EWR 2012 Stats Update: April ***PLEASE USE SPOILER TAGS***

[Manifest]

Thanks Red.

I think Mancuerda(?) put it best really..

TNA is high national. WWE is just on a totally different level than any other wrestling promotion right now. They haven't had a close competitor since 2000.

Thats the truth sadly. I concede.

[Bill1996]

While talking PI, perhaps raise AAA and CMLLL to national. Hear me out, they are national in MEXICO. I would put AAA at 20 and CMLL at 15 which SHOULD mean they would not war.

From the EWR Guide:

Promotions can impact each other's ratings. This can only happen at Global and National level. This happens when a promotion is within 40% public image of another (the exception to this is when a promotion is below 10% - this counts as a safety zone, as they are not big enough at that level to effect anyone else). Once two promotions are within 40% of each other, once a week they are compared on several factors. For each of these factors, the weaker promotion will lose some public image. This means that a promotion with a better talent roster and more stars, who is putting on a better product, can decrease a weaker promotion above them, and eventually overtake them.

According to that, Putting AAA at 20 and CMLL at 15 would put them into a "war."

ROH run shows in the UK, or at least usedto, they should be global. Shimmer sell theirtapes all over the world, they should be changed to global as their resch is international. CZW has a tv show broadcast in europe and has held shows there in the past, as well as japan, they should be global. WSU have their ippvs which are accessible around the globe, they should be a global promotion aswell.

The whole argument abot if they are broadcast in a different country they should be global is stupid. The fact is WWE is the ONLY true global company right now. TNA is the only american national company, though I can easily see AAA & CMLL as low level nationals. ROH should be a cult promotion, no higher, regardless of what happens when you start the game. Once the game starts it is just that... A game.

The difference with TNA is the fact that they actually run shows outside of North Amreica currently. On top of that, TNA also has connections outside of North America, Ring Ka King and AAA being two of them. Nobody is saying that they are any competition to WWE, which is reflected by TNA being at 10 Global, while WWE is at 73 Global. They are far enough apart to not be "at war." I also don't think anyone is saying that, because a promotion has IPPV's or sends DVD's worldwide that that nmakes them a worldwide company.

I've read through th arguments and I'm thinking the smart thing would be to bump ROH to a National level. A few of my reasonings:

1: Bumping ROH to National would prevent the "Auto boost" that the workers get when the promotion jumps from Cult to National. Judging from the amount of requests I get to change workers' overs every single month, you'd think people would want them to not get an "auto boost" relatively quickly. When I bumped TNA from national to Global, I checked the writers afterward to see if that change effected card positioning for any of the workers. It didn't effect one worker.

2: ROH would be the only National promotion in the game at that point. Since, in "Real Life" ROH is the #3 promotion (behind WWE and TNA) moving ROH to National would firmly set them as that #3 promotion. They are listed as #3 currently, but AAA and CMLL are pretty close behind... Probably a bit too close.

3: While, technically, AAA and CMLL could be considered "National" as well, leaving them at Cult prevents them from going to war (as illustrated above, only National and Global can go to war). My guess is, the average person would know about ROH before they would know about AAA and CMLL. Bumping ROH up a little bit would reflect that as well.

We're not talking about making ROH a major National promotion here, just a minor one... Enogh to solidify them as the #3 promotion. I don't think much (if anything) will change, gameplay-wise, except that it would eliminate the "auto boost" and give ROH a slightly larger advantage over AAA and CMLL, which is probably a bit overdue anyway.

Feel free to keep discussing, this is just what I'm thinking currently and wantrd to relay those thoughts.

-Bill

[Guest The Phenomenal Red]

While talking PI, perhaps raise AAA and CMLLL to national. Hear me out, they are national in MEXICO. I would put AAA at 20 and CMLL at 15 which SHOULD mean they would not war.

From the EWR Guide:

Promotions can impact each other's ratings. This can only happen at Global and National level. This happens when a promotion is within 40% public image of another (the exception to this is when a promotion is below 10% - this counts as a safety zone, as they are not big enough at that level to effect anyone else). Once two promotions are within 40% of each other, once a week they are compared on several factors. For each of these factors, the weaker promotion will lose some public image. This means that a promotion with a better talent roster and more stars, who is putting on a better product, can decrease a weaker promotion above them, and eventually overtake them.

