Comic Book Films & TV

[TCO]

Kingpin was black in Daredevil and Nick Fury is black in the Avengers, that's one of the most successful movies of all time. I highly doubt they're casting for pedantic nerds who get pissy when things aren't like their precious comics. They're casting to provide the most entertaining and profitable movie possible for the mainstream. MBJ is awesome and will make a fantastic Johnny Storm.

Hell if it'll make everybody happy they can just make a new series of Fantastic 4 comics where The Human Torch is now Sue's adopted black brother Jamal.

[Gabriel]

Once the film is out, the actors and script will ultimately decide whether or not it works.

I think the major cause of all of the concern, is that it's one of many changes that have been rumored, and everyone's just worried that we're going to get another Fantastic Flop.

You always take a risk by changing things from the source material. Sometimes it works better. Sometimes it doesn't. There's just a lot of negative history with Fox and the Fantastic Four property, and there has been no transparency from the studio in regards to what's going on with the movie. We get tidbits of information that leak, and then a crazy amount of negative rumors that seem plausible based on what little we know. Fox would do well to look into some damage control here.

But yeah, people comparing a Black Johnny Storm to a White Black Panther is a bit daft. The ethnicity of the Fantastic Four has no bearing on their history/stories within Marvel Comics. While it's possible for a White man to be born and live in Africa, it is highly unlikely that he would be the leader of his own country and/or tribe of peoples.

[=BK=]

Kingpin was black in Daredevil and Nick Fury is black in the Avengers, that's one of the most successful movies of all time. I highly doubt they're casting for pedantic nerds who get pissy when things aren't like their precious comics. They're casting to provide the most entertaining and profitable movie possible for the mainstream. MBJ is awesome and will make a fantastic Johnny Storm.

Hell if it'll make everybody happy they can just make a new series of Fantastic 4 comics where The Human Torch is now Sue's adopted black brother Jamal.

There was already a black Fury in Ultimate Marvel. That's why it doesn't anger people. But "It's another universe!" is enough reason for Fury to be back in the Ultimate line then I guess it's enough reason for Johnny being black in the Fox Movie universe.

Also "The long lost Storm brother, Jamal!" seems like something you'd see on a really old Marvel comic. I dig it.

[Colly]

I don't give a toss about black Torch, Ben Grimm is a scrawny lad from Billingham so all is right in the world.

[zero]

Michael B. Jordan willbe the highlight of the film. Guaranteed.

And yes, getting upset about it is racist. There's literally no other reason to care that much. And if your only point is that Johnny and Sue have to be blood relatives, you miss the entire point about what makes a family, which is kinda the point of the Fantastic Four.

[TKz]

Michael B. Jordan willbe the highlight of the film. Guaranteed.

And yes, getting upset about it is racist. There's literally no other reason to care that much. And if your only point is that Johnny and Sue have to be blood relatives, you miss the entire point about what makes a family, which is kinda the point of the Fantastic Four.

It's almost like that might be a point they're trying to make!?

Nah, couldn't be. They just want to mess with continuity so people won't go see the film. That makes more sense.

[TKz]

Captain Marvel or Adam Warlock a huge possibility. Awesome.

And Yondu and Ronan in the next trailer.

[EWB's Best Poster.]

Kingpin was black in Daredevil and Nick Fury is black in the Avengers, that's one of the most successful movies of all time. I highly doubt they're casting for pedantic nerds who get pissy when things aren't like their precious comics. They're casting to provide the most entertaining and profitable movie possible for the mainstream. MBJ is awesome and will make a fantastic Johnny Storm.

Hell if it'll make everybody happy they can just make a new series of Fantastic 4 comics where The Human Torch is now Sue's adopted black brother Jamal.

There was already a black Fury in Ultimate Marvel. That's why it doesn't anger people. But "It's another universe!" is enough reason for Fury to be back in the Ultimate line then I guess it's enough reason for Johnny being black in the Fox Movie universe.

Also "The long lost Storm brother, Jamal!" seems like something you'd see on a really old Marvel comic. I dig it.

Should be pointed out that Fury version was based on Sam Jackson, even at one point when asked who would play him on a movie he said "Sam Jackson of course". So his role is made for him.

There isnt many reasons (except continuity, which would be a reason if you needed one) for storm to be white. But there isnt a lot of reasons he needs to be black either.

I would actually have less of an issue with Mr fantastic being black, as it is just a race. I've more an issue of changing the brother sister dynamic that'd been canon since day one.

[livid]

I don't get the canon thing. Comics tweak canon all the time but movies can't? That's dumb.

