Doctor Who

[marksbros6]

I liked the ep.

The way they dealt with Rose was good. It looked like she was going to die, then she was saved. Only to be stranded from the Doctor, never to come back again.

The re-uniting of Jackie and Pete was a nice send off for the characters, re-uniting the Tyler family. Having Rose working for the Parrellel Universe Torchwood was a nice touch too, she's still making a difference in her own way.

The 'Goodbye' scene was very poigniant. The Doctor 'Burning up a sun' just to say goodbye to Rose through the final crack in reality, in 'bad wolf bay' no less was an emotional ending to the first overall story arc of the 'new Who'. And not having him say 'I love you' to Rose was very sad, and final (though we the veiwer and Rose herself knew he was going to before he cut out). I'm thinking that she could come back at some point, as the scene lacked that final bit of closure, and Rose is arguably the only companion that the Doctor has loved. Phenominal acting by David Tennant and Billie.

As for the Dalek/Cyberman Smackdown I thought it was great. Interestin to see the Daleks get the upper hand, but as the oldest Who villians it was only fair. The Cybermen are still very scary, and who knows what will happen with them both stranded in 'the Void?' The Daleks 'Genesis Ark' being a Time Lord prison ship was interesting, I thought it might have been some form of stellar manipulator (like the 'Hand of Omega') but it was a nice touch. The 'Black Dalek' escaping via 'Temporal shift' was interesting, I wonder when he'll turn up again?

[Timmoru Suzuki]

It was a fairly decent episode, with a FUCKING BRUTAL last five minutes. That was hard watching.... Really so well written and acted its not true. I didn't cry, but my stomach went and if it had gone on a bit longer then maybe.... The "I love you" thing was great, but IT CAN'T END LIKE THAT!!! Its not fair! Just a great way to write Rose out...

The bride thing didn't bother me that much, probably because Tennant played it well. So long as its just for an hour on Christmas Day, I can live with the Bride.

[Dingle]

Thank fuck The Doctor didn't tell Rose he loved her or else I'd have cringed, openly weeped and not have believed in the mystery character the doctor has. It was only good that he didn't tell her he loved her and when they had Rose and the Doctor kiss last season, I wasn't happy.

The next big thing is to be the Time Wars hopefully and I shall be looking forward to seeing that.

Prison ship was awesome and it was a nice touch.

I wasn't a fan of the cyberpussy getting a last stand and managing o fight the cyber-ness.

I was swerved by the ending as I thought, bye bye Rose, seeya in another life brother. However, daddy tyler made the rescue and it was all alright. I hope the bad wolf thing didn't end there, because I would meh like a madman.

[Benji]

Thank fuck The Doctor didn't tell Rose he loved her or else I'd have cringed, openly weeped and not have believed in the mystery character the doctor has. It was only good that he didn't tell her he loved her and when they had Rose and the Doctor kiss last season, I wasn't happy.

The next big thing is to be the Time Wars hopefully and I shall be looking forward to seeing that.

Prison ship was awesome and it was a nice touch.

I wasn't a fan of the cyberpussy getting a last stand and managing o fight the cyber-ness.

I was swerved by the ending as I thought, bye bye Rose, seeya in another life brother. However, daddy tyler made the rescue and it was all alright. I hope the bad wolf thing didn't end there, because I would meh like a madman.

I think we've all learned there's no pleasing you when it comes to Doctor Who anyway because you can't let the little things, subtleties and nuancies go at all.

[ClaRK! Kent]

Jouzy is dead inside.

[therockbox]

Thank fuck The Doctor didn't tell Rose he loved her or else I'd have cringed, openly weeped and not have believed in the mystery character the doctor has. It was only good that he didn't tell her he loved her and when they had Rose and the Doctor kiss last season, I wasn't happy.

The next big thing is to be the Time Wars hopefully and I shall be looking forward to seeing that.

Prison ship was awesome and it was a nice touch.

I wasn't a fan of the cyberpussy getting a last stand and managing o fight the cyber-ness.

I was swerved by the ending as I thought, bye bye Rose, seeya in another life brother. However, daddy tyler made the rescue and it was all alright. I hope the bad wolf thing didn't end there, because I would meh like a madman.

