The essential artists of this century

[GoGo Yubari]

I think Kanye West will be THAT rapper that we all talk about years and years and years from now. Maybe I'm just a fanboy, and I overestimate the value of his body of work, but I think in time, all of them will hold up as classics, some moreso than others, and some of them in time will get more love, like they should (808s and Heartbreak). MBDTF is definitely his crowning moment, I think. It can only go up from there, and then came Watch the Throne, which is another album I think a lot of people right now don't really like, or "get", but in a few years, you'll listen to it again and realize how fucking amazing it is.

I definitely agree with you that Kanye's going to be one the guy who defines this decade/generation when it comes to hip-hop. Much more than Eminem or Jay-Z, especially since Jay-Z isn't really a product of this generation but more a holdover from the last one, the same way I wouldn't call The Rolling Stones icons of the '70s or '80s or whenever. Kanye West has the critical acclaim, the commercial success, the fairly consistent greatness (at worst there's 808s but that's been assigned by critics as "great artist goes through dark period in life, releases music that reflects it") and almost as importantly he just has the persona. He's going to be a guy that people discuss in retrospect for sure, and as it stands right now it won't be with the asterisks you'd have for an Eminem.

[Skummy]

Who are we going to still be listening to in 50 years and reminiscing with our friends about how important they are? This isn't really about your personal tastes: obviously your personal tastes will help you choose, but it's more about asking who are the classic, essential, untouchable artists who we hold the test of time and remain vital in the future.

Would it be elitist of me to say "no one"?

A few years back I worked on a yacht that threw private parties all the time and I can say that there are a great many more "timeless" songs from the '60s/'70s/'80s/'90s just because everything didn't sound exactly the same back then. There was no Autotune or the same 4 producers making all of the albums and the same handful of writers writing all of the hits. When you consider that Gaga, Katy Perry and Ke$ha are responsible for most of the pop hits lately, I don't think it's wrong to say that in 2021 we'd have a hard time looking back at the best songs of the 2010's fondly if we didn't like that specific sound. How many rap songs of the last decade are probably most well known for an R&B hook? or R&B songs with a great rap hook? In short, with everything being homogenized we don't have many standouts.

"Get off my lawn!"

Same four producers making all the albums? How about Phil Spector producing The Ronettes, Ike & Tina, The Crystals, Darlene Love, The Paris Sisters and pretty much every other great pop record of the '60s, and later in life The Beatles, John Lennon, Leonard Cohen, and The Ramones? Or the likes of Motown and Stax churning out records by the ton? Tin Pan Alley?

The notion that "same four producers making all the albums" is a product of the 21st century is absurd. If anything, we're further from that now than we have been in the history of popular music.

And do you think, in the '80s, people were expecting that, twenty years time, kids would be dancing to Rick Astley, Spandau Ballet, or even Madonna in nightclubs? It was assumed to be ephemera then, just as you're assuming the likes of Lady GaGa, Ke$ha or whoever will be for the next generation. There's really no way of knowing if that will be the case.

That said, I almost agree with "no one" as the essential artists, but I don't think that's a bad thing. The lasting impression of the last decade in music will be of the increase in portable music, and in easily obtainable music (and music production software) rendering the idea of there being a handful of "important" bands deservedly obsolete. Unfortunately, though, it may also end up being responsible for the death of the album, which would be a sad thing.

As an aside, I'd say that Scott Walker's The Drift is the essential album of the century so far. Not in the sense that it will inform all future music in the way that "classic" albums of the past have, necessarily, but in the sense of being the first album I've heard this decade to genuinely feel like something entirely fresh and unique, like nothing else I have ever heard, yet impossible to recognise as being of any particular time. The only thing which comes close is Runhild Gammelsæter's solo album, though that's far more esoteric and experimental - The Drift, while at times jarring and on the avant-garde side, still unmistakeably has songs.

[RPS]

Rock: Radiohead. There were five bands I really considered when it came to rock music - Radiohead, The White Stripes, Arcade Fire, the Foo Fighters and Green Day. I instantly tossed Green Day out - they really are iconic for releasing American Idiot and I think that since 2004, it's really hard to see their influence on anything. The Foo Fighters have been consistent, but I don't think consistency is enough. The Arcade Fire I could see a case being made for, but I think Neon Bible holds them back. It was praised when it came out, but nobody really talks about it anymore. It was tough to decide between the Stripes and Radiohead, but I think the White Stripes teetered off near the end of the decade. They started off strong with two of the hottest albums and than didn't really maintain their momentum. Radiohead I think encapsulated the decade of rock music - experimenting with electronic music, being able to adapt to the rise of the internet, 5 "good-to-excellent" albums, and the fact that they are arguably the most influential rock band of this decade.