[DoubleX]

For film characters of a different ethnicity than their comic book counterpart being excellent choices, exhibit A should always be Idris Elba as Heimdall. There was a similar debate when he was announced as the actor to play Heimdall, but I recall Kenneth Branagh in an interview basically saying he picked Elba because of how good of an actor he was, and not because of the colour of his skin. And he was excellent in both Thor movies.

[livid]

That's why I like this cast of Fantastic Four. They're all good actors. And that's infinitely more important to me than how closely it resembles the comics.

[Colly]

I think you've just got to apply a bit of common sense, which Kirkland hasn't. Black Panthers background is African royalty albeit in a fictional nation, Shang-Chi is a kung fu stereotype and originally the son of Fu Manchu, and to be fair is also a bit rubbish. Jonny Storm, Nick Fury, and the Kingpin are American characters with backgrounds that would in no way proclude them from being black, so why should they? Heimdall of course is a mystical space God so he should definitely be a whitey.

That's not even a hard and fast rule, but those are all examples where the character backgrounds barely have to be touched by the casting choice.

[tristy]

hey guys shut up and let's talk about how Nikolaj Arcel could direct a Dr. Strange movie. ohmygodyes

[TKz]

I care less about that and more about the idea of Mads as Dr. Strange. Kind of a bummer though, I was psyched at the idea of Fede Alvarez directing because Evil Dead 2013 was so good and I think he could nail the feel of Dr. Strange and Marvel Mystic.

[ZJ Penn]

With regards to Fantastic Four, I can kind of understand where the disappointed people are coming from. I've read a ton of FF recently (mainly old stuff) and anything but the 'young blonde kid' will be off kilter with how I see him. That said, I'd be more concerned with the depiction of Mr. Fantastic. He's the gruff genius who's always thinking on another level to everyone else. Maybe I haven't seen enough of Teller but "Hey Johnny! Watch me stretch my cock bro!" just pops into my head when anyone mentions him.

On the Doctor Strange front, I didn't think that would work as a movie. But if Guardians of the Galaxy is as good as the trailer looks then who knows?

[GoGo Yubari]

Nah, Teller's a good actor. I'm actually more confident in him than anyone else.

[Skummy]

I think you've just got to apply a bit of common sense, which Kirkland hasn't. Black Panthers background is African royalty albeit in a fictional nation, Shang-Chi is a kung fu stereotype and originally the son of Fu Manchu, and to be fair is also a bit rubbish. Jonny Storm, Nick Fury, and the Kingpin are American characters with backgrounds that would in no way proclude them from being black, so why should they? Heimdall of course is a mystical space God so he should definitely be a whitey.

That's not even a hard and fast rule, but those are all examples where the character backgrounds barely have to be touched by the casting choice.

Not to mention that there is a very, very small pool of black characters in comic books, and a nigh-on infinite selection of white ones. It's a positive move to address that balance, whereas casting a white guy as a historically black character is something quite different.

This sums it up as well as anything, despite the clumsy metaphor;

http://timemachineyeah.tumblr.com/post/58648290519/this-is-a-jar-full-of-major-characters

The white characters bowl is already so full that any change in number is almost meaningless (and is bound to be undone in mere minutes anyway, with the amount of new story creation going on), while the characters of color bowl changes hugely with each addition or subtraction, and any subtraction is a major loss.

This is also something to take in consideration when creating new characters. When you create a white character you have already, by the context of the larger culture, created a character with at least one feature that is not going to make a difference to the narratives at large. But every time you create a new character of color, you are changing something in our world.

The only possible argument is that they're messing with canon by making Sue and Jonny no longer be blood relations, but that is absolutely not essential to the plot, nor is it likely to affect the overall narrative. Canon gets changed all the time - these characters have existed for 53 years. You think they haven't been tweaked and messed with already in that time? In comics, cartoons, movies, every medium they've ever been in?

The absolute worst thing about comic book movies is this insistence on the movies being 100% accurate, sticking to the comic book canon as much as possible. Most of these comic books have had forty or fifty years of weekly, episodic storytelling, alternate timelines, periodic reboots...and you want us to stick to all of that? Not to mention that superhero comics are, by and large, very, very silly. I'd much rather that a movie stick to the basic essence of what the characters are supposed to be, and run with that, rather than keep every origin story and every plot point perfectly exact to the letter.

[Colly]

That really is a clumsy metaphor.

[Maxx]

Can you give us a metaphor for how bad it is?

[SRN]

hey guys shut up and let's talk about how Nikolaj Arcel could direct a Dr. Strange movie. ohmygodyes

Nikolaj Arcel wrote and directed "Island of Lost Souls" and wrote "Catch That Girl" and "Journey to Saturn". His resume is forever stained.