According to that, Putting AAA at 20 and CMLL at 15 would put them into a "war."

ROH run shows in the UK, or at least usedto, they should be global. Shimmer sell theirtapes all over the world, they should be changed to global as their resch is international. CZW has a tv show broadcast in europe and has held shows there in the past, as well as japan, they should be global. WSU have their ippvs which are accessible around the globe, they should be a global promotion aswell.

The whole argument abot if they are broadcast in a different country they should be global is stupid. The fact is WWE is the ONLY true global company right now. TNA is the only american national company, though I can easily see AAA & CMLL as low level nationals. ROH should be a cult promotion, no higher, regardless of what happens when you start the game. Once the game starts it is just that... A game.

The difference with TNA is the fact that they actually run shows outside of North Amreica currently. On top of that, TNA also has connections outside of North America, Ring Ka King and AAA being two of them. Nobody is saying that they are any competition to WWE, which is reflected by TNA being at 10 Global, while WWE is at 73 Global. They are far enough apart to not be "at war." I also don't think anyone is saying that, because a promotion has IPPV's or sends DVD's worldwide that that nmakes them a worldwide company.

I've read through th arguments and I'm thinking the smart thing would be to bump ROH to a National level. A few of my reasonings:

1: Bumping ROH to National would prevent the "Auto boost" that the workers get when the promotion jumps from Cult to National. Judging from the amount of requests I get to change workers' overs every single month, you'd think people would want them to not get an "auto boost" relatively quickly. When I bumped TNA from national to Global, I checked the writers afterward to see if that change effected card positioning for any of the workers. It didn't effect one worker.

2: ROH would be the only National promotion in the game at that point. Since, in "Real Life" ROH is the #3 promotion (behind WWE and TNA) moving ROH to National would firmly set them as that #3 promotion. They are listed as #3 currently, but AAA and CMLL are pretty close behind... Probably a bit too close.

3: While, technically, AAA and CMLL could be considered "National" as well, leaving them at Cult prevents them from going to war (as illustrated above, only National and Global can go to war). My guess is, the average person would know about ROH before they would know about AAA and CMLL. Bumping ROH up a little bit would reflect that as well.

We're not talking about making ROH a major National promotion here, just a minor one... Enogh to solidify them as the #3 promotion. I don't think much (if anything) will change, gameplay-wise, except that it would eliminate the "auto boost" and give ROH a slightly larger advantage over AAA and CMLL, which is probably a bit overdue anyway.

Feel free to keep discussing, this is just what I'm thinking currently and wantrd to relay those thoughts.

-Bill

The average fan in Mexico would disagree. The average fan in Mexico would know WWE, AAA, CMLL and THEN TNA due to TNA being involved with AAA at times. IMO using AAA for TNA's international scope is meh. For the most part, I don't believe Mexican fans know TNA as an actual promotion, rather than an AAA sub-faction. IMO make AAA 8 and CMLL 5 and both be National if ROH is. There is no doubt they are national promotions in Mexico and it would not affect game play if they are.

[Manifest]

The average fan in Mexico would disagree. The average fan in Mexico would know WWE, AAA, CMLL and THEN TNA due to TNA being involved with AAA at times. IMO using AAA for TNA's international scope is meh. For the most part, I don't believe Mexican fans know TNA as an actual promotion, rather than an AAA sub-faction. IMO make AAA 8 and CMLL 5 and both be National if ROH is. There is no doubt they are national promotions in Mexico and it would not affect game play if they are.

It would affect gameplay, by having them be at war.

[arwrestling]

Agreed with Red on thisone. Plus arent those two companies at war in mexico? Isnt it soe sort of rivalry? Like because AAA are working with TNA not CMLL workers are permittedto work with them.

[Guest The Phenomenal Red]

The average fan in Mexico would disagree. The average fan in Mexico would know WWE, AAA, CMLL and THEN TNA due to TNA being involved with AAA at times. IMO using AAA for TNA's international scope is meh. For the most part, I don't believe Mexican fans know TNA as an actual promotion, rather than an AAA sub-faction. IMO make AAA 8 and CMLL 5 and both be National if ROH is. There is no doubt they are national promotions in Mexico and it would not affect game play if they are.

