The Comic Book Thread (spoilers)

[Your Mom]

Huh?!? Really? I am avoiding all that like the plague but man it's so bad

[Tyrone]

Anyone else reading Ta-Nehisi Coates' Black Panther run? On a whim I picked up the graphic novel (issue 1-4) a little while back and I've been loving it. Just picked up novel 2 and 3 yesterday.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Tyrone

[GhostMachine]

Apparently Marvel's next big event, after Secret Empire, is going to be.....

 

Legacy. Which is going to restore some characters (Thor and Iron Man, for example) back to normal. Personally, I hope some of the replacements are killed off. Bet Ms. Marvel isn't affected, because I can't see them turning Carol Danvers back into Ms. Marvel, with the Captain Marvel movie slated for 2019.

Good news is, the teaser artwork for it has Captain America back to his normal costume and shield.

Edited April 23, 2017 by GhostMachine

[KingCrippler]

So fuck Nick Spencer. 

That is all. 

[Your Mom]

On 4/23/2017 at 01:43, GhostMachine said:

Apparently Marvel's next big event, after Secret Empire, is going to be.....

  Reveal hidden contents

Legacy. Which is going to restore some characters (Thor and Iron Man, for example) back to normal. Personally, I hope some of the replacements are killed off. Bet Ms. Marvel isn't affected, because I can't see them turning Carol Danvers back into Ms. Marvel, with the Captain Marvel movie slated for 2019.

Good news is, the teaser artwork for it has Captain America back to his normal costume and shield.

Spoiler

Why? The replacements are better

 

[GoGo Yubari]

On 4/22/2017 at 21:36, Tyrone said:

Anyone else reading Ta-Nehisi Coates' Black Panther run? On a whim I picked up the graphic novel (issue 1-4) a little while back and I've been loving it. Just picked up novel 2 and 3 yesterday.

I am! It took me a few issues to really get into it but now I love it. It's kind of refreshing to have a superhero comic as philosophical and text-heavy as Black Panther is, and when I pick up an issue I know I'm gonna be taking my time with it.

Since I haven't posted in here in a while, I'd say the five ongoing comic books I'm enjoying the most right now, in no particular order, are Saga, Paper Girls, Archie, Astro City, and Black Panther. Honorable mentions include all the Marvel Star Wars stuff though I think that's taken a dip in quality lately, Shade the Changing Girl, Ms. Marvel, and Kill or Be Killed. Technically Southern Bastards is probably #5 but I only buy that in TPBs right now and for some reason that doesn't feel like it counts in my head.

Zero interest in Secret Empire, or any major superhero comic crossovers. I don't know if any comics writer has ever tanked my esteem for them as badly in as short a time as Nick Spencer has; I loved Superior Foes of Spider-Man and his Ant-Man felt like a continuation of that, but good lord, dude.

[=BK=]

On 4/23/2017 at 02:43, GhostMachine said:

Apparently Marvel's next big event, after Secret Empire, is going to be.....

  Hide contents

Legacy. Which is going to restore some characters (Thor and Iron Man, for example) back to normal. Personally, I hope some of the replacements are killed off. Bet Ms. Marvel isn't affected, because I can't see them turning Carol Danvers back into Ms. Marvel, with the Captain Marvel movie slated for 2019.

Good news is, the teaser artwork for it has Captain America back to his normal costume and shield.

Spoiler

I'm all for Thor being Thor again, I don't really care about Iron Man and I really don't like the idea of backtracking on Captain America. There's no way Ms.Marvel goes. She's one of the more successful brand new heroes. It's like her and Miles and then everyone else new is "Ehhhhhh".

 

[GoGo Yubari]

Spoiler

Making Carol Danvers Ms. Marvel again would be a catastrophically stupid decision on so many fronts. Marvel has been swinging and missing recently but not even they are going to do something that would piss off fans of one of their only breakout new characters in the last few years, would add confusion to the MCU where Carol Danvers is going to be Captain Marvel, and would pretty much be seen as a step backwards on so many fronts.

Also I prefer Jane Foster Thor and the Odinson as a wandering bum who rides on a space goat, but in my heart of hearts I know that's not forever.

