Official 2012/13 Premier League thread

[Matt]

I can't see Suarez going anywhere in January. In the summer, maybe, if one of Europe's big boys come knocking. But I can't see Liverpool selling their only striker midseason.

[Colly]

Naturally.

Although Carroll is not the best example because I put that more down to last-minute panic.

Of course, but the (I believe) 5 year deal he'd just signed had to have an impact on that price.

[hugobomb]

Peter Herbert 'ill-advised' says PFA's Clarke Carlisle

Peter Herbert's criticisms of the Football Association and Chelsea are "ill-advised" and "unwelcome", according to Professional Footballers' Association chairman Clarke Carlisle.

Herbert, chairman of the Society of Black Lawyers, accused the FA of being "institutionally racist."

But Carlisle believes Herbert is in no position to make such comments.

"It is ill-advised for Mr Herbert to make accusations of collusions and cover-ups," he said. "It is unwelcome."

Herbert, who made the official complaint to the Metropolitan Police Service, is also behind the plans for a potential black players' breakaway union.

The human-rights barrister believes the FA has not done enough to investigate a complaint against referee Mark Clattenburg after he allegedly used "inappropriate language" towards Chelsea's John Obi Mikel and Juan Mata during the Blues' 3-2 defeat at home to Manchester United n 28 October.

But Carlisle said Herbert was "speaking about the incident from a position of little or zero evidence."

Carlisle added: "He made his report to the police off the back of information he received from the Daily Mail and I have greater faith in Chelsea and the FA acting accordingly with their first-hand evidence and witnesses.

"The case is being dealt with correctly - as it should be in the current climate - rather than with a third or fourth party observing from the outside. I wouldn't want to comment on what is going on without the full facts and evidence."

Later, speaking on BBC Radio 5 Live, Carlisle added: "Mr Herbert has made plenty of statements recently, and a lot of them seem to have been misguided in my personal opinion.

"There's definitely still an issue with racism that we have to tackle in the game, but he's using such emotive and antagonistic language that it seems to be setting up division within this campaign against racism, as opposed to trying to form the collaborative effort which football has been trying to do for many years.

"As a union, we need to make sure that we don't set up separate entities to fight racism. It's our remit as human beings and as members of our society to tackle racism. That's white, black and Asian and all in between."

Chelsea made a formal complaint on 29 October. A day later, the FA opened an investigation into the allegation, part of which was that Clattenburg used racial language.

On Tuesday, police suspended its investigation because "no victims" had come forward, which meant the matter could not be investigated "without a victim and/or any evidence that any offence has been committed".

But the FA confirmed its investigation would proceed, with Herbert furious that neither the governing body or Chelsea had taken the matter to the police. The FA is expected to announce its findings in the coming days

Clarke Carlisle being awesome and essentially telling Herbert to shut the fuck up (in fancier words obviously)

[DavidMarrio]

Mancini turned up at the Man City press conference today wearing a mask of David Platt

Also...Lucas is back in training

[stokeriño]

John Terry will supposedly be out for only three weeks with what is an MCL strain. He is, after all, made of granite...

Also, Frank Lampard is close to a return but not for tomorrow.

[Rafael]

Great to hear the new about Lucas. Paulinho is good, but nowhere near the class Lucas has on that position.

[DavidMarrio]

Great to hear the new about Lucas. Paulinho is good, but nowhere near the class Lucas has on that position.

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

It was obvious how bad we missed him last season and I think its been the same again this season so far that we've missed him breaking up attacks. Hopefully he'll be fit for the Spurs game at the end of the month.

[Hobo]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

Some rumblings yesterday that we might be close to getting Raheem Sterling tied down to a new contract. That was far more worrying to me than any rumours about Suarez going (with City, Liverpool and Suarez too IIRC all going "Nope" on that) as Sterling's agent had previously rejected a contract offer.

[Rafael]

Great to hear the new about Lucas. Paulinho is good, but nowhere near the class Lucas has on that position.

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

It was obvious how bad we missed him last season and I think its been the same again this season so far that we've missed him breaking up attacks. Hopefully he'll be fit for the Spurs game at the end of the month.

Yet, brazilian critics constantly attack him without a single reason.