It would affect gameplay, by having them be at war.

At 8 and 5 AAA and CMLL would not war with themselves or ROH. IMO they are larger (in their country) than ROH is. Think about it, AAA and CMLL have had high ratings in Mexico while ROH would be lower. Is ROH prestigious, yes but I say it should be say 50 for AAA, 45 for CMLL and 8 for ROH.

Edit: There is a pretty well known rivalry between AAA and CMLL with them "stealing eachother's talents." The latest in this was Toscano, Texano Jr. and Hector Garza jumping to AAA just in the past 4-5 months.

Edited April 12, 2012 by The Phenomenal Red

[TSweets]

Mexico has 1/3 the population of the USA, however lucha libre/ wrestling is a ton more popular down there than in the US, I would hazard the guess that the number of wrestling fans in each country would be quite similar. I think Phenomenal red is right those Mexican promotions pull massive crowds and I've long felt that the updates reflect the American fans more than the north Americans as a whole, which is understandable since we're all English speaking and have more access to the American wrestling.( IMO, some of the older CMLL stars should be more over than some of the bigger ROH, they're major over in Mexico. I'd look to Red to give some better overness stats since he obviously follows lucha libre more than the rest of us.)

[notatardis]

To play devil's advocate, isn't this based on American/United States popularity as opposed to world popularity? I recall that reason being used a bit back on the lack of inclusion of a couple promotions.

Bill, what you said pretty much summed up my thoughts exactly.

I don't have a further opinion on AAA and CMLL being I don't think I can accurately argue much except from a game playing/logistical stance. I think there's good points being made though.

[TSweets]

It's a North American Simulator. It's based on North American popularity.

[notatardis]

So by proxy, Canada and Mexico too. So is there a weighting system for the 3 countries we use?

Edited April 12, 2012 by notatardis

[Manifest]

At 8 and 5 AAA and CMLL would not war with themselves or ROH.

Yes, my bad. I didn't know promotions under 10 PI can't go to war.

How about looking at tv ratings, show/ppv attendances and buy-rates over the past 6 months or so for the promotions in question and whoever has the most should be ranked the highest (out of the three).

Edited April 12, 2012 by Manifest

[Sping]

How about CMLL 5, AAA 8, ROH 10? ROH highest because its probably more well known/watched in America and Canada, not just Mexico like the other two I'm guessing. They will go to war after a week or two but once the losing promotions are back under 10 they'd be safe for another week or two.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Sping

[arwrestling]

ROH may be more well known in the USA and probably Canada too but AAA and CMLL have benn fetured in Canada (not sure about the States though) and I still think they should both be at a national level and higher than ROH who I still maintain is a Cult sized promotion.

[Y2JFan111]

Add a friendship between Colt Cabana and Kassius Ohno

Add a friendship between Antonio Cesaro and Honky Tonk Man

Add a friendship between Johnny Saint and Kassius Ohno

Add a dislike between JJ Dillon and Konnan.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Y2JFan111

[Guest The Phenomenal Red]

ROH may be more well known in the USA and probably Canada too but AAA and CMLL have benn fetured in Canada (not sure about the States though) and I still think they should both be at a national level and higher than ROH who I still maintain is a Cult sized promotion.

I think that I agree with that due to the amount of fans that show up at RoH vs. AAA and CMLL. AAA and CMLL get mid thousands while RoH could get 1000, maybe 2000.

NOTE: I am working on updated overness ratings for AAA and CMLL superstars.

Edit: I am done with them

AAA Overness stat updates:

Aero Star raise overness to 53.

Alan Stone raise brawling to 32, lower speed to 68, raise technical to 48 and raise overness to 55.

Angel Mortal raise speed to 64, raise overness to 41.

Argenis raise overness to 38.

Argos lower brawl to 45, lower speed to 80, lower technical to 62 and raise overness to 45.

Atomic Boy raise technical to 38 and raise overness to 36.

Bestia 666 raise overness to 29.

Billy El Malo raise overness to 51.

Chessman raise overness to 68.

Chris Stone raise overness to 48.

Cibernetico raise overness to 70.

Crazy Boy raise overness to 40.

Cynthia Moreno raise overness to 45.

