Potential Changes to Mod Making

[Gabriel]

I just wanted to post a quick thank you to everyone for engaging in the conversation. It's a hot topic that most of us feel really shouldn't be, but it is what it is.

Until a moderator says otherwise, assume that the rules were the same as before and be respectful of each other. Ask for permission from other mod makers if you want to use their stuff.

That being said, anything that I upload is fair play so long as you're not trying to undercut myself and the team that comes together here... and credit to the original mod is given in the posting of the new one.

I will be making the official post for the June 2002 Mod after I make some lunch, to figure out who wants to contribute and in what way. Anyone who has already mentioned it, I will be tagging you in the post so that you can reply with what you'd like to do if you didn't mention something specifically. Others mentioned more specific things, and so I have them set to do that. If I have you set, but you'd prefer to do something else, just reply in that topic or shoot me a DM and we can change that.

Aside from that, please try to keep the conversation civil. Let's not give anyone a reason to believe that they are right about our board being inferior or elitist. Instead, let's just put in the work and re-grow the community here.

 

[LUKIE]

4 hours ago, The Christmas Fork said:

I have no problem with a rule that credit is given. To me that’s common courtesy. I messaged Genadi over a year ago in an attempt to use his 87 mod as a base for creating an 89 scenario. He wouldn’t respond to me.

I then messaged Matt Shannon (who as far as I.know is not part of the group) regarding his 88 scenario for the same reason and was denied as he was told The Mod Squad was working on one. Apparently they’ve been working on like 8 mods and accomplishing nothing.

The Mod Squad is working on one, so no one else can? The fuck is that nonsense?

It has literally boggled my mind that with the way TEW16 was setup with the importing features and I assume what Adam had in mind that people would create universal assets that could be imported to make the mod making easier and more streamlined so more mods could be released. The fact there isn't just a universal file regularly updated for things like title histories, arenas, gimmicks, etc. is more about how disjointed the community is as a whole then anything else. The fact there is a group of people not willing to lend their resources is proof that they want some kind of brand recognition, and not really wanting to create mods to service a fan-run community.

Sounds like they can't even do the basic asset creation amongst themselves anyway.

[IDOL]

On 16/12/2018 at 11:54, The Christmas Fork said:

Well they can't really do anything about it, but it's more a respect thing. They have some of the better mod makers in their group but I feel like their little group has slowed progress on mod making more than it's helped the community as they claimed it would.

They’ve brought it to a screeching halt to be fair. They also won’t let anyone else host their mods, so when their forum goes away in time, so will all of their mods that they “protect.”

[Draevyn]

Are none of the mods posted? Because I have them all on my computer so while I respect the "ask to use"....I will not respect the childish "If we can't own them then nobody can use them BS"

[IDOL]

Also, Genadi’s anti-EWB complex apparently stems from him being a member at one point and getting flamed, which did happen a lot years ago, but doesn’t happen anymore. He should grow the fuck up about it and move on.

[Draevyn]

It's EWB. We've all been flamed for one thing or another...

[Sean O'Game]

5 hours ago, The Christmas Fork said:

Are none of the mods posted? Because I have them all on my computer so while I respect the "ask to use"....I will not respect the childish "If we can't own them then nobody can use them BS"

They're only shared within their public discord group afaik.

[LUKIE]

Yeah they aren't difficult to find elsewhere.

[lanky316]

I'm sure most of you will have a passing interest in TEW 20 and seen the latest announcement and suddenly it all makes a lot of sense why this discussion has come up.

 

#6: TEW2020 save game to database converter

I think this is one of the more requested features over the years, so I'm glad to finally be able to include this one.

TEW2020 contains a new feature which turns a save game directly into a new database. It's located in the Options menu (right above the existing button to make an MDB file). The resulting database then works like any other mod - you can edit it via the main editor, use it to launch new games, etc.

(I know some people only skim read these posts, so I'm just going to highlight that this is converting a TEW2020 save game into a database. It does not mean you can continue TEW2016 saves in the new game.)

This could potentially be useful in a number of ways. If you're playing and end up with a particularly interesting game world, this would be a great way to turn it into a mod and share it with people. I'd imagine it's going to be incredibly useful for those of you who like playing organic mods. It's also has a lot of potential for ageing scenarios - for example, you might take the default data, run ten years, and then use this to create a "CornellVerse 2030" mod. It's also going to be good for creating "what if?" scenarios.

As the resulting database is made directly from the save game there shouldn't ever be any need to do any subsequent work to make the mod playable, although as I'm guessing most people strip out the unused avatars at the start of each game you might want to do a quick import to add some back in.