[Colly]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

That makes sense really, same as how Newcastle fans spotted the aceness of Tiote in his first season while pundits were just describing him as 'yellow card man', then deciding he was alright last season when he was actually rubbish and wasteful with the ball. Regular watchers will generally have a better clue, unless its the divvys who sit behind me and slate Jonas and HBA all game.

[Lineker]

Great to hear the new about Lucas. Paulinho is good, but nowhere near the class Lucas has on that position.

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

It was obvious how bad we missed him last season and I think its been the same again this season so far that we've missed him breaking up attacks. Hopefully he'll be fit for the Spurs game at the end of the month.

Yet, brazilian critics constantly attack him without a single reason.

Because he's no Cheik Tiote?

[stokeriño]

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

This paragraph could also have been written about Chelsea fans and Mikel.

Well, nearly. There are still a number of idiots who slam his every move.

[TCO]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

That makes sense really, same as how Newcastle fans spotted the aceness of Tiote in his first season while pundits were just describing him as 'yellow card man', then deciding he was alright last season when he was actually rubbish and wasteful with the ball. Regular watchers will generally have a better clue, unless its the divvys who sit behind me and slate Jonas and HBA all game.

To be fair Guttierez has been poor this season. He's really not good enough to play in centre midfield when he's been asked to play there. I love him and the engine he provides to the team. I wouldn't slate him but he's not had a good season at all.

[DavidMarrio]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

Some rumblings yesterday that we might be close to getting Raheem Sterling tied down to a new contract. That was far more worrying to me than any rumours about Suarez going (with City, Liverpool and Suarez too IIRC all going "Nope" on that) as Sterling's agent had previously rejected a contract offer.

The 09/10 season was probably the year he stepped up and people started to take notice of him after Alonso left, 08/09 he had some good performances but there were quite a few poor ones. Think that was when Rafa came out and said people don't know how good he is.

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

This paragraph could also have been written about Chelsea fans and Mikel.

Well, nearly. There are still a number of idiots who slam his every move.

Mikel is one of those players I find that when people have an opinion on him its always split in that people either think he's crap and overrated or he's good and underrated. Personally I think he's a decent player and does the job he needs to but he's always one of the Chelsea players I've noticed who people pick up on easy if he makes the tiniest mistake.

[Rafael]

Great to hear the new about Lucas. Paulinho is good, but nowhere near the class Lucas has on that position.

It's been pretty special to watch how he transformed over the years at us from coming here as an attacking mid to being transitioned into a holding midfielder because there was a time when he wasn't playing well at all and the fans didn't really like him but last season and the season before that showed what a great player he really is and how much he has improved.

It was obvious how bad we missed him last season and I think its been the same again this season so far that we've missed him breaking up attacks. Hopefully he'll be fit for the Spurs game at the end of the month.

Yet, brazilian critics constantly attack him without a single reason.

Because he's no Cheik Tiote?

Because he's no Xavi.

[Colly]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

That makes sense really, same as how Newcastle fans spotted the aceness of Tiote in his first season while pundits were just describing him as 'yellow card man', then deciding he was alright last season when he was actually rubbish and wasteful with the ball. Regular watchers will generally have a better clue, unless its the divvys who sit behind me and slate Jonas and HBA all game.

To be fair Guttierez has been poor this season. He's really not good enough to play in centre midfield when he's been asked to play there. I love him and the engine he provides to the team. I wouldn't slate him but he's not had a good season at all.

I half agree but given that no one outside of maybe Santon and Ben Arfa have looked remotely good this season (Ba's nicked a few goals from nowhere but has otherwise been useless, Colo and Shola have looked decent but not played enough), and that Jonas has been played in at least three positions already this season I can't criticise too much. In the working three man midfield at the end of last year he looked fantastic, a lack of Tiote and Ba and Cisse still not working together mean we've not managed to get that shape right again.

These lads are divs though, they'll slate him for other players errors. Proper proper divs. They were slagging Obertan on Sunday when Santon played the worst pass ever to him and he couldn't keep it in.

[Rafael]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

That makes sense really, same as how Newcastle fans spotted the aceness of Tiote in his first season while pundits were just describing him as 'yellow card man', then deciding he was alright last season when he was actually rubbish and wasteful with the ball. Regular watchers will generally have a better clue, unless its the divvys who sit behind me and slate Jonas and HBA all game.

