The Old Nintendo Megathread

[Sousa]

CAW CAW CAW CAW

[Berober]

...why is the ridiculously effeminate professor from Yu-Gi-Oh GX in Ace Attorney 5?

[Sousa]

I don't know who that is berober.

[Berober]

This guy:

[Sousa]

Because IN JUSTICE HE TRUSTS?

I assume that's who you mean.

[Your Mom]

So I am hitting Walmart on Thanksgiving. Apparently the 2DS is $99. If I can get one is that worth it?

[Sousa]

Definitely worth it.

[apsham]

Is the XL on sale at all?

[zero]

Target is selling the XL for $150 on Black Friday.

[apsham]

It's something to consider. I really liked the 2DS - but when I saw people with the XL screens I got jealous.

[zero]

I like the XL, but don't play it for long periods of time, it will murder your hands.

[apsham]

Maybe it depends on a variety of factors - I don't know, but I have one of those clear plastic cases on mine as well and I haven't really had issues with holding onto the sucker. So far at least.

[Lineker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIvyrM2ClZw

Seriously reconsidering and going to buy a WiiU.

[zero]

I really, really wish Nintendo would advertise this machine properly. It's so fun and so unique, yet most people don't even know it exists... hopefully Mario 3D World changes that because damn, that video was fun.

[apsham]

It is a real shame - I agree. I love the machine, but there are so many misconceptions out there about it combined with a stigma that Nintendo still has after the perception that many gamers received from the Wii. It's a real, damn shame.

At this point I don't know if it's a lost cause or not. Sales jumped up a bit with the Wind Waker HD release but with the other two consoles on the horizon more than a few people are going to still see the Wii U as "last generation" and go for the new, shiny thing.

[Skummy]

Oh, that Mario video is great. I already thought this looked like the most exciting new Mario game since Galaxy, and probably the most pure fun since before that, but everything I see looks better and better.

While I'm one of the biggest supporters of the WiiU gamepad, I've never really been a huge fan of the "manipulate the landscape with the touchscreen" stuff, though it's Nintendo first-party stuff so you know they're going to find a way to utilise every bit of hardware as best they can. If every game can include a glorified tech demo, you know it will.

Stuff like the Golden Express is delightfully insane, and I've seen things like that, the "Super Guide" and how easy it is in general to get a whole bunch of coins and lives in the later Mario games pointed to as a way they've been made "easier" by allowing you to get loads of extra lives relatively easily. Whoever makes those criticisms clearly hasn't been playing the games, because they are still fiendishly difficult. If anything, these additions aren't making the games easier, they're an excuse to make them harder by knowing you're not going to run out of lives, so they can make the actual level design more difficult. "Lives" are an archaic hangover from the coin-op days anyway.

I remember reading somewhere that, for this game, the developers were encouraged to try and find a use for every idea they ever had that was turned out, that was only half-used, or that was never followed through to its conclusion in previous Mario games, and just run with it. And it really shows - it almost looks like a "throwing shit at the wall" approach but, because it's Mario, it's so much more defined than that. It's just a barrage of new features, but on a recognisable enough format, and that's what Mario should be. As much as the last Mario Bros games for the Wii and WiiU were fun, they could rely a little too heavily on familiarity and nostalgia at times.

The fact that there are top-down shooter levels is amazing, and incorporating Mario Kart-style gameplay into a "conventional" Mario game feels like something that should have been done years ago.

As for the WiiU in general, I genuinely don't understand this idea of Nintendo having a "stigma". Maybe it's because I don't involve myself in the world of "gamers" as much as I used to be, but it seems like nothing more than snobbery to me.

[apsham]

When games started coming out that were on the WiiU, 360 and PS3 - my mind would not for a second let me believe that the WiiU would be a viable option. It's just because of the way that Nintendo's hardware has been for the last while... I had a very hard time believing that something could look AMAZING on a Nintendo console is all. And then I started seeing evidence and first hand evidence that stuff like Assassin's Creed III looked BETTER on the WiiU, etc.

Anyone who takes graphics into consideration (and lets be honest, without implicating "snobbery" into it) a lot of people are drawn to what they think is the "best". Think of how many searches there are for things along the line of "best tablet 2013" or "best graphics card 2013". People have been conditioned to think that graphics are everything... and Microsoft and Nintendo certainly come ahead of Nintendo in most people's minds.

[Sousa]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpGjKEt8wmw

God damn nintendo making everything super-easy.

EDIT: holy mother of god this video makes me physically anxious just REMEMBERING doing this level.