Pop: Beyonce or Justin Timberlake. Considering both started off the decade in huge groups and went onto more successful solo careers, I think both will be considered. I'd put Beyonce ahead of Justin because she managed to nail out four albums this decade while Justin only managed two. I think if Justin was able to release another album somewhere in the decade, I think he'd definitely be at the top of this decade.

Hip-Hop: Jay-Z. I disregarded Eminem because dude seemed like a parody of himself midway through the decade (Ass Like That, anybody?). Outkast released three albums, two of which were amazing and one which was very meh. Kanye West was close, but I think Jay-Z eclipses. Kanye West probably was more consistent, but Jay-Z released 11 albums (7 solo, 4 collaborations) this century and really solidified himself as the Frank Sinatra of rap music, in my opinion. I think his success with the Blueprint 3 also really helps him - above average album, but the singles were huge and really solidified Jay-Z in the mainstream again.

Electronic: M.I.A.. I actually had a tough time with this one. I thought about Daft Punk, but they only released 2 studio albums (one of which was panned upon release), 1 film score (which received an overwhelming meh) and 1 live album. Sure, they had mainstream appeal and recognition, but they barely did anything throughout the decade. I thought about LCD Soundsystem, but for reasons listed above, put them aside. Another act who could fit the bill - the Gorillaz. Than I thought... M.I.A. The girl defined internet blog hype in 2004, released a hugely successful and influential mix-tape helped launch the career of Diplo, released 2 albums that were great in defining the schizo nature of the 21st century, made it huge with Paper Planes, performed at the Grammy's alongside the Kanye West, Jay-Z, Lil' Wayne and TI. I think the only thing holding her back is 2010, when the girl went absolutely crazy. She attacked Lady Gaga and Justin Bieber, she accused the CIA of owning Google and Facebook, had Sri Lanka and others calling her a terrorist, pissed off Diplo and the New York Times and than released Maya, which was divisive and definitely out there.

[naiwf]

Same four producers making all the albums? How about Phil Spector producing The Ronettes, Ike & Tina, The Crystals, Darlene Love, The Paris Sisters and pretty much every other great pop record of the '60s, and later in life The Beatles, John Lennon, Leonard Cohen, and The Ramones? Or the likes of Motown and Stax churning out records by the ton? Tin Pan Alley?

The notion that "same four producers making all the albums" is a product of the 21st century is absurd. If anything, we're further from that now than we have been in the history of popular music.

I was trying to include the producers and writers together. The vast majority of pop music that's put out these days isn't necessarily being written by the artists that "sing" the songs. I obviously wasn't around in the '60s, but I would imagine that there weren't entire albums that had 5+ writers/producers etc on every song that weren't part of the band back then. Maybe it's the reality show culture, but it almost seems as though having any sort of musical talent is the last thing one needs to become a star in the music industry today and that's why I don't really see anyone who has come out post 2000 as "essential". If you're pretty enough or have the "it factor" someone will write all of your lyrics, play all of your music, make you sound as though you can actually sing, come up with your look and all you have to do is lip sync and pander to the crowd during live shows. Now that I think about it I blame Milli Vanilli for this!

[Jimmy]

I'd argue Eminem will probably be looked back in years time because of his massive mainstream success and he has put out some quality offerings. The Eminem Show is still my favourite album of all time and I really don't think it puts a step wrong. I definitely agree with Kanye, but I wouldn't be suprised if 'Em was looked back on with similar regard - the only things holding him back would be a few average albums, something Kanye hasn't quite done yet. But Eminem did a lot for rap music at one point.

I'd throw Artic Monkeys in there as well for kind of setting off the ressurection of the indie scene we had a couple of years back. Their first two albums are probably enough for people to reference them for years to come. Obviously they haven't made a global impact, but as far as national music goes, AM were very influential.

[Colly]

Same four producers making all the albums? How about Phil Spector producing The Ronettes, Ike & Tina, The Crystals, Darlene Love, The Paris Sisters and pretty much every other great pop record of the '60s, and later in life The Beatles, John Lennon, Leonard Cohen, and The Ramones? Or the likes of Motown and Stax churning out records by the ton? Tin Pan Alley?

The notion that "same four producers making all the albums" is a product of the 21st century is absurd. If anything, we're further from that now than we have been in the history of popular music.

I was trying to include the producers and writers together. The vast majority of pop music that's put out these days isn't necessarily being written by the artists that "sing" the songs. I obviously wasn't around in the '60s, but I would imagine that there weren't entire albums that had 5+ writers/producers etc on every song that weren't part of the band back then. Maybe it's the reality show culture, but it almost seems as though having any sort of musical talent is the last thing one needs to become a star in the music industry today and that's why I don't really see anyone who has come out post 2000 as "essential". If you're pretty enough or have the "it factor" someone will write all of your lyrics, play all of your music, make you sound as though you can actually sing, come up with your look and all you have to do is lip sync and pander to the crowd during live shows. Now that I think about it I blame Milli Vanilli for this!