Daga raise overness to 42.

Damien 666 raise overness to 54.

Dark Curevo raise overness to 49.

Dark Dragon raise overness to 42.

Dark Espiritu raise overness to 44.

Dark Ozz raise overness to 51.

Decniss raise overness to 51.

Dr. Wagner Jr. raise overness to 70.

Drago AAA raise overness to 49.

El Brazo keep overness at 47.

El Elegido raise overness to 52.

El Gellego raise brawl to 38, raise speed to 58, raise technical to 42 and raise overness to 39.

El Mesias raise overness to 72.

Electroshock raise overness to 55.

Escoria raise overness to 50.

Extreme Tiger raise overness to 58.

Fabi Apache raise overness to .

Fenix raise overness to 42.

Gran Apache keep overness at 42.

Gronda II raise overness to 46.

Halloween raise overness to 55.

Heavy Metal raise overness to 52.

Hechicera raise overness to 30.

Hector Garza raise overness to 67.

Jack Evans raise overness to 64.

Jessy keep overness at 41.

Joe Lider raise overness to 51.

Juventud Guerrera raise overness to 65.

Konnan keep overness at 73.

L.A. Par-K raise overness to 73.

La Parka Jr. raise overness to 64.

La Parkita raise overness to 42.

Laredo Kid keep overness at 48.

Lolita raise overness to 35.

Mari Apache raise overness to 49.

Masacara Ano 2000 Jr. raise overness to 48.

Mascara Divina keep overness at 52.

Mascarita de la Muerte raise overness to 25.

Mascarita Divina raise overness to 38.

Mascarita Dorada raise overness to 56.

Mini Abismo Negro raise overness to 42.

Mini Charly Manson raise overness to 40.

Mini Chessman raise overness to 37.

Mini Histeria raise overness to 38.

Mini Monster Clown raise overness to 36.

Mini Murder Clown raise overness to 37.

Mini Psicosis III raise overness to 40.

Mini Psycho Clown raise overness to 38.

Monster Clown raise overness to 62.

Mortiz raise overness to 32.

Murder Clown raise overness to 63.

Nicho El Millonario keep overness at 66.

Nygma keep overness at 42.

Octagon raise overness to 62.

Octagoncito II keep overness at 42.

Pasion Cystal raise overness to 39.

Perro Aguayo Jr. raise overness to 72.

Pimpinela Escarlata raise overness to 46.

Polvo de Estrellas raise overness to 43.

Psycho Clown raise overness to 64.

Relampago raise overness to 32.

Sangre Chicana raise overness to 49.

Semental raise overness to 37.

Sexy Star raise overness to 51.

Silver Cain raise overness to 67.

Sugi San raise overness to 40.

Super Fly raise overness to 45.

Taboo raise overness to 39.

Texano Jr. raise overness to 63.

Tigre Cota raise overness to 43.

Tito Santana II raise overness to 44.

Toscano raise overness to 61.

Ultimo Gladiador raise overness to 55.

Vampiro raise overness to 74.

Violento Jack raise overness to 28.

X-Fly raise overness to 50.

Yuriko raise overness to 37.

Zorro raise overness to 65.

NOTE: Remove Bestia 666, Damaian 666 & X-Fly from AAA as they left to form Familia de Tijuana. Cassandro, Crazy Boy, Mascarita de la Muerte, Sange Azteca and Super Crazy should also be removed due to inactivity. Also make Cassandro a non-worker, he suffered a serious leg injury and will be out of action for the foreseeable future.

CMLL Overness stat updates:

Amapola raise overness to 45.

Angel Azteca Jr. raise overness to 33.

Angel de Oro raise overness to 48.

Angel de Plata raise overness to 38.

Apocalipsis raise overness to 31.

Arkangel raise overness to 41.

Arillero raise overness to 31.

Atlantis raise overness to 70.

Averno raise overness to 72.

Bam Bam keep overness to 40.

Bengala raise overness to 32.

Black Warrior raise overness to 58.

Blue Panther raise overness to 60.

Bobby Zavala raise overness to 34.

Bronco III raise overness to 34.

Cancerbero raise overness to 42.

Dalis La Caribena raise overness to 36.

Delta raise overness to 44.

