The 2010 NFL Thread

[JStarr]

This class is filled with quality corners, but Patrick Robinson isn't one of them. Speed doesn't make a corner good, btw.. and that's all Robinson has going for him, speed. Can't cover worth a lick. And regardless, Arizona will not be taking a corner in the first few rounds unless the value is off the charts (IE: Joe Haden in the 1st, or Kareem Jackson/Devin McCourty in the 2nd), guaranteed.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize I was talking to an NFL GM.

18. Pittsburgh Steelers: Arrelious Benn, WR Illinois

The Steelers aren't taking a WR in Round One.

Especially not with Pouncey and Iupati still on the board.

Seriously? He gives his opinion on the mock draft that you asked for thoughts on and you bitch about him not being an NFL GM? :lmao:

Dude, it's the Internet. When people ask for "thoughts" on something they've posted, it's usually code for "tell me I'm a genius."

[Mysterio2000X]

This class is filled with quality corners, but Patrick Robinson isn't one of them. Speed doesn't make a corner good, btw.. and that's all Robinson has going for him, speed. Can't cover worth a lick. And regardless, Arizona will not be taking a corner in the first few rounds unless the value is off the charts (IE: Joe Haden in the 1st, or Kareem Jackson/Devin McCourty in the 2nd), guaranteed.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize I was talking to an NFL GM.

FSU is a big-time school that is constantly on TV. And, if I noticed how overrated Patrick Robinson is while watching FSU, I can sure as hell guarantee you NFL personnel types did, as well.

But whatever, you clearly have no idea what the fuck you're talking about, so this is futile.

18. Pittsburgh Steelers: Arrelious Benn, WR Illinois

The Steelers aren't taking a WR in Round One.

Especially not with Pouncey and Iupati still on the board.

The value between a potential #1 WR superstar and an RG/C isn't even close, are you kidding me? Especially considering Ben's targets (assuming he isn't traded, in which case this whole mock goes out the window) are a very old Hines Ward with only a year or two of production left, and a glorified slot receiver in Mike Wallace. But, you're the Steelers' homer here, so you may be right. I just don't think an organization as smart as this takes an interior lineman over someone with Arrelious Benn's skillset.

Most of those guesses seem likely, but I disagree that Benn is going to Pittsburgh, the Seattle picks and that Baltimore leaves Gresham on the board.

I thought of Gresham there, but I think he falls for whatever reason. Some teams may be scared away by a player that is that big and that soft (he cant block worth a lick), but you're right, Baltimore could just as well take Gresham there.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[sahyder1]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

[livid]

OL is a much bigger need for the Steelers than WR is which is why they wouldn't take Benn there.

Need to make sure the QB can throw before you draft people to throw to.

[mystikz]

imo Seattle would be dumb to not take Spiller with either of there 2 picks. Julius Jones was beyond awful and Forsett is OK. I don't see Cleveland taking Clausen either. Clausen is way overrated and should drop. If Cleveland doesn't take McCoy I could see them waiting and taking Pike or LeFevour.

[sahyder1]

imo Seattle would be dumb to not take Spiller with either of there 2 picks. Julius Jones was beyond awful and Forsett is OK. I don't see Cleveland taking Clausen either. Clausen is way overrated and should drop. If Cleveland doesn't take McCoy I could see them waiting and taking Pike or LeFevour.

Pro teams are going to have more faith in Clausen compared to the average college QB because they trust that Weis has prepared him for the Pros.

[Mysterio2000X]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

OL is a much bigger need for the Steelers than WR is which is why they wouldn't take Benn there.

Need to make sure the QB can throw before you draft people to throw to.

Yes, but the value between taking a potential superstar WR (Arrelious Benn reminds me A LOT of Anquan Boldin, and the only reason he doesn't get much love is because Juice Williams was absolutely terrible, and between Juice & injuries, his production was well below what it should have been) and an interior lineman is pretty substantial. It's a value pick through and through, as they could still pick up an interior lineman later in the draft (Vladimir Ducasse or Jon Asamoah in the 2nd, for instance), where as the only other person who is on Benn's level in terms of natural talent and potential is Dez Bryant. I just think Benn offers more bang for their buck as opposed to an interior lineman righ there.

imo Seattle would be dumb to not take Spiller with either of there 2 picks. Julius Jones was beyond awful and Forsett is OK. I don't see Cleveland taking Clausen either. Clausen is way overrated and should drop. If Cleveland doesn't take McCoy I could see them waiting and taking Pike or LeFevour.