[Timmoru Suzuki]

Alright, I'll admit bar the usual clips and bits of stuff you see and pick-up, I'd never seen any Doctor Who until the re-launch with Christopher Ecclestone, and then David Tennant. I'd always had a slight interest anyway, and loved the new series, so recently I've rented a couple of the classic series to watch.

First was 'Genesis of the Daleks', a Tom Baker story. I thought it was fairly decent, but not overall that great. The story was good, but over the six episodes, it dragged on a bit, and could have been done just as wel with say, four episodes. Still wasn't bad, and it was a Dalek story, so it can't be bad. Plus, Davros!

Then I rented 'Spearhead from Space', the first Jon Pertwee story. This was enjoyable, but contrary to Genesis, the four episodes seemed rushed, particularly since the first couple have the Doc lying in a hospital bed after his regeneration. Still the whole thing was very well done. It's six years older than Genesis, but looks newer, probably due to it being filmed on loaction since as its set on Earth, as opposed to the sets constructed for Genesis. The Doc isn't in it all THAT much, it is an intro into the roll really, but the story is very good, the Brigader is fantastic, its fairly well acted, and AUTONS! They come across so much better and are developed much more than they were in 'Rose' in series one. Generally a very fun, if short-lived story.

So, thats me getting into classic Doctor Who. Generally just set this up for talk and discussion about all classic who.....

[Benji]

There's no new Who on at the moment, stick it in here and keep up the discussion

[Timmoru Suzuki]

Sorry Benji.....

Lets get the who talk coming folks!

[Benji]

Sorry Benji.....

Lets get the who talk coming folks!

No need to apologise, any attempt at increasing discussion, especially over The Doctor, is always good in my eyes (Y)

[Stone Cold]

I hadn't seen any older Who so i bought The Five Doctors DVD a while back which was a TV Movie. I personally enjoyed it, involved all 5 Doctors although Baker is only in it for a very short while and the original Doctor is played by someone else. It also features Cybermen, Daleks and The Master.

[ClaRK! Kent]

Currently, I own the following on DVD/VHS. Roughly in chronological order...

Tomb of the Cybermen (Patrick Troughton)

One of the earlier Troughton stories available, and an absolute classic. He's phenomenal in the part here, really cleverly-played. Troughton's Doctor, as he looked like an intergalactic hobo, often acted bumbling and foolish in order to manipulate enemies, and that's shown excellently here. Jamie is the best Who companion of the old series, and does good here, and it's generally a really fun episode once you get over the "Hah it's so OLD~!" bollocks.

Death to the Daleks (Jon Pertwee)

Jon Pertwee serial, a bit confusing, but some cool Cold War references and dealing with temporal paradoxes and the lark. It's always fun! The Daleks are portrayed well here, as schemers and tacticians, as opposed to monosyllabic killers, so yay them. Not great, but a fun Dalek episode.

Revenge of the Cybermen (Tom Baker)

Tom Baker's... fifth serial, I believe. He's still settling into the part here, but you'd never know it. He plays the Doctor so wonderfully, very aloof and alien at times, but then very human in others. A great comedic performance from the Cyberleader, unintentionally of course but hah! Camp, OTT, and very fun indeed. Plus, it features a hot Liz Sladen. This VHS holds a sentimental spot for me, 'cos I won it in a Blue Peter competition when I was but a lad of 12.

City of Death (Tom Baker)

Probably one of the more unusual stories, this one was written by Douglas Adams, and features an alien who can travel in time by 'copying' himself across the timeline, who convinces Da Vinci to paint seven copies of the Mona Lisa so he can steal the original in 1978 and then sell them all on the black market. The dialogue is witty and irreverant, as you'd expect from Adams, and Baker plays it wonderfully. Romana is also bitchen in this one.

Warriors of the Deep (Peter Davison)

Peter Davison, Turlough, and Tegan face SILURIANS! And SEA DEVILS! In a battle of wills and gills. Hah. Really fun 4-part serial, drags on a teensy bit, but there's a lot to set up in this far future Earth, where 2 power-blocs are on the verge of total nuclear annihilation at the touch of a button, and if in danger a computer program takes over the missile run and can't be shut off. The Silurians/Sea Devils almost use this to their advantage, but everybody ends up getting killed instead. Davison's Doctor is very human, very vulnerable, and extremely bitter at the end of the episode, with all the death.