You definitely weren't around in the 60's, barring mebbe lip syncing that was all the case.

[RPS]

Yeah. I typed a response and accidentally deleted it. I hate saying people are wrong, naiwf, but it's flat out wrong. Example: Michael Jackson only wrote four of the songs on Thriller. Madonna wrote about half of the albums on her albums. Aretha Franklin made a career off covering other people's works. Whitney Houston wrote one song of the Bodyguard Soundtrack. Today, lots of pop stars do actually write their own stuff. Off the top of my head, I know for a fact that Justin Timberlake, Beyonce, Adele, Lady Gaga all have majority writing credits on a lot of their work. Heck, even somebody like Ke$ha, who is miserable, writes her own stuff (and other people's songs, including Britney Spears songs)

[Guest mr. potato head]

This last decade sucked. I'm borderline writing it off altogether.

Obviously you can't say the 00s sucked for music with a straight face, but there is a point there. Nothing in the past decade has had any influence beyond pre-existing music communities...there's been nothing revolutionary. The music industry is becoming more and more fragmented and thus falling further and further from being able to create anything as important as The Beatles or NWA or what have you.

[naiwf]

Yeah. I typed a response and accidentally deleted it. I hate saying people are wrong, naiwf, but it's flat out wrong. Example: Michael Jackson only wrote four of the songs on Thriller. Madonna wrote about half of the albums on her albums. Aretha Franklin made a career off covering other people's works. Whitney Houston wrote one song of the Bodyguard Soundtrack. Today, lots of pop stars do actually write their own stuff. Off the top of my head, I know for a fact that Justin Timberlake, Beyonce, Adele, Lady Gaga all have majority writing credits on a lot of their work. Heck, even somebody like Ke$ha, who is miserable, writes her own stuff (and other people's songs, including Britney Spears songs)

He may have only written 4/9 songs on Thriller, but there are only 11 total writer credits according to wikipedia. Beyawnce's latest album has 52 writing credits and 37 producer credits for 12 songs. That's what I'm getting at.

Edited September 29, 2011 by naiwf

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

What the internet has done has made everything available but made everything less special.

The last three actual music phenomena I can think of are Lady GaGa, Justin Bieber and the Arctic Monkeys.

[apsham]

I never really understood why people whine about the state of music these days when there is still so much amazing work coming out of the past ten years - not to mention how much easier it is to bring the work of smaller artists to the forefront and attention of people who would otherwise, never have the chance to experience it all. I've read through everyone's responses here and I still don't get it - even if there hasn't been anything groundbreaking, I don't see why there needs to be exactly.

And just because something hasn't happened for the majority of the industry - there are genres of music that have gone through tremendous change over the past decade for better or for worse, and that has impacted the people who enjoy those particular types of music in ways that could rival industry wide changes.

[Hobo]

Beyawnce, naiwf? Really?

[Matt]

I never really understood why people whine about the state of music these days when there is still so much amazing work coming out of the past ten years - not to mention how much easier it is to bring the work of smaller artists to the forefront and attention of people who would otherwise, never have the chance to experience it all. I've read through everyone's responses here and I still don't get it - even if there hasn't been anything groundbreaking, I don't see why there needs to be exactly.

And just because something hasn't happened for the majority of the industry - there are genres of music that have gone through tremendous change over the past decade for better or for worse, and that has impacted the people who enjoy those particular types of music in ways that could rival industry wide changes.

Yeah I said something similar to this in the pub the other week, my mate said something like "music has generally been pretty shit since the mid-90s" and me and my other mate went through and listed probably 30 great albums and then a whole bunch of other good ones.

[Skummy]

Yeah. I typed a response and accidentally deleted it. I hate saying people are wrong, naiwf, but it's flat out wrong. Example: Michael Jackson only wrote four of the songs on Thriller. Madonna wrote about half of the albums on her albums. Aretha Franklin made a career off covering other people's works. Whitney Houston wrote one song of the Bodyguard Soundtrack. Today, lots of pop stars do actually write their own stuff. Off the top of my head, I know for a fact that Justin Timberlake, Beyonce, Adele, Lady Gaga all have majority writing credits on a lot of their work. Heck, even somebody like Ke$ha, who is miserable, writes her own stuff (and other people's songs, including Britney Spears songs)

He may have only written 4/9 songs on Thriller, but there are only 11 total writer credits according to wikipedia. Beyawnce's latest album has 52 writing credits and 37 producer credits for 12 songs. That's what I'm getting at.