RBs can be taken in nearly any round, and the Seahawks are in no position to compete immediately that they can take a flyer on a luxury pick like Spiller, in my opinion. They'll probably just go BPA (which Spiller isn't), with a focus on the offensive line/offensive tackle position.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[LL!]

Seriously, guys.

That deserves to miss an entire season.

[sahyder1]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

Out of curiosity how many Rutgers games did you watch in the past 3 years?

[Mysterio2000X]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

Out of curiosity how many Rutgers games did you watch in the past 3 years?

Past 3 years? Fuck knows, but from what I've seen of him this year (vs. WVU, vs. Cincinnati, and bits & pieces vs... I don't remember, I want to say Pittsburgh, but I'm not 100% sure, as well as some highlight/lowlight packages on him), he didn't look like anything remarkably special. Regardless, the biggest reason I think he drops is because of his character concerns, and he doesn't have the consistently elite tape to overcome such question marks. This is such a weak OT class that, if not for those character concerns he'd probably be the 2nd or 3rd OT off the board, but it's just not worth it for a team to take this big of a risk on him.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[sahyder1]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

Out of curiosity how many Rutgers games did you watch in the past 3 years?

Past 3 years? Fuck knows, but from what I've seen of him this year (vs. WVU, vs. Cincinnati, and bits & pieces vs... I don't remember, I want to say Pittsburgh, but I'm not 100% sure, as well as some highlight/lowlight packages on him), he didn't look like anything remarkably special. Regardless, the biggest reason I think he drops is because of his character concerns, and he doesn't have the consistently elite tape to overcome such question marks. This is such a weak OT class that, if not for those character concerns he'd probably be the 2nd or 3rd OT off the board, but it's just not worth it for a team to take this big of a risk on him.

Take it from a season ticket holder. He had a brutal game vs Cincy and heard it from the crowd. He was solid the rest of the reason. At the end of the season some mock drafts had him as high as 5. Yes, he was suspended for a game for a "violation of team rules." It was never released what happened but it wasn't some legal issues otherwise it would have come out especially since the Star Ledger was really digging into Rutgers those days. It is partly the Star-Ledger here in NJ but this is the 2nd straight year they've tried to taint a RU prospect . He didn't impress at the combines but in retrospect some people have put that on his injury which ended up making him miss his pro day. He was a lock for a top ten pick up to that point but a bunch of teams did come to Piscataway to watch him work out later. Mcshay, PFT guys, Kiper, etc. have all been singing his praises and the worst I've seen on any board so far is 17th to the 49ers and I like I mentioned before, that is a worst case scenario. He was one of the top ranked offensive line recruits 3 years ago from Piscataway High School and chose to play at home. His problems are what dropped him from 5 to the middle of the round. He's not going to drop any further. I'll be shocked if he did.

On the other hand I think you have McCourty too high. Don't get me wrong, he's going to be a very good pick up for someone but I see him more in the Jets draft pick range. He's got a great upside.

Edit:2/13/11 edit to fix quote tags

Edited February 13, 2011 by sahyder1

[Mysterio2000X]

Take it from a season ticket holder. He had a brutal game vs Cincy and heard it from the crowd. He was solid the rest of the reason. At the end of the season some mock drafts had him as high as 5. Yes, he was suspended for a game for a "violation of team rules." It was never released what happened but it wasn't some legal issues otherwise it would have come out especially since the Star Ledger was really digging into Rutgers those days. It is partly the Star-Ledger here in NJ but this is the 2nd straight year they've tried to taint a RU prospect . He didn't impress at the combines but in retrospect some people have put that on his injury which ended up making him miss his pro day. He was a lock for a top ten pick up to that point but a bunch of teams did come to Piscataway to watch him work out later. Mcshay, PFT guys, Kiper, etc. have all been singing his praises and the worst I've seen on any board so far is 17th to the 49ers and I like I mentioned before, that is a worst case scenario. He was one of the top ranked offensive line recruits 3 years ago from Piscataway High School and chose to play at home. His problems are what dropped him from 5 to the middle of the round. He's not going to drop any further. I'll be shocked if he did.

