***spoilers*** UFC News and Discussion Thread

[Heel Turn]

How did Brock Lesnar not see that kneebar coming? My grandmother could have seen that and avoided it. Brock has all the physical tools, but from what I know of UFC, he looked incredibly green and inexperienced.

[SteeleAround]

I have been watching UFC since the beginning, and this was the first fight in a LOOOONG time I got that tingly feeling for. I got desensitized after Shamrock/Ortiz and Rampage/Liddell, so I quit buying them (but still followed). But as a pro-wrestling fan, I was excited for this. And I wasn't disappointed.

Lesnar, with more time and training, will have the ability to dominate the HW division. Granted, Mir is an overrated has-been, but is still a submission master. He went in, threw Mir around, used his face as a speed bag, and...got stood up? Without a warning? Bullshit. Even if the punch was intentional (which it wasn't) it deserved a warning first. That fight would have been over. Hell, it already was. But, no excuses.

Brock did well going right back to it, but was more tentative, let his inexperience get the best of him, and he let Mir do what Mir does best. I knew as soon as he stood up with the deer in headlights "what now" look that his leg was about to be used like a balloon animal, and Mir cinched it in tight.

All in all, it was a rookie mistake, by a rookie fighter, and now he can go back to the drawing board for his next one. A lot olf MMA fans on MMA boards are gloating that Lesnar doesn't belong. I think they are horribly misguided. He has NOTHING to be ashamed of. He made a mistake, and he got caught in a submission by a highly regarded fighter. I didn't hear anyone talking about how bad Liddell sucked when Rampage took him off the ground and into the Twilight Zone with one punch.

I can't wait to see who he fights next.

[Maxx]

I can't see how people think he doesn't belong. NCAA Champion wrestler, who's apparently gotten really good at striking. He learns some submission defense and he looks like he'll be damn good.

Who'd be a good opponent for him now?

[SteeleAround]

Hmm...for my money, I'd say Kongo or Hardonk. I'd love both fights.

[VerbalPuke]

I have to agree with Steele around, Lesnar did seem a bit tentative. It seemed to me that he had Mir, but let up on him just a bit, instead of going for the kill. Unfortunately he was caught in a submission, but I think he could be a force if he continues to bust his ass. He already has the wrestling pedigree and of course is an incredibly strong dude, so it should be interesting to see where he goes from here.

I enjoyed the whole card, UFC never disappoints me, they always manage to put on a good undercard on top of that main events. Tyson Griffin is becoming a guy I like to watch fight, he works hard out there, I'd say it was his fight with Frankie Edgar that made me a fan (and of Edgar). I wouldn't mind seeing those two go at it again.

I sort of missed/didn't pay attention to the Sylvia and Noguiera fight, but that's because I had a bit of alcohol (just a bit ) floating in my brain so my attention span was gone. Glad to see Sylvia lose, I respect his fighting game, but for whatever reason I'm just simply not a fan.

Oh yeah, why were they fighting for the interim heavyweight championship? What happened to Couture?

[apsham]

Couture for whatever reason doesn't want to be in with the UFC anymore, from my understanding it's because he was upset that he was getting paid less than Liddell, even when he was winning and Liddell was losing. He relinquished the title, but Dana White says that he is STILL the champion and he is still, no matter what, obligated to his two final fights. It's been slow trying to get him back.... I think the hope was for him to fight either Sylvia or Nogueira on this show.

[Gene Kiniski]

Couture for whatever reason doesn't want to be in with the UFC anymore, from my understanding it's because he was upset that he was getting paid less than Liddell, even when he was winning and Liddell was losing. He relinquished the title, but Dana White says that he is STILL the champion and he is still, no matter what, obligated to his two final fights. It's been slow trying to get him back.... I think the hope was for him to fight either Sylvia or Nogueira on this show.

[Herr Matzat]

How did Brock Lesnar not see that kneebar coming? My grandmother could have seen that and avoided it. Brock has all the physical tools, but from what I know of UFC, he looked incredibly green and inexperienced.

[GRIFT]

Considering what we've seen from Brock Lesnar in the past I was shocked to see him so humble in his post match speech. Brock dominated early, but I think he got way too over confident. Had he not landed the punches to the back of the head causing the early break who knows what would have happened. Either way I like where this could lead if he stays the course and gets some polishing as a fighter. Not many people can lose a fight in 90 seconds and still come away looking dominant.

Edited February 3, 2008 by The Grifter

[Enter Blue Guy]

A little late, but my thoughts.