Demus 3:16 raise overness to 45.

Diamante raise overness to 38.

Diamante Azul raise overness to 45.

Dragon Rojo Jr. raise overness to 51.

El Hijo Del Fantasma raise overness to 54.

El Hijo del Signo raise overness to 39.

El Sagrado raise overness to 42.

El Terrible raise overness to 65.

Enrique Vera Jr. raise overness to 28.

Ephesto raise overness to 59.

Estrella Magica raise overness to 33.

Estrellita raise overness to 42.

Euforia raise overness to 42.

Felino raise overness to 57.

Fuego raise overness to 40.

Goya Kong raise overness to 39.

Guerrero Maya Jr. raise overness to 43.

Hiroka raise overness to 32.

Hombre Bala Jr. raise overness to 32.

Hooligan raise overness to 40.

Horuz raise overness to 35.

Inquisidor raise overness to 34.

Kraneo (Alebrije) raise overness to 51.

La Mascara raise overness to 62.

La Seductora raise overness to 30.

La Sombra raise overness to 70.

Lady Apache raise overness to 43.

Latin-O raise overness to 65.

Leono raise overness to 37.

Lluvia raise overness to 32.

Loco Max raise overness to 42.

Luna Magica raise overness to 38.

Magnus CMLL raise overness to 34.

Marcela raise overness to 38.

Marco Corelone keep overness at 67.

Mascara Ano 2000 keep overness to 58.

Mascara Dorada raise overness to 60.

Maximo raise overness to 58.

Mephisto raise overness to 70.

Metatron keep overness at 21.

Mije keep overness at 42.

Misterioso Jr. raise overness to 42.

Morphosis raise overness to 52.

Mr. Aguila raise overness to 58.

Mr. Niebla raise overness to 63.

Namajgue raise overness to 30.

Negro Casas raise overness to 70.

Nitro raise overness to 47.

Nosferatu raise overness to 33.

Okumura keep overness to 50.

Pegasso Xtreme raise overness to 43.

Pequeno Nitro raise overness to 40.

Pequeno Olimpico raise overness to 48.

Pequeno Universo 2000 raise overness to 33.

Pequeno Violencia raise overness to 35.

Pequeno Warrior raise overness to 47.

Pierrothito raise overness to 48.

Polvora raise overness to 43.

Princesa Blanca raise overness to .

Princesa Sugey raise overness to .

Principe raise overness to 38.

Psicosis II raise overness to 60.

Puma King raise overness to 39.

Ramstein raise overness to 40.

Rayo Tapatio I raise overness to 38.

Rayo Tapatio II raise overness to 38.

Raziel raise overness to 42.

Rey Bucanero raise overness to .

Rey Cometa raise overness to 45.

Rey Scorpion raise overness to 42.

Robin raise overness to 32.

Rush raise overness to 59.

Sahori raise overness to 31.

Sangre Azteca raise overness to 47.

Sensei raise overness to 35.

Shocker raise overness to 67.

Shockercito raise overness to 36.

Silueta raise overness to 45.

Skandalo raise overness to 39.

Starman raise overness to 38.

Stuka Jr. raise overness to 42.

Super Comando raise overness to 30.

Super Halcon Jr. raise overness to 29.

Super Porky raise overness to 55.

Tiffany raise overness to 44.

Tiger raise overness to 48.

Tiger Blanco II raise overness to 40.

Titan raise overness to 41.

Triton raise overness to 41.

Ultimo Dragoncito raise overness to 38.

Ultimo Guerrero raise overness to 73.

Valiente raise overness to 56.

Virus raise overness to 45.

Volador Jr. raise overness to 67.

Zacarias raise overness to 46.

Zeuxis raise overness to 35.

NOTE: Remove Latin-O, Mascara Ano 2000 & Sahori from CMLL due to inactivity.

Edited April 12, 2012 by The Phenomenal Red

[KrisClassic]

ROH run shows in the UK, or at least usedto, they should be global. Shimmer sell theirtapes all over the world, they should be changed to global as their resch is international. CZW has a tv show broadcast in europe and has held shows there in the past, as well as japan, they should be global. WSU have their ippvs which are accessible around the globe, they should be a global promotion aswell.

