LOST Season 5 *SPOILERS*

[Dingle]

And they won't be dead. Think of it as a reset button to everything we hav ever seen on LOST's main timeline.

[Pesci]

Which would be bullshit. Hopefully it didn't work, I want to see

Spoiler: Click here to view

ANGRY SAWYER RAGE AT JULIET DYING

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and I take it that detonating an H-bomb within inches of her would've finally got the job done... and if not, he'd probably presume she's dead anyway

Edited May 15, 2009 by Pesci

[Your Mom]

This is such bullshit. So they are starting over?

[Asuka's Gonna Kill You]

Spoiler: Click here to view

Wow, just wow. What an episode, possibly my favourite to date. That was just amazing from start to finish.

What a scene when Julliet looked like she was dying for sure, it'll be interesting to see whether she has or not. And did she actually set the bomb off or was that just a fancy outro to make us believe she did?

And who the heck is the other guy involved with Jacob? I thought Christian/Christopher or whatever his name is, that's got me greatly interested. Damn I'm even more confused now than I was before. Just so many things in there, but that's really the reason that I love this show.

There's not really much more to say. I'm no wiser than I was before, there's even more to be answered now. Just a fantastic episode, now to cry as I wait months and months for the next season.

[Chris the Human]

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Something I was just thinking ... about the cabin, I wonder if that was even really Jacob's cabin to live in and not the home that he somehow put his enemy/shape shifter guy in and the ash was something used to keep him in there? And took control of Christian's body?

It would make a lot of sense. Circles of ash, salt, silver are associated with binding mythologically speaking. It's strange. In their initial exchange, I got the impression that 'Jacob' was the bad one - but the episode changed that drastically. I think that might be the best single episode character I've ever seen. I do hope we see a little more of him in the final season

Amazing episode!

[Downward Spiral]

Spoiler: Click here to view

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! JULIET!

If she is dead I will be completely and utterly pissed off.

Melodrama aside - what an episode. The early stages turned me off somewhat but once the story got going, I found it absolutely fasinating - the twist with Locke at the end was genius and my boyfriend and I pretty much didn't sleep last night talking over what had happened. These 'new' losties from Ajira are a great addition, and I'm really interested to hear some more about their narrative now.

But still... Juliet? Why the fuck not Kate? Gah!

[Dingle]

Which would be bullshit. Hopefully it didn't work, I want to see

Spoiler: Click here to view

ANGRY SAWYER RAGE AT JULIET DYING

Spoiler: Click here to view

and I take it that detonating an H-bomb within inches of her would've finally got the job done... and if not, he'd probably presume she's dead anyway

You don't see my point, that's what Jack's attitude is to why he should go through with it. My comment was a response to those above questioning Jack's motives.

[betterguy]

Spoiler: Click here to view

Great finale. I guess next season we'll be learning a lot about Jacob and also his nemesis and that group of people from the plane.

One massive thing I don't get is... why does Jack and everyone want to blow up the island? They'll be dead. They aren't going to feel the effects of having not ever been on the island in the first place are they? Although I guess it could be to do with the thing that happened with Desmond on the freighter, and how his consciousness time travlled or whatever the fuck that was. Still, I don't like it.

Spoiler: Click here to view

The versions of them that crashed on Oceanic 815 and everything they experienced the past 3 years will be dead. But since they die in 1977 on the Island, the actual 1970s versions not on the island will continue their lives uninterrupted. With the pocket of energy and the Swan gone, nothing will cause that electromagnetic storm and Oceanic 815 will not crash and their lives will continue on and they will land in Los Angeles. Jack buries his father, Claire gives her baby up, Locke is still paralyzed, Kate goes to prison and Boone, Shannon, Charlie, Libby, Analucia, Michael, the Federal Marshall, Nikki, Paolo, etc etc are still alive.

Spoiler: Click here to view

yeah I get all that. But why do they care about doing that? They'll be dead.

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They're sacrificing whatever crazy, mostly negative existence they would have in a time period they were never meant to be in in order to correct the universe. They're practically deleting everything we've seen happening post-plane crash knowing full well that they will have a better existence even if they, with their current memories/mindsets won't be aware of, they're doing it because they will be dead and, if they die, then it doesn't really matter if Jack loves Kate but it never worked out or that Kate "stole" Aaron because, none of that will happen and they won't be aware of anything after dying anyway.

Spoiler: Click here to view

But are their lives so bad that they'd be contemplating suicide? Sawyer and Juliet were just considering starting a new life on the outside world, and now they're happy to die. Come think of it, Jack actually was suicidal during his beardey phase, so that makes total sense for him. But I don't think it explains why everyone else is happy to die.

Which would be bullshit. Hopefully it didn't work, I want to see

Spoiler: Click here to view

ANGRY SAWYER RAGE AT JULIET DYING

Spoiler: Click here to view

and I take it that detonating an H-bomb within inches of her would've finally got the job done... and if not, he'd probably presume she's dead anyway

You don't see my point, that's what Jack's attitude is to why he should go through with it. My comment was a response to those above questioning Jack's motives.

Spoiler: Click here to view

They will be dead though. Well, they should be.. That's why I mentioned that episode where Desmond's consciousness travelled to a previous version of himself, or whatever that was, on the freighter. I don't remember now. I suppose there could be some other ways that they'd stay alive depending on how time travel works on the island, but I think it's stupid. Anyway, it's still pretty risky for them to be assuming that they'll go on living after they blow the island up. They have no proof that they'll somehow go on living. I guess they just trust the plan because it's what Faraday wanted to do.