On the other hand I think you have McCourty too high. Don't get me wrong, he's going to be a very good pick up for someone but I see him more in the Jets draft pick range. He's got a great upside.

That's your opinion and that's fine, you're probably right (about where he will go), I just think teams will be more willing to take a chance on guys who are more naturally athletic and have higher ceilings (Trent Williams/Bruce Campbell/Rodger Saffold) or guys who are more technically sound (Bryan Bulaga/Charles Brown) simply because none of those players come with the perception of being lazy and having a poor work ethic. The one absolute thing that all front offices hate is a player who will not work to the best of his abilities, and that's the type of persona Anthony Davis has presented himself as through his shitty interviews/inconsistency issues.

Yeah, I think McCourty's too high there, too, but the Texans's primary need right now is CB, and it wouldn't be all that outlandish for them to reach for Devin (who, again, may be perceived as having a higher ceiling than Kareem Jackson). But you're right, in an ideal world he would be on the board until the very first handful of 2nd round picks, but I just thought he made a lot of sense going to the Texans.

[Damian WayLNKe]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

OL is a much bigger need for the Steelers than WR is which is why they wouldn't take Benn there.

Need to make sure the QB can throw before you draft people to throw to.

Yes, but the value between taking a potential superstar WR (Arrelious Benn reminds me A LOT of Anquan Boldin, and the only reason he doesn't get much love is because Juice Williams was absolutely terrible, and between Juice & injuries, his production was well below what it should have been) and an interior lineman is pretty substantial. It's a value pick through and through, as they could still pick up an interior lineman later in the draft (Vladimir Ducasse or Jon Asamoah in the 2nd, for instance), where as the only other person who is on Benn's level in terms of natural talent and potential is Dez Bryant. I just think Benn offers more bang for their buck as opposed to an interior lineman righ there.

imo Seattle would be dumb to not take Spiller with either of there 2 picks. Julius Jones was beyond awful and Forsett is OK. I don't see Cleveland taking Clausen either. Clausen is way overrated and should drop. If Cleveland doesn't take McCoy I could see them waiting and taking Pike or LeFevour.

RBs can be taken in nearly any round, and the Seahawks are in no position to compete immediately that they can take a flyer on a luxury pick like Spiller, in my opinion. They'll probably just go BPA (which Spiller isn't), with a focus on the offensive line/offensive tackle position.

All of your playmakers come from the first two rounds now. 5 of the 6 Pro Bowl running backs this season were taken in the first two rounds and the other was Frank Gore, a third round pick, would have been higher if not for his injury in college.

[Mysterio2000X]

To be fair though Mysterio, what is your justification for Davis at #27 when this was a guy in the 5-10 range on most mock drafts just a month or so ago and even now I don't see him dropping past 17th.....and that is in a worst case scenario.

Anthony Davis is overrated on the field, and his shitty personality should scare plenty of teams away that I wouldn't really even be surprised if he fell out of the 1st round completely (though it would be very unlikely, I admit). Overrated, lazy and a poor attitude? Who'd want to invest millions upon millions of dollars in that?

OL is a much bigger need for the Steelers than WR is which is why they wouldn't take Benn there.

Need to make sure the QB can throw before you draft people to throw to.

Yes, but the value between taking a potential superstar WR (Arrelious Benn reminds me A LOT of Anquan Boldin, and the only reason he doesn't get much love is because Juice Williams was absolutely terrible, and between Juice & injuries, his production was well below what it should have been) and an interior lineman is pretty substantial. It's a value pick through and through, as they could still pick up an interior lineman later in the draft (Vladimir Ducasse or Jon Asamoah in the 2nd, for instance), where as the only other person who is on Benn's level in terms of natural talent and potential is Dez Bryant. I just think Benn offers more bang for their buck as opposed to an interior lineman righ there.

imo Seattle would be dumb to not take Spiller with either of there 2 picks. Julius Jones was beyond awful and Forsett is OK. I don't see Cleveland taking Clausen either. Clausen is way overrated and should drop. If Cleveland doesn't take McCoy I could see them waiting and taking Pike or LeFevour.