Resurrection of the Daleks (Peter Davison)

One of my favourite Dalek episodes. Star-studded celebrity cast (Rula Lenska, Leslie Grantham, Rodney Bewes, etc) and a great bit of Dalek plotting across 2 time zones make this a fantastic story, which never feels long across 4 episodes. Tegan leaves at the end of this one, after all the killing, and it really affects Davison's Doctor, which is sweet. Go him.

Caves of the Androzani (Peter Davison)

Fifth Doctor's swansong. Peri's first 'real' episode as a companion, having debuted the story before IIRC. She gets sick with a virus whilst on the planet, there's the usual dastardly villainy, and finally the Doctor has only enough antidote for one person. He saves Peri, and regenerates. His last word - "Adric?" - suggests his former companion's death has really stayed with him, which is so sweet. Plus, Colin Baker's first lines of dialogue PWN.

The Two Doctors (Colin Baker)

Two of my favourite Doctors from the original run, the Second and Sixth, team up to face some Sontaron do-baddery and some genetically-enhanced savages in modern-day Spain. Really fun idea, great interaction between the Doctors and their companions, and a great ending. The coolest thing is that a few minor continuity flaws in this episode, and in The Five Doctors, led to an entirely new "season" of Second Doctor stuff in between his final adventure and the Third Doctor's first. Season 6B, as it is known, contains the coolest original Doctor Who fiction around.

Rememberance of the Daleks (Sylvester McCoy)

What's not to love? Ace! Daleks! The Seventh Doctor! Meta-references! Going right back to the beginning! A truly awesome story, bringing out the Doctor's ruthless, devious and manipulative side. As Ace puts it, he is "well devious" here. Plus, this contained some hints to the so-called Cartmel Masterplan, named after script editor Andrew Cartmel who was using these hints to try to add some mystery to the Doctor's character once again. These hints were expanded upon in the original fiction, but are wicked cool here.

Ghost Light (Sylvester McCoy)

A fantastic Seventh Doctor story. Alien forces perverting history, whilst the Doctor forces Ace to confront her past in this one. A bit cruel, but really cool to watch, even if he does make her cry. A lot. But it's all for her own good. Really love this story.

The Curse of Fenric (Sylvester McCoy)

The second-to-last story of the original series, coming right after Ghost Light. Set in a remote naval base during WWII, the Doctor and Ace discover a cipher machine is being used for deadly alien purposes. Some really fun stuff with Fenric, who has been pursuing the Doctor for ages it finds out, and manipulating several of his companions' lives to bring him to this meeting - including Ace, who is briefly possessed and tries to kill him. Probably in revenge for Ghost Light.

The Movie (Paul McGann)

A very underrated story, actually. Okay, so it's a bit American, and McGann kisses his companion. So did Eccleston, and Tennant wanted to. Aside from those gripes, this is a great story. The Master is played to perfection by Eric Roberts, it has a real 'big-budget' feel to it, and the writing is top-notch. McGann would've been a very good Doctor, IMO, had the series been picked up. Bloody Yanks.

I desperately want more Troughton and Colin Baker, as well as some William Hartnell. The trouble is loads of the older episodes were wiped by the Beeb, and Baker's entire third season was Trial of a Time Lord, which isn't out on DVD at all. And a couple of his other stories were pants when I saw them on TV.

EDIT: Wow. I just went back and looked at some of my first posts in this thread. My opinions on the old series have really taken a radical shift in the past three or four months.

I should probably, thus, point out that I've bought most of these DVDs in the past six or seven weeks with the final dregs of my loan. Only had the Movie, Tomb of the Cybermen, and Revenge of the Cybermen before then, really. Watching these episodes again on DVD has really changed my opinion of some of the old Doctors, as has reading a few of the novels and researching the old series for a possible project in the running (Cube... watch out!). I'd probably totally rejig my ordering of the Doctors now. McCoy, especially, gets a very bad rap from a lot of people (even me, before) but I've really come to respect him a lot more, and the writing of his episodes was much better than I remember it being.