How is that what you were getting at? In your previous post your argument was that "the same 4 producers" were responsible for everything - now your argument is that there are too many producer credits on a single album - surely that's almost the exact opposite of what you first said?

The producer is a growing role in music, because the technology exists to make it so. If they had the production quality we have now available in the 1960s, they'd have used it too. I don't see it as necessarily a bad thing.

As for writing credits, that's almost solely a financial thing. If you get a writing credit, you get royalty payments - that's why the likes of Bieber get them.

With the exception of the rise of the internet - and even that probably has its analogies - there's nothing in the music industry that's a new thing. Reality TV creating pop stars is really no different to the debutantes, models and "It Girls" that were given record deals in the '60s, and some of the biggest names in music barely, if ever, wrote their own material - Michael Jackson, Elvis, Sinatra, and so on and so on.

At the end of the day, though, it's going to be impossible to know who's going to make a lasting impression until a few years down the line - some of the most influential bands of all time barely sold a record during their "prime", but it's the actions of those inspired by them that give them their reputation later on.

[GoGo Yubari]

Beyawnce, naiwf? Really?

N'Sync? More like N'Stynk!

I think Beyonce is probably at present the right answer for pop. If Lady Gaga is actually consistently successful over the next few years this might change because I think she impacts culture in a way Beyonce doesn't, but even then Beyonce is still the shining example of what pop was for like the first eight years. I can't really count Justin Timberlake because while I don't think quantity is the best criterion the dude only released two solo albums and then focused way more on his acting career.

[Matt]

Beyawnce, naiwf? Really?

N'Sync? More like N'Stynk!

I think Beyonce is probably at present the right answer for pop. If Lady Gaga is actually consistently successful over the next few years this might change because I think she impacts culture in a way Beyonce doesn't, but even then Beyonce is still the shining example of what pop was for like the first eight years. I can't really count Justin Timberlake because while I don't think quantity is the best criterion the dude only released two solo albums and then focused way more on his acting career.

Justin Timberlake has an acting career?

[Herr Matzat]

I can see Warpaint getting somewere big. Great yet somewhat compatible Music, good looking girls... sounds like something that might get to a point were it´s relevant.

Obviusly Arcade Fire.

Radiohead still work, even if they build in rainbows on or kid a their past sucses it still was an important moves. (you could say the same for some of the stuff Trent did with NIN, or Pearl Jam selling almost every show they play to kill the black marked bootlegs ((and charting with more albums at the same time than anyone elth ever did in the proces)

You could say The Gorillaz are a Band of this century (first Album was 2001), i love them to death... but all in all it´s build a lot of what Deamon did in the 90s and stars from even further back.

Same goes for a lot of what Jack White does, lot´s of amazing stuff, giving old music a mixup with more modern rock and bringing it to new younger people. But it´s more inspired than inspiering to do new. (actualy the white stripes only started out in the early 2000s aswell, so you might argue)

Problem with these is that they had the propper MTV, thats just missing today (in the sens of you will not see a "harder" Band like RatM or SoaD rise to become a Festival Headliner for the next 20+ years - as two examples)

Now on to the real new commers.

The Arctic Monkeys are more than just a fun indy band, always evolving. And obviusly how they somewhat grew out of an online fanbase or something is an important milestone aswell. - Vampire Weekend could end up in the same direction we´ll have to see... same goes for "The XX"

Maybe the Strokes, even if i feel their debut (2001) was the Strongest the still produce good music and play large crowds.

The Mars Volta on a smaler scale, they are not mainstream but a ton of musicians know and admire them.

LCD Soundsystem

Coldplay (started 2000)

Ryan Adams (also starting 2000)

The National (oh how much i love the National!)

I also think Amy Whinehouses music will be played for a long time.

[GoGo Yubari]

Beyawnce, naiwf? Really?

N'Sync? More like N'Stynk!

I think Beyonce is probably at present the right answer for pop. If Lady Gaga is actually consistently successful over the next few years this might change because I think she impacts culture in a way Beyonce doesn't, but even then Beyonce is still the shining example of what pop was for like the first eight years. I can't really count Justin Timberlake because while I don't think quantity is the best criterion the dude only released two solo albums and then focused way more on his acting career.

Justin Timberlake has an acting career?

Is this meant as a diss? It's a pretty ineffectual one.

[New Damage]

The Killers have a good claim too. I'm not an 'indie' guy, but Hot Fuss is a wonderful album, especially the first 5 tracks or so. There's a reason why Mr. Brightside is the the most logged song on Last.fm, too.

[Sousa]

For the record, I much prefer Justin Timberlake's acting to his music. He was in Black Snake Moan and was even better than Sam Jackson mostly phoning it in.

In answer to the thread's question, though, Alter Bridge.