The England thread

[therockbox]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

[Matt]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

I think it depends. Most of the Becks hate comes from people who've not seen him in La Liga recently and just judge him on the fact that he didn't score 5 goals in the last World Cup (which in all honesty, he didn't do that bad in, at least compared to the likes of Lampard and Shrek) and single-handedly take us to the final. People who want David Beckham back are generally the ones who've actually seen how good and sharp he looks recently.

[IAceI]

Yes, really. When he was dropped everyone rejoiced that McClaren had made such a smart choice to start his campaign with. McClaren basically dropped Beckham to get people on his side, there was no way Beckham deserved to be dropped and players like Downing and Jenas stay in the squad.

See it all seemed that McClaren just done it because he wanted to look like he could make big important decisions, then Beckham was told he'd never play for Real again. So he proved his worth, and has been setting up goals for fun and helping the team go to win the league. At Man Utd, there wasn't a bad word said about Becks, then his performance dropped fair enough, but he didn't deserve to be removed from the club.

Good form deserves to be recalled, and it's just a shame McClaren can't actually be smart and call up Barry like he should be, or drop Downing like he should have been and brought up Matthew Taylor - particularly for that B International. What benefit does playing Lennon (especially on the left), Jenas (playing Jenas ever) etc. actually have? None what so ever.

Not that it matters who he played, because he could have called up anyone, have them play a blinder, and then drop them for the actually important matches. Simply because McClaren's a douche. Beckham adds that dimension where he's a threat from pin point accurate crosses, while Shaun Wright Phillips and an Aaron Lennon can beat players for speed and use pace to get their crosses off or make dangerous little balls through etc. If you ask me there's nothing wrong with trying to make the team less flat, while I know we need players to run at defenders (which only Lennon really does, and even then that isn't always) there's no problem being lethal from set pieces and deep crosses.

But let's face it, Beckham's going to get scruitinized and say he puts in a 7/10 or whatever, that won't be enough and the masses of typical Beckham haters will be on his back like usual. Hell, even if he scores and sets one up he'll be dismissed as "wasn't that good" because people seem incapable of admitting Beckham (and a lot of players for that matter of fact) actually are having a good game.

Meh, I'm glad Beckham's back. As I said, good form deserves to be rewarded, it's the basis the England team should be built on, and McClaren should open his eyes and start calling up players who have really really proved themselves, and not picking players on name value alone (Lampard).

[therockbox]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

I think it depends. Most of the Becks hate comes from people who've not seen him in La Liga recently and just judge him on the fact that he didn't score 5 goals in the last World Cup (which in all honesty, he didn't do that bad in, at least compared to the likes of Lampard and Shrek) and single-handedly take us to the final. People who want David Beckham back are generally the ones who've actually seen how good and sharp he looks recently.

[ZJ Penn]

Isn't it the same squad for both the friendly and the qualifier?

[9 to 5]

It is, yes. Play Bentley instead I say. >_>

[Matt]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

I think it depends. Most of the Becks hate comes from people who've not seen him in La Liga recently and just judge him on the fact that he didn't score 5 goals in the last World Cup (which in all honesty, he didn't do that bad in, at least compared to the likes of Lampard and Shrek) and single-handedly take us to the final. People who want David Beckham back are generally the ones who've actually seen how good and sharp he looks recently.

I've seen him in La Liga, thanks, and like I said - he's been good. But that's it, and it's ignoring the fact that he's going to a poor league in a couple of months. We also know exactly what Beckham's capable of, so why call him up for a friendly?

What does it matter which league he's going to? How does that mean he's not good? It just means he's making a financial decision to get stupendous wages - which I too would go for.

[therockbox]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

I think it depends. Most of the Becks hate comes from people who've not seen him in La Liga recently and just judge him on the fact that he didn't score 5 goals in the last World Cup (which in all honesty, he didn't do that bad in, at least compared to the likes of Lampard and Shrek) and single-handedly take us to the final. People who want David Beckham back are generally the ones who've actually seen how good and sharp he looks recently.

I've seen him in La Liga, thanks, and like I said - he's been good. But that's it, and it's ignoring the fact that he's going to a poor league in a couple of months. We also know exactly what Beckham's capable of, so why call him up for a friendly?