Sylvia vs. Nog

The Nog/broomstick theory is similar to the Ric Flair/broomstick theory. Flair could have a 5 star classic with an inanimate object, Nog can make an inanimate object look like a legit threat for 10-15 minutes until he snaps it half. Not that Sylvia is the MMA equal of a broomstick, but you get what I mean.

Sylvia is the complete opposite of Nog, he makes people look like shit. A huge, intimadating dude with nasty striking power, killer reach advantage who stays on the outside and picks his shots brilliantly. For most of fighters, that's stylistic suicide.

Classic Nog last night. Takes a beating, submission victory. You are never "winning" a fight against Nog until you finish him (because that happens often...) or the scorecards say you won. Nog is so mechanical when it comes to subs. Sees an opening, flawless setup and execution, nothing his opponent can do except come to the realization they've been victimized. Perfect first round for Tim, it had everything he needed except for the finish. Nog really made a strong comeback in the second of the fight. By the time the third round started, the one sided affair was long gone. Nog really rose to the occasion after a rough start. He was clearly outboxing Tim for the majority of the second round. People aren't giving Nog enough credit for this win.

Brock vs. Mir

Brock's explosiveness did a nice job of hiding how inexperienced he was, but that kneebar was coming for a mile away, proving Brock may have the tools, but still doesn't know how to use them all. That was the most blantant sub attempt I've ever seen. Frank might as well told Brock he was going for a leglock.

Still, there is no denying Brock came close to finishing that fight on several occasions. The takedown right into halfmount was impressive, though you could really see Brock's lack of grappling once he was on the ground. You can't really complain about the foul, Frank tucked his head in and Brock caught him in the back of it. The foul was addressed damn quick by Porno Steve, though. It didn't look like Brock was blatantly fouling, he only hit him twice at most with short ranged hammerfists, and I didn't hear a verbal warning (edit: I didn't hear it, but apparently he did warn him). I guess you got to take Brock's devastating "canned hams" into consideration. Anyways, the better fighter won, but Brock showed he can be a force. Just not in the UFC right now. WEC needs a heavyweight division for situations like this.

This biggest reaction Mir has ever gotten. Actually, the only other time the crowd has supported Frank was against Wes Sims.

Nate vs. Horn

Nate Marquardt looked tremendous. Jeremy Horn is the consumate gamer, any victory over him is a respectable one. You could see the frustration in Horn, which is very rare, as he wasn't able to do anything until the end of the round. Nice gogo defense on Nate's behalf, very patient and composed, even though it led to a sweep, it was at the very end off the round and Horn could nothing with the advantage. Beautiful guillotine by Nate to finish. He capitalized on Horn going right for the leg and was able to get the choke with both arms in right away. I think Marquardt is a guy who really has a lot more to offer in the UFC, despite already losing in a title fight... Nate's strategy against Anderson was crap. There are going to be some big victories coming up for Nate. He's a UFC vet now, he's comfortable, he's been to the top of the mountain, and he should be even better in his second trek up.

Griffin vs. Tibau

Tyson Griffin is really on a tear since losing to Edgar. You can say what you want about the razor close decision win over Guida, even Tavares, but Griffin is climbing up the ladder. Tibau had some beautiful takedowns, but Griffin just made them worth nothing by powering out of them. Picked him apart with his stand up, which looks like he spent a lot of him working on.

Other shit...

Almeida's guillotine victory was an awesome visual. Guillotine, slam, flips over into top position, completely sunk in guillotine,

Tim Boetsch was insane last night. I've never heard of him before, but he was a beast. No disrespect to Heath, he's not quite championship material, regardless, Boetsch was a machine in there. Killer finish. Knee, knee, knee, knee, knee, knee, knee, violent toss into the cage (complete with faceplant), punch, punch, punch, over.

Also, maybe I missed it, but did they formally announce Shogun vs. Liddell? I didn't see it, but I was in and out of the room when there wasn't a fight on TV.

Edited February 3, 2008 by Enter Blue Guy

[Ananas]

As was mentioned on today's Bryan & Vinnie show, anyone else think Tim Sylvia would be a great second opponent for Brock? I mean, if people get off seeing Sylvia humbled, this would be a genuine humbling. Reach advantage or not, I'd love to see Sylvia try to avoid Brock's take down attempts. Brock looked like a monster tonight, and I can't see a better way for him to establish credibility than to dominate the former champ.

Great show. On paper iffy-to-bad, in execution good. Like the anti-Rumble.

[Slogger]

I've seen this and that fight should have been over when Brock had him in the G&P, After that i think Brock got lost and thought, 'What the fuck do i have to do to get rid of this guy?' and while this was going on, Frank got the knee and by the time Brock saw what was going on, It was over.