The whole argument abot if they are broadcast in a different country they should be global is stupid. The fact is WWE is the ONLY true global company right now. TNA is the only american national company, though I can easily see AAA & CMLL as low level nationals. ROH should be a cult promotion, no higher, regardless of what happens when you start the game. Once the game starts it is just that... A game.

Agreed 100%.

-Raise Adam Gooch's brawl to 32, speed to 56, stiffness to 37, overness to 13, and charisma to 53. Check High Spots. He has been wrestling for quite a while, I would guess he is older than 24. I can't find any direct sources though, but bump him up to his late 20s at least.

-Raise Damien Wayne's overness to 28 and charisma to 76.

-Raise Michael Elgin's overness to 57.

-Raise Jay Briscoe's overness to 67.

-Raise Mark Briscoe's overness to 67.

-Lower Nick Berk's wages to 14,000.

-Check Announcer for Adam Cole.

-Raise Facade's overness to 24. Change his gimmick to Martial Arts.

-Vacate the IWC Tag Team Championship. The champions, The One Nighters(Bobby Beverly and Nicki Valentino) are not in the game.

-Facade is the IWC Super Indy Champion.

-Add Logan Shulo to the game:

Logan Shulo

Shulo

Male, 26

Lightweight

B- 41

S- 28

T- 62

Stiff- 41

Sell- 70

Over- 14

Charisma- 54

Att- 89

Behav- 92

4,000

Image

Finishers: Springboard Axe Handle (Top Rope Standing)/Running Jumping Stomp (Ground)

Add him to IWC, Heel, Arrogant

Loyalty to Super Hentai and Shirley Doe.

-Logan Shulo is the IWC World Heavyweight Champion.

-Lower AJ Kirsch's attitude to 73 and behavior to 82.

-Add a dislike between AJ Kirsch and Booker T and AJ Kirsch and Steve Austin.(

). Edited April 12, 2012 by KrisClassic

[The Lusophone]

I disagree with removing workers from CMLL. Afaik they use so many workers so it's not unsurprising we don't see some of them.

[Guest The Phenomenal Red]

I disagree with removing workers from CMLL. Afaik they use so many workers so it's not unsurprising we don't see some of them.

None of the people are 1 not on the luchawiki roster page and 2 have not been a part of CMLL for nearly a year.

[Bill1996]

OK, some quick notes:

Change Michel Elgin's shorted name from Unreal to Unbreakable

Unbreakable doesn't fit... 10 letter max on Short Names.

Rename Natalya Neidhart to just Natalya

Rename Cameron Lynn as Cameron

Rename Naomi Night as Naomi

Rename AJ Lee as AJ

I don't normally change names to singular, when a last name is known, since I'd have to change it back if there was ever another of that name to come along... Kind of an Anti-Pain-In-The-Ass thing... All of them have their first name only in the shortened names, though.

-Lower AJ Kirsch's attitude to 73 and behavior to 82.

-Add a dislike between AJ Kirsch and Booker T and AJ Kirsch and Steve Austin

I'm thinking this all might be a work, since Austin is tweeting back to him.

Other notes:

I have removed IWA, because they only had like 8 workers and apparently, nobody knows enough to update them on a regular basis. I'm in the process of adding NCW Femmes Fatales as their replacement, mainly because I've been wanting to get them into the game for a while, but also because most of their roster is already in the game.

Finally, regarding the ROH/AAA/CMLL size situation...

Personally, I see ROH as the third biggest promotion. Apparently, others on the board who follow Mexican wrestling closer than I do disagree. So, chances are, AAA, CMLL and ROH will all be National Promotions starting with the May Update. Currently, this is what I'm thinking, image-wise:

AAA: National, 57 Image

CMLL: National, 54 Image

ROH: National, 8 Image

With AAA and CMLL being in a "war" IRL (at least from what I understand from reading posts on here) it's not a big deal to have them in a war on the game. The thing is, I want to make sure they both are also more than 40% from ROH. These numbers accomplish this and gets ROH as a National Promotion, to eliminate the "overness boost."

Think that's all I have for the time being... It's also 2:20 AM here and I'm starting to doze off.

-Bill

[Y2JFan111]

I'd give Bret Hart a written contract with WWE, I can't see him appearing anywhere else.