The Survivor Thread

[Mx. Canadian Destroyer]

I agree. Recently, Jeff Probst has been pretty candid about some of the casting stuff and how he's had some disagreements with the network about who is on the show. I think the biggest reason a pre-merge boot season wouldn't happen is if the network thinks there wouldn't be enough star power to warrant a returning player season. 

It seems more possible now than ever really as the season usually starts with a big theme to draw and drum up interest at the beginning of the season. 

 

[Azazel]

What are some of the other gimmick seasons?  I can see the full list of what they are called but some of them rather confusing.

Redemption Island is obviously the season someone stated before where players can come back in the game but I feel like its all new people.

One World?  I have no idea what that could possibly be if anything.

Blood vs Water I assume has something to do with family members

Worlds Apart is about as clear as One World in that its not at all.

Millenialls vs Gen X is obviously old people vs young people

Game Changers I would assume is another allstar like season for people who had a huge impact on how the game is played.

[Mx. Canadian Destroyer]

Nicaragua is young vs. old tribes.

Redemption Island has two returning players (ala Stephenie and Bobby Jon). The twist being that when someone is voted out, they go to Redemption Island and compete in weekly duels. At the merge and Final 5, one person returns from Redemption Island.

One World; both tribes live on the same beach.

Blood vs. Water; one tribe of returnees, one tribe of their loved ones.

Worlds Apart; one tribe of people with Blue Collar jobs, one of White Collar Jobs and one of No Collar jobs (a jewelery salesman, someone from YouTube, etc.)

You are correct about MvGX and Game Changers. There have also been two Brain vs. Brawn vs. Beauty seasons. 

[Azazel]

So Nicaragua and MvGX is basically the same?  I wasn't sure what to expect for Redemption Island but that sounds kind of neat.

The One World thing I love, that was literally the only good thing about Thailand and it only lasted like one episodes (well and Robb choking Clay and then bitching about it after).

World's Apart only seems neat because of the return of 3 tribes.

Blood vs Water I didn't expect them to be playing against their loved ones.

I would love to see a season with no tribes.  Just dump 20 people on an Island.  Immunity challenges would start being done as teams randomly, they could be split into 2, 3 or 4 teams and everyone on the winning team doesn't even go to tribal to vote until there are only 10 left.  That would make alliances insanely tricky since you won't even know who is getting a vote until the challenge is done.

[Alex.]

All winners season is seriously needed.

[RPS]

There is also a season where three players who were removed from the game due to health reasons return. All of the players who end up returning are players you have seen. 

[Azazel]

I'm trying to remember who got taken out for health reason.  Michael, Russell, Chef Mike, Jonathon, Papa Smurf and James.... I think that is it.  Michael and Russell would be guarantees and the third I would probably guess between Jonathan and James.  If one of them is on Heroes vs Villians I would guess the other one.

Shambo has officially joined the Twila/Lillian level of making me not want to finish the season because I can't stand them existing.

[RPS]

Shambo has been asked back but turned it down. Fame was not for her. 

[Azazel]

I'm really hoping at some point there is someone that returns that I would have never expected to see back, the surprise return of Greg from Borneo or Flicka.  More hilariously would be someone who got voted out first one season and they see if anybody even realizes they've played before.

[Alex.]

2 hours ago, Azazel said:

I'm really hoping at some point there is someone that returns that I would have never expected to see back, the surprise return of Greg from Borneo or Flicka.  More hilariously would be someone who got voted out first one season and they see if anybody even realizes they've played before.

heh

[RPS]

10 hours ago, Azazel said:

I'm really hoping at some point there is someone that returns that I would have never expected to see back, the surprise return of Greg from Borneo or Flicka.  More hilariously would be someone who got voted out first one season and they see if anybody even realizes they've played before.

There are a number of pleasant throwback surprises that return. You'll be pleasantly surprised. 

[Azazel]

Gonna watch the finale for Samoa tonight and probably at least start Heroes vs Villians to see who is on it.

I'm not sure why my friend loved Samoa, but I guess if he liked Russell a lot that is the only reason why.  Brett is in the final 5 and has had like 3 confessionals the entire show so far.  I would normally hope that he ends up pulling out the win but with how irrelevant he is from a production stand point I doubt he makes it to the finals, otherwise I felt they would have showed him at least someone in the first 10 episodes.

The only interesting thing about this season is the fall of Galua.  Going from 8 vs 4 in the merge, they got cocky and eliminated one of their own.  Then Russell used the idol to take out another.  With Shambo being an idiot they ended up in a tie situation where John took the worst possible option and swapped.  Then that was it, Foa Foa just demolished them because of a single dumb vote with 12 people left.  I really don't get John's thoughts on the tie situation.  Basically whoever flipped would get 6th place at best.  Whatever tribe lost the rock draw would get 6th place at best.  Whatever team won the rock draw would be garunteed 1st to 5th.  It's shitty to put your fate up to chance but swapping was by no means the better option here and I'm glad they voted off John next.

[Mx. Canadian Destroyer]

I reaaaaally liked Brett, but mostly because I didn't like Russell and I thought Brett was cute. 

[RPS]

Azazel, it is hard to explain why people liked Samoa and Russell without watching the seasons as they aired. People really enjoyed the chaotic and frenzied nature of Micronesia and that sort of disappeared in Gabon and Tocantins, where you saw a majority alliance form and they picked off the rest one by one after the merge. People got a taste of the chaos of Micronesia and loved it. 