[Evansfan1]

It shows right away Brock is dominant enough to be one of the best in the heavyweight division. He is still unexperienced in the sport and working harder and harder will only get him closer to the top. His takedown is outstanding and it seemed he was throwing some sick punches, but very wild at times. As long as he can keep his composure and not get lost in the match, I can see him having a good run in the UFC. Work on his mistake against Mir and avoid the leg lock in the future. Otherwise, I really think he is the next big thing in MMA.

[Gabriel]

The leg lock isn't the only thing Brock needs to be wary of in the future though. Coming into this fight, he's a wrestler who happens to have the ability to drop bombs with his fists. That's great and everything, but Frank Mir took that beating, stayed composed and pulled from a style that Brock isn't familiar with to finish him quickly.

Brock needs to train hard at the other disciplines to at least understand what they're capable of, and how to defend against them. If he stays the course and works hard, he'll be fine. One of the best? Probably not, but pretty damn good.

His next opponent should be someone who is equally dominant at their particular discipline, but also equally inept when it comes to the others.

Also... Big Nog is the fucking man. Sylvia is a great fighter and can be exciting when he wants to be, but the last thing I wanted to see was Tim "I just don't want to lose, so I'll just do enough to win" Sylvia as the Heavyweight Champion again. Also, is it just me, or did Tim come across as slightly retarded in his comments? "For me, being the World Champion means that you're the best in your division." Uh... yeah.

[DMN in the House]

Bwahahahahaha.

Don't get me wrong, I like Lesnar, and think that with some more seasoning, he can do good things, but that is funny. Anyone should have seen that sub coming.

Also, Boetsch may have become my favorite fighter, as of last night.

[Skummy]

To be fair, Mir is a much more experienced fighter than Lesnar - and how often is it you see a rookie (which is all Lesnar is) get thrown straight into a match with a former World Champion? The cynic in me would even go so far as to suggest that it's the UFC purposefully wanting to show their "superiority" over wrestling, and while I doubt that's true, I hardly think it's fair that a new signing, and a newcomer to the sport, no matter how big a name they are, should be put in such a high profile fight so soon.

[DMN in the House]

Everything I've heard suggests it was really about money. Either way, they were going to get someone they can market out of it. If Brock wins, they can market the hell out of him, and if Mir wins, they can market his comeback. The way it worked out was almost perfect for UFC, the more experienced fighter won, showing that it takes skill to fight in the UFC, and not just power, Brock looked good, and showed that, with training, he could be for real, and Mir got the win. Win/win for UFC. The loss dosen't hurt Brock at all.

[IAceI]

If Brock had mounted Mir one more time I reckon he had him. Some of those hammer blows were devastating for Mir and when the match started the way it did I thought Brock was just gonna keep taking him down and pounding him until someone stopped the fight. The back of the head shots were a bit of a low blow for him, apparently he got a verbal warning but considering the speed he was hammering him, just seems a bit harsh - the first one was definately accidental but it's the way UFC goes, Brock shouldn't have been so suspect to that leglock attempt, but he'll live and learn and he will be a force. I did enjoy it because he can definitely be a force, I'll be backing him for sure, and it did seem that they wanted to show his superiority.

Loved how Goldberg and Rogan blantatly didn't care about his WWE experience, and rightly so. They mean nothing when it comes to straight up fighting like this. Also really loved the "Lets see how quick Brock goes for a take.. *take down*"

Nate Mardquart was an absolute beast, he looked fantastic and was great to see. He was absolutely ripped and I think I've found a new person to follow - since that Renato Sobral was fired a while ago. And Hughes has become GSP's bitch . I'm on the Nate the Great train now. He was fantastic.

The guillotine chokes that night were immense. Nogueira was fantastic, he just took a pounding and then synched in that guillotine out of nowhere and got the victory.

Boetsch was an animal against Heath. Rob Yundt's comment of "I'm going to tear his fucking head off" seemed to backfire, but he was gracious in defeat. Almeida looked great, good to see his return come off successfully.

Tyson Griffin set the pace early on, I quite liked Tibau. He made the 155 division look like nothing given his size compared to Griffin.

Great event, really enjoyed it.

[Vendetta]

Sylvia and Lesnar would be down right awesome as both men are great strikers. Lesnar well have his best fights with top notch strikers.

[TheSqauredCircleMessiah]

I love how Dana White has been railing against boxing for years, calling it crooked and corrupt and then he goes one of the sleaziest things that boxing does and name interim champions just for the monetary value of having championship fights.