 

[GhostMachine]

There's no way they turn Carol Danvers back into Ms. Marvel or get rid of the new one. Especially since there is going to be a Captain Marvel movie in a few years. I just prefer Carol's Ms. Marvel costume over the Captain Marvel one, and don't care for the new Ms. Marvel's costume. I think the only legacy heroes sticking around after all is said and done will be Kalama Khan and Miles Morales. Jane Foster will stop being a female Thor while the real one gets Mjolnir back. Will he get a new arm to go with it? Who knows. Ironheart *may* stick around, but I bet she gets a redesign that looks less like Iron Man. Obviously, Victor Von Doom will go back to being Doctor Doom. The whole crap with Captain America will hopefully get tossed aside, Steve will get his old costume and shield back, and Sam Wilson will go back to being the Falcon, or keep the costume and get a new name. No clue about the new Nova. I know next to nothing about him, other than that I like his costume better than Richard Rider's.

 

[=BK=]

Reading Civil War II tie-ins. Just hit an All-New Wolverine. Who's the little girl with Laura?

[JasonM]

2 hours ago, =BK= said:

Reading Civil War II tie-ins. Just hit an All-New Wolverine. Who's the little girl with Laura?

Only surviving clone of X23 created by Alchemax who can't feel pain. Basically a pint-sized killing machine.

Regarding the new event

I really have no idea what Marvel is trying to do with their characters. On the one hand they're all about making lasting changes that piss off the fanbase in some sort of way, and when the dust has finally settled and people have somewhat grudgingly accepted the new status quo, they decide to completely reverse many of those big changes and further piss off and alienate the fanbase.

It's like they completely stopped having strategy meetings, and are just writing whatever the fuck will piss off people the hardest, under some misguided idea that all the controversy won't end up costing them a lot of readers rather than attracting them.

Edited April 27, 2017 by Jasonmufc

[GhostMachine]

 

To me (and a lot of other people) the problem with legacy heroes - and I say this about DC and Marvel both - is that it doesn't work when you replace perfectly viable characters who already have a fanbase. If companies want more racial diversity, they should either create brand spanking new characters that aren't a knockoff or replacement of an existing one (in other words, BE ORIGINAL!), or replace heroes who don't have a big following. Or better yet, how about descendants of golden or silver age characters that haven't been seen in ages, if they just have to be legacy heroes. 

The only Marvel legacy hero from the current crop that I like is Miles Morales, and he's an addition, not a replacement. There are none from DC's last group that I like,at all. Ted Kord and Ronnie Raymond especially did not need to be replaced, and Ronnie's death was stupid. (I already know he's back, but the way they took him out was idiotic.)

Edited April 27, 2017 by GhostMachine

[=BK=]

The biggest arguments against that view are Wally West and John Stewart. Both successfully replaced relevant and popular heroes. People really just need to get used to change again.

[JasonM]

29 minutes ago, =BK= said:

The biggest arguments against that view are Wally West and John Stewart. Both successfully replaced relevant and popular heroes. People really just need to get used to change again.

The problem is that Marvel and DC are both gun-shy and extremely trigger happy, seemingly at the same time. And they rely too much upon new characters being pushed to the top of the heap the first time they make an entrance, rather than have a (short) organic build-up where we learn about the character (sounds much like wrestling, now that I say it...)

A big example is Ironheart, Riri Williams. I personally have zero issues with a young black woman getting an iron-man style suit, or she herself building one out of her dorm room. Comics are fantastical and shouldn't be realistic. But my biggest grievance with her character is that she barely has one, you barely know who she is, and Marvel just puts the character in a major position without any reasoning other than 'Tony thought she was p. cool before he got put into a coma.'

It's paper thin reasoning for anyone, it becomes even harder when the character's been made with racial diversity in mind, because the rabid fanbase have a dislike for such a character from the moment they show up.

At the same time, it has worked many times before, with Miles, and with Kamala/Ms. Marvel, and various other characters. But generally they worked because they actually got a personality, a backstory, something for the reader to latch onto and identify with, and are backed up by having good personalities being written for them. It also helped that they showed up before the fanbases started turning against the diversity things, so they had a much better chance to succeed.
Finally, neither got an instantanious 'you tha best' from their previous namesakes, since Miles appeared after Parker had died in U1610, and Kamala was given a bunch of issues before she controlled her powers, and Danvers showed up to give her the 'ok', but even then purely in a 'You're causing massive chaos, but you can use the name' way, and not in a 'You're super duper awesome, kid' way.

I'm probably taking all this way too serious, but as someone that's actively reading everything marvel's putting out, I probably am a special kind of crazy in the first place.

Edited April 27, 2017 by Jasonmufc

[GhostMachine]

1 hour ago, =BK= said:

The biggest arguments against that view are Wally West and John Stewart. Both successfully replaced relevant and popular heroes. People really just need to get used to change again.

