Premier League 2023/24

[Colly]

15 minutes ago, DavidMarrio said:

Yeah but anti-Liverpool/scouse rhetoric always trumps common sense thinking in football. Any chance to score points, "Always the victims" and all that jazz. 

I think this is a nonsense by the way. You can go back to my comments on the Champions League final in Paris to see I don't have that attitude, but I also don't see why fans of other teams should be up in arms about the decision. I certainly don't remember fans of other clubs kicking up a fuss about the one I mentioned above which was admittedly less comical but an equally bad fuckup, especially when the on field ref even watched it on tv and still got it wrong.

[Bobfoc]

My general annoyance with VAR, issues like this aside, is the way it takes some of the "in the moment" excitement out of the game. Most of the time when I see a goal scored or a penalty awarded, I'm waiting for the inevitable VAR check. It makes crowd celebrations feel a bit more muted as many fans probably go through the same thought process.

[Colly]

Honestly I don't think it's as bad as it felt at first, and I kind of like the "ohhhhhhhhh" suspense before a tight call. There's also that little bit of excitement when the refs missed something and gets called to the screen which is only about 20 yards from me. The only thing really lacking is the lack of communication, I presume there's something on the big screen but only about 40% of St James' can see that, I've always felt "Checking decision - offside" or whatever should appear on the advertising hoardings while a check tales place. It's a few seconds of lost advert time, but it's a nice bit of US style razzmatazz for tv and stadium audiences and if anything draws you to look at them more anyway.

[DavidMarrio]

30 minutes ago, Colly said:

I think this is a nonsense by the way. You can go back to my comments on the Champions League final in Paris to see I don't have that attitude, but I also don't see why fans of other teams should be up in arms about the decision. I certainly don't remember fans of other clubs kicking up a fuss about the one I mentioned above which was admittedly less comical but an equally bad fuckup, especially when the on field ref even watched it on tv and still got it wrong.

I'm not saying about people in here but generally speaking the shit I've had said to me because of where I'm from and the team I support, its really not nonsense. Holiday for my wifes 30th we spent 5 days in an all inclusive hotel having a Londoner have a pop because of where we are from, every time saw us. That's one example of a number. Champions League had so many people saying stuff about its always the scousers etc rather than hang on what's going on here. 

I don't care about the result. I care about having a system that is fit for purpose, with people being able to communicate on a basic level and make the correct calls. It was a system put in place to reduce human error not create more.  If that happened to any other team I'd feel the same. I don't like the culture there seems to be with the refs of automstically backing up friends ala Mike Dean on VAR and the Cucurella incident last season cause he didnt want to embarrass or make his mate feel bad. 

Have dedicated VAR officials. Have dedicated onfield officials. Be more transparent, why not mic the refs up. Why is it that first two weeks players were booked for doing the card gesture and now why is it Joelinton (this is just one example I'm picking but can be so many other players) can do it 5 times and not get booked? 

There needs to be better standards across the board than there has been. I get subjective decisions can be contested. Jones' red is a perfect example because despite the vast majority on here being it is a red, so many in the media etc have said the opposite. Offside especially with technology is not subjective. Is he off or isn't he. 

That could have been any match. It may have happened several times and we may not have known. But if this brings catalyst for change then good cause it needs to happen. If not I'd rather go back to not having VAR and if someone makes a mistake its sound cause least it's more understandable 

[METALMAN]

People make mistakes. It’s only football. Chill out. 

[Colly]

14 minutes ago, DavidMarrio said:

I'm not saying about people in here but generally speaking the shit I've had said to me because of where I'm from and the team I support, its really not nonsense. Holiday for my wifes 30th we spent 5 days in an all inclusive hotel having a Londoner have a pop because of where we are from, every time saw us. That's one example of a number. Champions League had so many people saying stuff about its always the scousers etc rather than hang on what's going on here. 

This is your first error really. Never expect quality humans in an all inclusive hotel.

[METALMAN]

Are they really that bad? I quite like the idea of going to an all-inclusive hotel and not doing anything for a week or so. The main thing that’s put me off is the one time I have been to one was when I was in Malta for a conference hosted at the place and the food was so bad that I ate outside the hotel anyway.

[DavidMarrio]

Purely depends on the quality of the food and if you're wanting a drink what they have on offer. 

When we went Lanzarote, the food was fantastic and there weren't any divvies in the hotel so was a really good week of relaxation. The one in Crete not so much and I still feel bad that Heather spent the evening of her 30th having to listen to a drunk cockney saying he pays our benefits. 

 

[gunnar hendershow]

All-inclusives are definitely a monkey's paw type vacation. You can just eat, drink, relax, and if you want get driven about on excursions (for an added fee) without any effort on your part. Unfortunately you also have to sit next to the single most annoying human being you have ever met each time you're at the bar or a restaurant.