RBs can be taken in nearly any round, and the Seahawks are in no position to compete immediately that they can take a flyer on a luxury pick like Spiller, in my opinion. They'll probably just go BPA (which Spiller isn't), with a focus on the offensive line/offensive tackle position.

All of your playmakers come from the first two rounds now. 5 of the 6 Pro Bowl running backs this season were taken in the first two rounds and the other was Frank Gore, a third round pick, would have been higher if not for his injury in college.

So why not hope for a Jahvid Best in the 2nd, or Dexter McCluster in the 3rd? They both offer the exact same thing Spiller does, and both present way better value compared to where they will be drafted. No need to reach for a Percy Harvin/Darren Sproles/Reggie Bush-type player in the top 15.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[livid]

Well, for one, Spiller doesn't have nearly as much of a liability concern as either Best (concussions) or McCluster (tiny frame scares people off) and Spiller is also viewed as being more of a complete back than Best and McCluster.

Not to mention that most people rate Spiller quite highly; the only reason he wouldn't go in the Top 15 is teams having bigger needs than RB to address; more specifically OL where it wouldn't necessarily pay to draft a talented RB if you don't have an OL anyways.

[Mysterio2000X]

CJ Spiller is no more a complete back than either Best OR McCluster; all of them are Reggie Bush-esque players who can run, receive and return, but don't necessarily excel at just one area and shouldn't be expected to excel at just one area. In fact, I honestly think Best is the most likely to come close to a Chris Johnson-type of player (a smaller guy who is SO fast that teams will have no choice but to make him the focus of their running game), but that may just be me. I just don't think Spiller is that special, and should only be taken on as a luxury (similar to Percy Harvin last year).

EDIT - But you are right, teams do have a more important positions than RB to address, and that includes the Seahawks. I just don't see it, but who knows what Carroll is looking for.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Mysterio2000X

[sahyder1]

From twitter user @danavictoria

[Mysterio2000X]

"Put me down for at least three QBs to go in the first round and quite possibly four - Bradford, Clausen, McCoy and Tebow."

http://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter

If Schefter says it, then it must be true.

[Evil Chase K]

The value between a potential #1 WR superstar and an RG/C isn't even close, are you kidding me? Especially considering Ben's targets (assuming he isn't traded, in which case this whole mock goes out the window) are a very old Hines Ward with only a year or two of production left, and a glorified slot receiver in Mike Wallace. But, you're the Steelers' homer here, so you may be right. I just don't think an organization as smart as this takes an interior lineman over someone with Arrelious Benn's skillset.

Ben won't be traded, that's really a non-issue that ESPN keeps hyping to get more people to watch the draft.

The Steelers like some WRs that will be available in later rounds. Ed Bouchette wrote an article saying that he doesn't expect the Steelers to take a WR early.

The Steelers feel they can get good WRs later in the draft and I agree. A guy like Pouncey would be a great fit for the Steelers because he can play both Center and Guard (which Tomlin loves) and he would be an immediate upgrade over both starting guards and the starting center.

You try not to take an interior O-Lineman that early unless you're confident he's a sure thing, and Pouncey is the closest to a sure thing the NFL has seen come along in quite a while.

[sahyder1]

Ben won't be traded, that's really a non-issue that ESPN keeps hyping to get more people to watch the draft.

Steelers were by all accounts ready to cut him had he been charged.....you seriously still believe that they wouldn't trade him? Respected guys like Schefter, Mayock and Mortensen that Steelers have called around shopping him today. Read that again. They didn't sit back and listen to offers.....they shopped him around today. Excuse us but we're going to choose to listen to those guys. I mean had we listened to you we'd all have bought into the "He's going to get suspended for only one game" talk you were trying to sell.