[Skummy]

When games started coming out that were on the WiiU, 360 and PS3 - my mind would not for a second let me believe that the WiiU would be a viable option. It's just because of the way that Nintendo's hardware has been for the last while... I had a very hard time believing that something could look AMAZING on a Nintendo console is all. And then I started seeing evidence and first hand evidence that stuff like Assassin's Creed III looked BETTER on the WiiU, etc.

Anyone who takes graphics into consideration (and lets be honest, without implicating "snobbery" into it) a lot of people are drawn to what they think is the "best". Think of how many searches there are for things along the line of "best tablet 2013" or "best graphics card 2013". People have been conditioned to think that graphics are everything... and Microsoft and Nintendo certainly come ahead of Nintendo in most people's minds.

Oh, I can see that, definitely.

It just seems, to me, like there was a conscious effort - though not as absurd and conspiracy theorist as this sounds - between Microsoft and Sony to make out that the Wii was "different". And Nintendo obviously played into that too, as a huge part of the marketing of both the Wii and the DS was to appeal to people who aren't conventionally "gamers"; I remember an interview with someone, probably Iwata, who said that the DS was aimed at the sort of person who'd never describe themselves as a "gamer", but who might play Minesweeper for half an hour at work, or play games on his or her phone. It was about reclaiming the notion of "games" for what games actually are - fun distractions, rather than the lifestyle choice that Microsoft and Sony try and market them as, and which too many people eat up the idea of.

It seems that Microsoft and Sony basically marginalised the Wii as "not a games console" to keep up this narrative of a console war between X-Box and Playstation, which drove up sales for both companies, even though it's absurd when the Wii massively outsold them both. You'd have two sets of fans arguing over which console was better, because that's what they'd been conditioned to do, when, really, someone stepping in and saying "actually, this one, this has outsold both of the others by a wide margin". But as soon as you can say "oh, but that one doesn't really count", you can get back to only caring about the "big two".

I can definitely see the graphics thing, though - while I've pretty much never cared for graphics as a major selling point, they're obviously eyecatching and impressive, and if you come from a PC gaming background, graphics almost goes hand-in-hand with playability; if your computer can't handle the graphics, it can't play the game at all. And for consoles, it's your easiest way to sell something new. Graphics can be easily equated with the power of the console.

But ever since the PS1, all I've ever really wanted is for a games company to approach making games in much the same way that they did for 8-bit or 16-bit consoles. Use the expanded storage space and processing power to make the games prettier, sure, but more to make them bigger and better, more fluid, more exciting. I think that's what a lot of great indie games have gone, and that's the most exciting thing in gaming to me right now. But I also think Nintendo have done a good job of it too. And I think Nintendo, with the Wii certainly, did well to stick with more "cartoonish" games, as the dearth in graphical output compared to the other consoles was less obvious there. But, honestly, as much as I find some PS3 games very pretty, and I know full well that it's a massive selling point for a lot of people, I don't think the difference is anything like that big - if I saw a Wii game running side-to-side alongside its PS3 counterpart for comparison, I'm sure it would be a striking difference, but when in real life does that ever happen? It's not like the graphics are so poor as to be detrimental to the experience.

And as for the PS4 and X-Box One...from the footage I've seen, I'm sure the graphics are prettier, but not so much so that I even see it as being a selling point any more. How much better can we get before it just doesn't matter any more? The new Assassins Creed, on the PS3, looks beautiful. I can't imagine it looking substantially better on the PS4, and certainly not to the extent that I would look down upon the PS3 version for it.

Graphics can only go so far, and more often than not, I don't give a shit. You can have the most powerful graphics card in the world, creating photo-realistic images, but when all you have to offer is the grey, brown and more grey of a Call Of Duty or what-have-you, then what's the point? The beauty comes from the art style and the level design, and without a stunning set-piece or a striking style, graphics become irrelevant. This is the Nintendo thread, so I know I'm preaching to the converted for the most part, but there we are.

[zero]

Yeah, graphics haven't so much hit a wall - Forza looks gorgeous - but they are hitting a point of diminishing returns. And the wild success of smaller indie games should show that they don't mean everything. And, as you said Skummy, use the existing power to make games like they used to... Bastion is a great example of that.

I dunno, I think once the dust settles on the hype train of the new systems, I think people are gonna be underwhelmed. I'm not quite on board with the idea of consoles dying like so many analysts are, but I do think big changes are coming and the PS4 and XOne are just placeholders.