead of Chris, would have liked to see her do better.

Marquesas was a good comparison, in that the gameplay was interesting despite a mostly unlikeable or boring cast. Don't think Scout said a single word in the final 5 episode, which just seems absurd at that point.

Edited July 6, 2011 by pizzamonkey

[GoGo Yubari]

Regarding Marquesas;

I think you can make the same comparison between Chris and Vecepia as you can Boston Rob and Brian Heidik; incredibly similar playing style, but the former in both pairs did it with a lot more flair and charisma. I will always stick up for Vee as a Survivor winner, though, because she won pretty much the same way Chris did with the key difference being she beat the dominant alliance that seemingly had the game locked down in a different way, and with a lot more help (I'm not sure who the deciding factor in getting that alliance together was but I can't help but think it was Vee and Sean capitalizing on the work Rob did on Kathy).

I have now gotten to episode ten of Micronesia, a.k.a.

The Ozzy blindside episode. Holy fucking shit, that was incredible. Eliza's reaction after the final Ozzy vote was revealed really said it all, as did the totally assured "wait for it, wait for it, wait for it..." look on Cirie's face before that last vote is read. This season is well on track to join Borneo, Amazon, and Pearl Islands in the absolute top tier (China is borderline but definitely in that realm too).

Also, god, Jason. If he had gone out there he would have deserved it, even if I get the factors that went into stepping down.

[RPS]

That can't be the idol.

Why?

It's a fucking stick.

Truer words have never been spoken during Survivor.

[GoGo Yubari]

Hahahaha, yeah. Oh, Jason.

[RPS]

Oh wait till you see what happens to Jason...