I assume you mean the newer Wally? I see your point there, but John Stewart didn't really replace anyone. He was introduced a long time ago when Hal Jordan was still around and was originally an `angry black guy' when introduced, and Kyle Rayner is really the Hal replacement. The original Wally hadn't been Kid Flash in decades and they did eventually bring the `real' Wally back so there are now two Wally Wests. (Original Wally's current Flash costume is the best costume he's ever had.)

Legacy heroes do work in some cases, but there's far more instances where they do not.

I wish they had depowered Eric Masterson rather than killed him off when they got rid of Thunderstrike, and I wish they had killed off USAgent.

When I was a kid, I read Green Lantern/Green Arrow for Oliver, not Hal. And Hal is quite possibly the most boring hero I can think of, personality-wise. Barry Allen stayed dead too long, while Hal was brought back too soon. I may have grown up with him as `my' Green Lantern, but I prefer Alan Scott, Kyle Rayner, John Stewart, Arisia and Kilowog (and not necessarily in that order) over Hal.

And I agree 100% with Jason's last post. 

Edited April 27, 2017 by GhostMachine

[HailtotheYo]

On 4/26/2017 at 16:41, GoGo Yubari said:

I am! It took me a few issues to really get into it but now I love it. It's kind of refreshing to have a superhero comic as philosophical and text-heavy as Black Panther is, and when I pick up an issue I know I'm gonna be taking my time with it.

Since I haven't posted in here in a while, I'd say the five ongoing comic books I'm enjoying the most right now, in no particular order, are Saga, Paper Girls, Archie, Astro City, and Black Panther. Honorable mentions include all the Marvel Star Wars stuff though I think that's taken a dip in quality lately, Shade the Changing Girl, Ms. Marvel, and Kill or Be Killed. Technically Southern Bastards is probably #5 but I only buy that in TPBs right now and for some reason that doesn't feel like it counts in my head.

Zero interest in Secret Empire, or any major superhero comic crossovers. I don't know if any comics writer has ever tanked my esteem for them as badly in as short a time as Nick Spencer has; I loved Superior Foes of Spider-Man and his Ant-Man felt like a continuation of that, but good lord, dude.

1 - Astro City always has been and continues to be one of the best books put out by anyone.

2 - How in the blue perfect hell is the guy that's absolutely throwing up all over the place with CAP the same guy that gave us Superior Foes of SM ... I mean what the actual fuck how is that possible?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My biggest issue with the vast majority of the changes are that they were ... "because" ... not for anything other than.  That's what I can't stand.  It's been said already, but be original, create new heroes or build on your character stockpile by either having legacies coming from the gold/silver age stock or have them taking up visages of to honor them.    

[=BK=]

I thought all the Hydra Cap stuff sounded dumb until I found this.

I actually like the idea of Steve as a bad guy for a while. Steve is supposed to represent America and look at the state of America right now. Let Steve be the representation of the Government and let Sam be the representation of the people.

[JasonM]

I feel that a lot of the people who are raging over the whole HydraCAP stuff haven't read the comics, or haven't bothered to read further than a few issues at best. There's a lot of wrong opinions floating around about what has been written, and from what I have read I am pretty sure that Kobik (the sentient cosmic cube) still changed the past and mass-altered the perception of humanity, rather than what some people saying as 'The allies used a cube', although I haven't yet read Cap #16 so it might've been revealed there. Or i'm misremembering reading things, OR Kobik altered my memories...

And Steve clearly isn't subservient to anyone, and rather seeks to control HYDRA himself, really in a misguided attempt to 'help' the world, although in his skewed and altered recollection of his past.

It's not nearly as terrible as people claim it to be, it has some weird jumps it makes to make everything work (especially Steve effortlessly convincing Zemo that they've always been BFF's rather than enemies), but I feel there's much worse stuff that has been written by Marvel to ellicit reaction or create hype through controversy and uproar.

Edited May 5, 2017 by Jasonmufc

[Your Mom]

What about them rounding up Inhumans and putting them in camps?

[theshadow]

I've recently been gifted a year of Marvel unlimited. I've not read many comics since maybe 2004ish except one trade collection of Guardians some Ultimate Thor and Avengers stuff and Civil war. Any recommendations?

Unlimited only hours up to about October last year releases right now for most recent things. Also mostly only read x-books in the past so any past stuff would be great too.

Edited May 6, 2017 by theshadow