To be fair Guttierez has been poor this season. He's really not good enough to play in centre midfield when he's been asked to play there. I love him and the engine he provides to the team. I wouldn't slate him but he's not had a good season at all.

I half agree but given that no one outside of maybe Santon and Ben Arfa have looked remotely good this season (Ba's nicked a few goals from nowhere but has otherwise been useless, Colo and Shola have looked decent but not played enough), and that Jonas has been played in at least three positions already this season I can't criticise too much. In the working three man midfield at the end of last year he looked fantastic, a lack of Tiote and Ba and Cisse still not working together mean we've not managed to get that shape right again.

These lads are divs though, they'll slate him for other players errors. Proper proper divs. They were slagging Obertan on Sunday when Santon played the worst pass ever to him and he couldn't keep it in.

Most of the players aren't doing well basically because of this 4-4-2 that Pardew is playing. Playing Ben Arfa right next to the full-back is terrible, and yet he manages one or two plays. The same is with Cabaye and Gutiérrez, both are playing too deep. With these guys playing deep, Ba and Cissé have to work the ball with each other, and they're not good at that. Going back to the 4-3-3 with Tioté, Cabaye and Anita at the middle and Gutiérrez, Ba and Ben Arfa at the wings would be the ideal formation for this team.

[Colly]

That's what everyone says, but whenever we've played it this year (West Brom even with the undeserved win, Everton away first half, others) we've been useless. Ben Arfa has actually looked okay on the right and has tracked back well but he's our only proper outlet and as such is double or triple marked all game, and Simpson isn't going to get forward to make any space.

At this stage I think Jonas is a better centre mid (or left back) than an advanced winger these days, but due to Obertan and particularly Marveaux not impressing so far we just don't have the personnel for the 'two men off a striker, Robben/Drogba/Duff' system. Pards is trying, he's put Ferguson there who's then had some of his poorer games, and 4-4-2 with Shola has tended to work better and got some important results.

We'll get there eventually, and injuries and suspensions to key players (Tiote, Colo, Krul) haven't helped. No panic.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Colly

[DavidMarrio]

I would say most regular viewers of Liverpool games caught on to how good Lucas is about a year before anyone else.

That makes sense really, same as how Newcastle fans spotted the aceness of Tiote in his first season while pundits were just describing him as 'yellow card man', then deciding he was alright last season when he was actually rubbish and wasteful with the ball. Regular watchers will generally have a better clue, unless its the divvys who sit behind me and slate Jonas and HBA all game.

To be fair Guttierez has been poor this season. He's really not good enough to play in centre midfield when he's been asked to play there. I love him and the engine he provides to the team. I wouldn't slate him but he's not had a good season at all.

I half agree but given that no one outside of maybe Santon and Ben Arfa have looked remotely good this season (Ba's nicked a few goals from nowhere but has otherwise been useless, Colo and Shola have looked decent but not played enough), and that Jonas has been played in at least three positions already this season I can't criticise too much. In the working three man midfield at the end of last year he looked fantastic, a lack of Tiote and Ba and Cisse still not working together mean we've not managed to get that shape right again.

These lads are divs though, they'll slate him for other players errors. Proper proper divs. They were slagging Obertan on Sunday when Santon played the worst pass ever to him and he couldn't keep it in.

Oh god I hate people like that at the match or if I'm watching it at the pub, pisses me off so much. I'll be sat there thinking "Do you know anything at all?" At least when i'm going the game its not always the same people near me so its good at times but when there are people like that at the match it winds me up. I have a mate who I try to blank out my mind when he is talking about football because he clearly doesn't have a clue and is so biased towards certain players and teams.

[ChrisSteeleAteMyHamster]

Tottenham will probably lose away to Arsenal at the weekend (hardly out of the norm) and the ridiculous Spurs fans and media will launch more fury on AVB.

However if this IS the case then we'll have lost away to Newcastle (hardly a rarity), away to Man City, away to Arsenal (if it happens) all of which aren't anything to be shocked by. The defeat at home to Wigan was HUUUUGELY disappointing but the victory away at Man Utd was HUUUUGELY wonderful.

To sum up: Stop forcing the man out and stop bitching about some kind of perceived underachieving.