[Colly]

I'm aware this is my snobbishness coming out (my town was once rated the poorest in the country and I went to the shittest of the 3 secondary schools...), but as a concept it's a holiday where you try to make your moneys worth by consuming as much food and drink as possible. That's why there was such uproar a few years back when Spanish resorts suggested limiting the amount of booze you could have daily because they were sick of babysitting and cleaning up after pissed up Brits. Add to that the fact you can go all the way to another country and not leave the complex in two weeks, it's not entirely surprising to bump into "intolerant Londoner".

[Lineker]

Quote

Liverpool manager Jurgen Klopp wants the Premier League game against Tottenham to be replayed after Luis Diaz's goal was wrongly disallowed by the video assistant referee.

VAR Darren England and assistant Dan Cook did not overrule when Diaz was flagged offside at 0-0 on Saturday.

Liverpool lost 2-1 thanks to a 96th-minute own goal from Joel Matip.

"Something like this never happened, so that is why I think a replay is the right thing to do," said Klopp.

Referees' body PGMOL released the audio of discussions between the match officials over the offside on Monday.

In the audio, England says the check is "perfect" before swearing when he realises a mistake has been made.

Klopp said: "The audio didn't change it at all. It is an obvious mistake. There should be solutions for that. The outcome should be a replay. But it probably won't happen.

"The argument against that would be it opens the gates. It is unprecedented. I'm used to wrong and difficult decisions, but something like this never happened."

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67003386

 

 

[DavidMarrio]

Think any idea of a replay is daft. 

Just competency and better standards of officiating  (on and off the field) and revamping VAR is what's needed. That and officials putting themselves in situations like going UAE two days before a game

[Colly]

I say this not as a Newcastle fan but as a general football person, Newcastle should be awarded 30 points for reasons.

[Hobo]

I think its a sensible thing to expect when there was a massive error to which the match officials have owned up to having made.

But it wont happen. Officials wont go for it and theres too much petty tribalism in the sport for other clubs to do the correct thing and demand better officiating for the benefit of the league as a whole.

[Colly]

While the reasons behind the error are fairly unprecedented, the error itself is just a wrongly disallowed offside goal. That happened last season to Arsenal against Brentford and Brighton against Palace. No one mentioned replaying either of those games.

Yes, improve the system, but we'd have to replay hundreds of games if a single refereeing error leading to a goal being given or not was grounds for a complete restart.

Jan Vertonghen is in favour though.

 

 

[Naitch]

11 minutes ago, Hobo said:

I think its a sensible thing to expect

You think wrongly. The precedent it would set is unimaginable - it's already been said but putting a major spotlight on a clear flaw in a process which has been criticised since day one to little response, and improving said process immediately, is the best possible thing that could've happened here.

It will suck if Liverpool's final league standing is affected by three points, particularly if it's in that crucial 4-8th area where it makes a big difference financially (at which point I imagine legal action might be taken against PGMOL), and any clubs pipped to a position by Spurs might be a bit miffed too, but Mr. "We play too many games" demanding to play another top level game just because he's upset is sheer hypocrisy.

The demand for better officiating has been shared by fans of several/most Premier League clubs for many years (does anyone want Anthony Taylor in charge of their games, for example?) and this has finally achieved it. Making ridiculous requests that go further is just throwing toys out of prams. There's no tribalism about it at that point!

[stokeriño]

I demand a replay of the 2009 Champions League semi final, on the condition that the original Chelsea/Barcelona teams play it, including 47-year-old Juliano Belletti.

[DavidMarrio]

23 minutes ago, Naitch said:

It will suck if Liverpool's final league standing is affected by three points

This bit I can see being something in the back of Klopp's mind especially given we've missed out on the title by one point on two seperate occasions given that any title race we've had, City decide to reach uber levels of consistency. That's probably something that the club may have thought about over the past few days. 

Again. Just want to reiterate I do think the idea of a replay is a daft idea. It's done but this needs to bring about reform for VAR and standards of officiating. 

Also want to say I do think its mad that PGMOL seem to be unable to apologise. In the what feels like werkly statments they've released this season they never once just say sorry we've made a mistake. 

[Colly]

I get the impression they've apologised to the club, though it does feel odd it hasn't been public by comparison to the other few this season.

Legal action against PGMOL is an interesting concept though, if Liverpool go for it there's a couple of other clubs who've had apologies already this season, it might end up a big list.

[lanky316]

One step at a time, they've finally started to actually make statements. It wasn't that long ago that wrong decisions were ignored and the only form of statement or response from the authorities was to fine anyone who said anything about it. That they're at least making statements saying "yes, that was a mistake" is a huge improvement from making bad excuses or ignoring it had happened.