The one thorny issue that this does bring up (at least on these boards, this wouldn't be a problem elsewhere) is the ownership of the database you create if you are playing a game based on someone else's mod. For example, if you play 10 years into the future and use this feature, the resulting database is going to have literally tens of thousands of changes to it. Could you then be considered the co-creator? If the game world is utterly unrecognisable is it realistically a new piece of work? Would you need the original maker's permission to distribute it? I'm really not sure what the best way to handle this will be. What I suspect we'll do is just play it by ear post-release and see what the general feeling is.

You can see his thinking and reasoning in the bottom and now it makes sense and I can see why the discussion was required. A diary writer (or indeed a random player comments on a "what's happening in your game" thread) plays out a historical mod and some major events happen in there due to the game engine random events or through actual gameplay decisions that become interesting. As a base example a megastar suffers a Kenny death or a major scandal destroys their career. An AI company pushes someone completely unexpected to the moon or -and this is unlikely as a lot of historical mods have historical debuts so it's harder to happen - somewhere like Australia or the UK become the big powerhouse nation with two or three huge companies and unknown top talent coming on to the scene over the 40 years played/watched. People tend to ask about the universe that's been created and there's all the questions about the game worlds that get formed and on occasion you do see people who ask if it would be possible to play that save, a whole new database imported straight in makes that easier.

I can see Adam asking the question and polling being a prelude to this announcement and his comments on that debate as to whether it's a whole new mod or not being the main focus. If I've started a playing a mod set in the 70s that Person X set up and due to a whole host of things have happened people are curious to pick it up in the early 90s with 20 years of random progress and developments. Does it count as a new "mod", due to the number of random generated wrestlers, promotions and other developments that have happened almost make it unrecognisable from what  

On the whole it's not something that will affect me personally to any real extent, while I have ideas and storylines and play the game quite happily. I don't have the time or ability to write an epic narrative of a match or anything like that so the diary writing leading to people asking if they could pick up my game is out.  I've never had the patience to follow through on any of my Lankyverse concepts to completely build up something let alone anything that would be played for any period of time enough to have "spin off" mods from. Also a lot of historical mods to play haven't stuck with me brilliantly due to the comment I made above about historical debuts, I always struggle to resist metagaming and just picking up the people I know will have huge potential and become megastars and just using them, that's if I've not gone somewhere with a bit of a gap in the modders knowledge or entered a real world talent vacuum and am left bored and giving up.

[Lineker]

8 minutes ago, lanky316 said:

(at least on these boards, this wouldn't be a problem elsewhere)

Of course it wouldn't. The fact that it's a problem anywhere is mind-boggling. What an absolutely stupid line of argument.

 

Come home, @Adam Ryland!

[LittleDaniel]

6 hours ago, Lineklaus said:

Of course it wouldn't. The fact that it's a problem anywhere is mind-boggling. What an absolutely stupid line of argument.

 

Come home, @Adam Ryland!

What do you mean come home?  He never left, he just mostly hangs out in the private forum where we hoard all our epic mods.

Did you...not get the invite?

[=BK=]

Genadi got the banhammer. As did one other Mod Squad dude.

[Naitch]

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when they find out about their bans and the discussion which will no doubt happen in their own private circle.

[Shawn Michaels]

The only thing this discussion achieved for me was for me to get back to posting in EWB, which I don't know if I have ever done with this account (Had another one but forgot the details, and that one was older) or for how long it has been, even if I go reading as much as I can. I just wanna say I voted yes because mods should be freeware and credit should always be given. That's my opinion. I post on GDS, I posted here before and am posting now, i'm on the Nexus discord and posted on their site when they existed. I'm not against anyone and i like the mod squad's mods, but I simply have my opinion about it and I think mods should be freeware with credit given, period. So I voted in favor of freeware. I mean...if the goal is to help the community, why would there be an issue? Props to you guys for conducting a poll without needless drama. Will come back to post more.

Edited December 21, 2018 by Shawn Michaels

[LUKIE]

16 hours ago, =BK= said:

Genadi got the banhammer. As did one other Mod Squad dude.

Absolutely no loss.

[Rocky]

Can’t wait for the Jenadi mods to start appearing on EWB.

[Jacob Jones]

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Edited August 8, 2020 by Jacob Jones
Hoping to have post deleted as I no longer wish to have them on this thread

[Gabriel]

Well, welcome back to EWB to everyone who has started posting here again. Hopefully we can provide a more cordial, more together community for mod making for you. Please don't abandon GDS though. It's the main board for Adam and the TEW series, and there are a lot of good mod makers over there who still deserve your attention.

Plus, we're assholes too sometimes.

[The Lusophone]

Fuck you I'm a delight.

[Jacob Jones]

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Edited August 8, 2020 by Jacob Jones
Hoping to have post deleted as I no longer wish to have them on this thread