Russell was a recruit to the show. He had never watched Survivor. Boo from Fiji recommended him to the recruiter of the show. And now this is very important - when you are cast for the show and before you hit the beach, they give you DVDs of select seasons to watch. Russell was given Micronesia to watch. Which makes a lot of sense - Russell is over eager to play his idols (because two players go home in that season with an idol) and he plays aggressively (because that is what Parvati and Cirie does). But remember - Micronesia is the outlier. Chaos, frenzy and over the top game play rarely wins you the show. But Russell sees Micronesia and thinks that is the standard, not the outlier. 

What also does Russell in is something which I think reflects on his lack of perception. Micronesia has a lot of trash talking. Ozzy, Cirie, Parvati - they all trash talk the fans and each other in their confessionals. But everyone is pleasant to each other's faces. Russell, when he plays, cannot keep his mouth shut. He is over the top, abrasive, egotistical when he is talking with people. Parvati may mock James behind his back in a confessional, but she knows that she has to be nice to him in the game so he does not target her and so he hopefully gives her a million dollars to win. Russell does not really understand this idea of being nice to everyone around you. It becomes more apparent very soon.

So in essence, Russell takes away from preparing for the show - idols are the most important part of the game and you should use them liberally, you need to be play aggressively and hard, and it is fine to be over the top, in your face, egotistical. Which is fantastic TV. A lot of people like watching somebody like that. But that is a terrible Survivor player. So people at the time loved Russell because they gave them what they wanted - crazy tribals where anything can happen with an over the top character who thinks he is the greatest player ever. But, as I've pointed out, that type of game play is very rarely ever going to be successful, especially if you are openly insulting people. 

[Mx. Canadian Destroyer]

Is Russell Survivor's version of Trump?

[Azazel]

RPS and the ongoing history of Survivor is the best.  The scary thing is if that is all Russell knows, he's doing a pretty damn good job to make it to the final 5 after his tribe sucked (though that could be a lot his fault) and turning a 8 to 4 disadvantage to having his 4 in the final 5.  What he is doing is working so far at least, though I have no idea if it will work when it comes to jury votes.

I personally like getting different types of seasons.  Going from a chaotic season to a more mellow season with likable people is good variety for someone binge watching the show since I go from "I hope X wins" one season to "I hope Y loses" the next.

I wonder who would be classified as the best player ever?  It would have to be a former winner since losing can't make you the best.  Earl or J.T. jump out simply because they pretty much dominated the game and got a clean sweep in the final tribal council.  J.T. was never voted against once and Earl only got 1 vote.  J.T. also won the fan favorite vote (but that didn't exist when Earl won).

[Alex.]

Its hard to say who is the best player ever. Challenge and physical wise, Ozy and James are up there. Strategical, Parvati, Russell, Richard Hatch are all up there. Its a very tough question since most cannot be objective about it including myself.

[RPS]

21 minutes ago, Azazel said:

I wonder who would be classified as the best player ever?  It would have to be a former winner since losing can't make you the best.  Earl or J.T. jump out simply because they pretty much dominated the game and got a clean sweep in the final tribal council.  J.T. was never voted against once and Earl only got 1 vote.  J.T. also won the fan favorite vote (but that didn't exist when Earl won).

There is two camps of thought as to who is the best player ever. 

There is judging somebody exclusively by their record. And, I will not spoil who, but there is somebody who indeed wins Survivor twice. I won't say if they have a flawless record, but somebody has won the game twice. Many people say they are the best player because they won twice and their record speaks for themselves. 

There are others who say that while that is technically true, there is a whole lot of winners who never come back and get a chance to prove themselves. So while the person who wins twice is certainly impressive, you cannot really compare, for example, a player like Vecepia, who only played once against this player. 

What is also difficult is that so much of why we enjoy players is their personality. It is hard to separate their personality from their game play. So somebody like Danni from Guatemala is less celebrated than somebody like J.T. because J.T. was a better personality and gave better confessionals. 

If I recall at the time, I thought the best players around Samoa were probably Earl, Todd, J.T., and Tina. Each of them played the game in a different, unique way but all of them had consistent traits. Though, my opinion has changed and I am more of the opinion that the person who wins twice is probably the best player ever. 

23 minutes ago, Azazel said:

RPS and the ongoing history of Survivor is the best.  The scary thing is if that is all Russell knows, he's doing a pretty damn good job to make it to the final 5 after his tribe sucked (though that could be a lot his fault) and turning a 8 to 4 disadvantage to having his 4 in the final 5.  What he is doing is working so far at least, though I have no idea if it will work when it comes to jury votes.

Some people perceive Survivor as making it to the end and that is the sole purpose of the game and you do so by any costs necessary. Which is both misguided and smart. Smart because a) you at least get to plead your case and b) you get more money the longer you stay in the game. It is misguided because ultimately you have to convince people to give you the money, which is very difficult if you were an asshole. 

[Azazel]

A double winner eh?  I hope its Ethan or Tom.  I would laugh if it was like Sandra or Brian.

That just gave me an idea for another special season.

20 castaways who lost at final tribal.

[Mx. Canadian Destroyer]

7 minutes ago, Azazel said:

20 castaways who lost at final tribal.

 

While the entire season isn't that, Second Chances sort of has a bit of some of the previous seasons ideas you've tossed around. Nobody returning has won and has only played once before, so you get a mix of folks who went out relatively early, people who lost at final tribal, people who were the last boot before the final, people who haven't played since the early seasons, etc.