I'll redo my "Doctors in order" list here. Maybe you'd like to post your own? I'll include Tennant now he's had a full series...

1. Patrick Troughton

2. Tom Baker

3. Sylvester McCoy

4. Colin Baker

5. David Tennant

6. Peter Davison

7. Christopher Ecclestone

8. Jon Pertwee

9. William Hartnell

10. Paul McGann

Yeah, big change. McCoy goes from being one of my least liked to one of my favourites, Tennant enters highly, and Troughton reigns supreme as the coolest Doctor of all time. He's a freakin' genius. I still maintain Tom Baker wasn't the best, but he was very close to Troughton. Ranking them like that actually makes the lower ones look very bad - I haven't seen so much Hartnell, and McGann of course only had one episode. I really liked Pertwee and Ecclestone, and I love David Tennant... it's a really close-run field, but you've gotta be ruthless. (Y)

Edited July 25, 2006 by Sephiroth Clone

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

McCoy WAS an excellent Doctor. He's just had a lot of hate for some reason. Maybe cos it's so 80s or something. Ace was coolios (Y)

[ClaRK! Kent]

It's 'cos he was the Doctor when it got cancelled, plus the manipulative, darker elements weren't wildly popular for what was seen as more of a kid's show, I guess.

In the novels, the Seventh Doctor is fucking badass.

[Timmoru Suzuki]

For me, Eccie was better than Tennant. By a fairly decent stretch. Not that Tennant is bad at all, I really like his doctor, I just thought Ecclestone was immense.

I'm looking forward to your Dr. Who diary already. It'll be interesting to see how you write it and pull it off, but the ideas should be good and the diary should be great.

Expecially if it has Autons.

And maybe some Ood.

Edited July 25, 2006 by timmayy

[Benji]

I'm shocked at the Eccie preference of so many people, to me Tennant feels more like The Doctor than an actor playing him, he seems a lot more natural in the role and something about Ecclestone never sat right with me.

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

I'll agree with Benji as usual.

Ecclestone is an incredible actor but he wasn't a great doctor.

Tennant's been very good except when they try to make him "zany" or "smug"

[ClaRK! Kent]

For me, the reason is fandom.

Yeah.

Ecclestone... great actor. But you could tell he viewed it like any other part, really. A lot of his interviews on Confidential were kinda indicative of that to me. "...oh yes, well I don't think a 'costume' in the traditional sense, is really relevant for the character in the 21st century..." or "...I like the filming structure, it gave me a lot of time off in the year to maybe do a play, or anything else I wanted to pursue..." He was just an actor, playing it.

Tennant, however, has been a Who fan since he was 3, according to... well, him. Right before the Christmas Invasion, he wrote a guest article in the Independent's weekend magazine, where he discussed how much he loves the show, etc etc. I'm pretty sure Eccie wouldn't have been able to namedrop John Nathan Turner, Andrew Cartmel, Roger Delgado, and the Sontarans all in one article.

Doctor Who is Tennant's boyhood dream, so he's clearly going to be more enthusiastic about it than anybody else.

[Timmoru Suzuki]

Fair enough. I know Tennant is a huge fan and its like a boyhood dream of his, so I have no doubt he maybe has a love for the role that Ecclestone never did. I do think Tennant has been very good as the doctor as well. For me, Ecclestone had a certain quality that makes you watch him though. He has a way of making everything exciting and every scene seem important, he did everything well. Plus, the fact he's a fucking awesome actor helped too. I liked the 'manic' performances from him, it added a certain 'tempo' for lack of a better word.

Tennant has been great though, when he doesn't have to be intimidating. He isn't intimidating.

Edited July 25, 2006 by timmayy

[ClaRK! Kent]

Yeah. He doesn't do intimidating well in Who, oddly enough. In Secret Smile, on ITV, and in Harry Potter, he was creepy as fuck.

But the Doctor's never really supposed to be intimidating. He just kinda tries to act hard, but he wouldn't hurt a fly.