[Dingle]

You don't seem to get their point. Jack believes that what he is doing is changing the past so that when he destroys the electromagnetic pocket he will destroy any chance of the button ever having come into existence, it will never be pressed, there will be no death of Kelvin Inman, no Desmond in the Swan to cause 815 to crash. If he creates an event that stops his plane from crashing, history will be re-written and he will never have been on the island. Of course, that creates the problem that, if he was never on the island, how could he go back and detonate a fission bomb, but there are paradoxes when dealing with time travel. Such as the compass paradox, which (annoyingly) has no origin.

Hopefully that explains what I mean by their motives for doing it.

[Donaldoholic]

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I don't think that the bomb blew up. I think the white flash was them being sent back to 2007. Nothing was changed in the past, because it was the past. But there was still a choice with everything that eventually happened.

I don't think any of the 77'ers died at the end of the episode. (Besides Sayid). I think the big deaths were Sayid and Locke.

Poor Locke. Poor Ben. Both used and abused by the man in black.

[betterguy]

You don't seem to get their point. Jack believes that what he is doing is changing the past so that when he destroys the electromagnetic pocket he will destroy any chance of the button ever having come into existence, it will never be pressed, there will be no death of Kelvin Inman, no Desmond in the Swan to cause 815 to crash. If he creates an event that stops his plane from crashing, history will be re-written and he will never have been on the island. Of course, that creates the problem that, if he was never on the island, how could he go back and detonate a fission bomb, but there are paradoxes when dealing with time travel. Such as the compass paradox, which (annoyingly) has no origin.

Hopefully that explains what I mean by their motives for doing it.

Spoiler: Click here to view

Yeah I understand all that, but that version of him will be dead. The version of him that will continue to live past the plane crash that will never happen is the version of Jack that's a child in 1977. Our Jack will be dead and won't be able to experience having never crashed.

About paradoxes, I made a post on my thoughts on them a couple pages back:

I hate the theory about time travel that says "if you create a paradox you'll fuck up the space-time continuum, and the universe will cease to exist" or whatever. Back to the Future obviously uses it too. If something's a paradox in theory, then that means that it can't happen in practice. There's no need to try and avoid a paradox, because they can't happen. For example, take the Grandfather paradox: there's two ways it could go down: Either there's no need to try and prevent the paradox, because it's impossible for the grandfather to be killed anyway, OR, the grandfather isn't required to be alive for the grandson to exist (for whateever reason), so it doesn't create a paradox if he's killed.

That applies to this scenario too. Depending on which rules of time travel the show follows, either the paradox can't happen because it's impossible to stop the plane crashing because it always did, OR, the paradox can't happen because Jack isn't required to have crashed on the island (in this timeline) to eventually go back and set off the bomb. Let's assume that they're successful in setting off the bomb and also stopping the plane crashing, therefore following the latter rules. The reason there's no paradox, is because when Jack travelled back in time, he did so from a different parallel timeline. He came from timeline A to timeline B. On timeline B, he set off the bomb, the plane didn't crash, and the Jack that was born and grew up on timeline B didn't get in a plane crash and end up on the island. The one that came from timeline A did though. His setting off the bomb didn't effect timeline A at all, so Jack still came to the island in the crash. Obviously I'm not Marty McFly so I don't have first-hand experience of time travel, but I just think that if time travel is ever proved to be possible, it won't be with rules that allow paradoxes.

[Matt]

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Just seen it. And wow, mother fucking wow. That is all.

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To answer "why are they doing it?" I think that Jack seems to think that by destroying the island where they are now, will send them back to where they're supposed to be - which I think he thinks is going to be LAX but is probably going to turn out to be where "Locke" and co are.

Also, I wanna know who that guy was, the guy that apparently became Locke, I'm also sad that Jacob's gone and hope that somehow we'll get another appearance from him when the island does its crazy time hopping shit, I want to know why Ben wasn't special, why he thought Locke was, what those lists were all about, how he gave Richard eternal life (or some crazy shit) etc:

Oh and what happened to big black guy? Did he got shot, I seem to think he did but I don't remember. Edited May 15, 2009 by --Matt--

[PkmnTrainerJ]

Lostpedia seem to think there's a Lost ARG going on on Twitter, which started with @simeonhobbes who wanted followers to also "Follow The Phoenix", which is @epithetalpha. Not sure if it is an ARG, or where it's going if it is, but it's something to keep people occupied during the hiatus if so.

[Matt]

Huh, what? Explain please.

[PkmnTrainerJ]

This might help - http://blog.lostpedia.com/2009/05/who-is-simeon-hobbes.html

[Matt]

I don't get how it's a game though... It's just a guy posting a lot of ramblings about Jacob

[PkmnTrainerJ]

The video he posted was under the "lostexperience" channel on YouTube, which makes people think that we might have a new ARG in the works.

[Matt]

Ah right I get it, it's just saying that there's a game coming, I thought the ramblings were a game in themself

[TheSqauredCircleMessiah]

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I'm beginning to think that the bomb didn't completely reset everything. As Faraday says, whatever happened, happened and Alpert said he saw the Losties die back in 1977. So my best guess is along with everybody that the bomb sends them back to 2007 or to another period in time that doesn't disrupt the timeline.

[The Future]

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The scene between Ben and Jacob was amazing I think it's a really cool idea what they have done with Jacob's Rival taking the shape of Locke. The scene where Sawyer was begging Juliet to not let go had me bawling like a baby and I marked the fuck out when I saw she was alive..but no:(