[Matt]

I must read different things to you then because all I've ever heard is hate for Beckham :-\

I think it depends. Most of the Becks hate comes from people who've not seen him in La Liga recently and just judge him on the fact that he didn't score 5 goals in the last World Cup (which in all honesty, he didn't do that bad in, at least compared to the likes of Lampard and Shrek) and single-handedly take us to the final. People who want David Beckham back are generally the ones who've actually seen how good and sharp he looks recently.

I've seen him in La Liga, thanks, and like I said - he's been good. But that's it, and it's ignoring the fact that he's going to a poor league in a couple of months. We also know exactly what Beckham's capable of, so why call him up for a friendly?

What does it matter which league he's going to? How does that mean he's not good?

Didn't say he wasn't good, try again.

You know what I mean, stop nitpicking for the sake of it. Why does what league he'll be playing in in 2 months time affect why he should(n't) play for England next week? Even more so if he is good. Surely it's down to who are the best in-form 23 players at the time.

[therockbox]

But it's not, otherwise Downing/Jenas etc. wouldn't be in the squad would they?

[Matt]

But it's not, otherwise Downing/Jenas etc. wouldn't be in the squad would they?

OK then I'll rephrase, surely it SHOULD be down to the best 23 in-form players. 95% of Britain don't think Downing should be in the squad so that's a pretty redundant point to make. Argue the point, not my choice of words.

[Grounded Wingman]

Basically, the base of any England squad should look like this:

Goalkeepers: Robinson

Defenders: Gary Neville, Ashley Cole, Wayne Bridge, Rio Ferdinand, John Terry and arguably Jamie Carragher.

Midfielders: Joe Cole, Hargreaves, Gerrard, Lampard

Up front: Rooney, Owen (when fit) and arguably Crouch.

12 definites, 2 arguables and then you can basically pick any other 9 players in the knowledge that they will be decent Premiership players but not good enough for a team of England's supposed international standing.

[therockbox]

But it's not, otherwise Downing/Jenas etc. wouldn't be in the squad would they?

OK then I'll rephrase, surely it SHOULD be down to the best 23 in-form players. 95% of Britain don't think Downing should be in the squad so that's a pretty redundant point to make. Argue the point, not my choice of words.

[Matt]

So your argument is because things are done wrong they should be continued to be done wrong.

[therockbox]

Yes, that's exactly my argument.

[lanky316]

Basically, the base of any England squad should look like this:

Goalkeepers: Robinson

Defenders: Gary Neville, Ashley Cole, Wayne Bridge, Rio Ferdinand, John Terry and arguably Jamie Carragher.

Midfielders: Joe Cole, Hargreaves, Gerrard, Lampard

Up front: Rooney, Owen (when fit) and arguably Crouch.

12 definites, 2 arguables and then you can basically pick any other 9 players in the knowledge that they will be decent Premiership players but not good enough for a team of England's supposed international standing.

[IAceI]

Did you just have a go for him for saying Rooney is a cert when the real travesty is he said,

"and arguably Carragher"

>_<

[Grounded Wingman]

Basically, the base of any England squad should look like this:

Goalkeepers: Robinson

Defenders: Gary Neville, Ashley Cole, Wayne Bridge, Rio Ferdinand, John Terry and arguably Jamie Carragher.

Midfielders: Joe Cole, Hargreaves, Gerrard, Lampard

Up front: Rooney, Owen (when fit) and arguably Crouch.

12 definites, 2 arguables and then you can basically pick any other 9 players in the knowledge that they will be decent Premiership players but not good enough for a team of England's supposed international standing.

Can I ask you why Rooney is a definate? At the top level he's not done anything in three years so I don't see why he's a cert when there are other players who could warrant the opportunity. Crouch has been our best striker in recent years so surely he gets the priority over a non-scoring striker (for a long time) and one who's played around 13 club games in 21 months.

[Summers]

No one should always be included, that way of looking at things is why Beckham played, when doing shit, why Lampard played, when shit, why James play, when shit.

[therockbox]

but those goals have come against pish teams where even Darius Vassell might have nicked a goal or 2.

Edited May 28, 2007 by Daydream Anonymous