NBA 2017-2018 Season

[Your Mom]

You get an assist if you were obviously trying to shoot but it was an airball and a team mate catches it and scores?

[Benjamin]

14 minutes ago, Pooker said:

They're making enough money no matter where they play at to take care of their families. If they're not happy with where they are playing, then yes, I don't see the need for them to show loyalty. But if you're happy and making lots of money, I think expecting a little loyalty to the team that either drafted you or gave you a chance isn't too much to ask for.

That's like saying you owe a little loyalty to a company that gave you a chance at where you work, which is balls because companies (and teams) are always going to look out for themselves ahead of their employees (players). Therefore, players should always do the same. A team is just a company all by itself, it just has the added spectacle of sport attached to it. If they're wanting to leave the team, that probably means that in some way they're not happy.

[Your Mom]

Hate the result but was a great game. Any Pacers fans here? How the hell do you put up with Lance? Dude is frustrating me already

[Benjamin]

Not a Pacers fan, but probably the series I am concentrating on the most? I just remember that he is also constantly pissing LeBron off the entire time he's defending him, even if it's not successful, that up to a certain point LeBron apparently just looked at him and said, "What is wrong with you?" 

[JasonM]

3 hours ago, Benjamin said:

Players have no reason to show loyalty, it's an intangible thing that means shit in the long run. These players are people with families and lives of their own, having them show some unreasonable sense of loyalty for a team just because it's expected of them is ridiculous. 

You're absolutely right. Isaiah Thomas showed loyalty by playing through his litany of injuries and the death of hi sister to give Boston a chance in the playoffs last year.

They repaid their faith by trading him for Kyrie at the first opportunity they had.

It was a brilliant trade, especially in hindsight, but it also shows that everybody is replaceable in the eyes of management, and the moment a better deal shows up, you're gone.

Dwyane Wade gave his career to the Heat, took multiple paycuts under the vague promises of it being returned to him when the glory dried up. But when push came to shove, the Heat stiffed him and pushed him out to struggle at thr Bulls and Heat for two seasons...

Again good move sports wise because Wade can only bring it in the playoffs anymore. But it again shows that loyalty buys nothing.

At the same time though, Utah was ready to bank their franchise on Hayward and he walked out to go play for his old Butler coach. Again understandable cause they're close, but it was dissapointed to see.

It always goes both way, and where 20 years ago a player was loyal to money and where they're rooted down, players nowadays are loyal to sucess.

Still, the teams that truly pay back loyalty are extremely rare, and past successes aren't a guarantee to be trade exempt either.

The only two i can come up with that got their loyalty checks are Kobe and Dirk, both when their two teams reached the cliff after the glory.

Both two players that have always been untouchable stars, and bonafide legends.

[Red Devil-Taker316]

I wrote an article on the very topic of why players shouldn't be loyal.

http://www.rdtworldofsport.com/2017/07/28/its-not-the-players-to-blame/

On 4/21/2018 at 21:28, Pooker said:

They're a mess because of LeBron. He's almost too talented. If it was Jordan or Kobe on that team, I don't think they would struggle as much. But LeBron, who is probably a better team player then those two, tries too hard to get everybody involved. But, when they don't play up to his standard, and he's not capable of making players around him better, any team LeBron plays on will have issues.

That's why LeBron can only win a championship when he has other great players around him. It seems like nobody on the current Cavs knows their place and how to play with LeBron. Say what you want about Jordan and Kobe, but if you were playing with them, you knew your role on that team and they knew how to win with whoever was on their team. LeBron doesn't.

History has shown the exact opposite. M.J., great as he is (and he is the GOAT imo) did never get past Round 1 without Pippen (and got to greater heights, winning wise, when Phil Jackson installed the triangle and gave others a role, never mind Horace Grant and Dennis Rodman being on these teams as well). Ditto for Kobe Bryant, he couldn't get out of Round 1 without Shaq or in his prime Pau Gasol (and his championships have Shaq, Gasol, Andrew Bynum and Lamar Odom on those teams).

LeBron made the 2007 Finals with a team that would have won 30 games otherwise and actually had shots at stealing the 2015 NBA title after Kyrie went down. Nobody on the current Cavs know their place because half of them joined the team in February.and the other half a decent to good, but incomplete players.

Edited April 23, 2018 by Red Devil-Taker316

[Benjamin]

40 minutes ago, Red Devil-Taker316 said:

I wrote an article on the very topic of why players shouldn't be loyal.

http://www.rdtworldofsport.com/2017/07/28/its-not-the-players-to-blame/

History has shown the exact opposite. M.J., great as he is (and he is the GOAT imo) did never get past Round 1 without Pippen (and got to greater heights, winning wise, when Phil Jackson installed the triangle and gave others a role, never mind Horace Grant and Dennis Rodman being on these teams as well). Ditto for Kobe Bryant, he couldn't get out of Round 1 without Shaq or in his prime Pau Gasol (and his championships have Shaq, Gasol, Andrew Bynum and Lamar Odom on those teams).

LeBron made the 2007 Finals with a team that would have won 30 games otherwise and actually had shots at stealing the 2015 NBA title after Kyrie went down. Nobody on the current Cavs know their place because half of them joined the team in February.and the other half a decent to good, but incomplete players.

Plus J.R. Smith is on that team, quite possibly the most overrated player in the NBA at the moment (overrated in the sense that he's still playing in the NBA).

[JasonM]

27 minutes ago, Benjamin said:

Plus J.R. Smith is on that team, quite possibly the most overrated player in the NBA at the moment (overrated in the sense that he's still playing in the NBA).

You mispronounced Tristan Thompson

[Benjamin]

He holding Perkins down, yo

[Your Mom]

5 hours ago, Benjamin said:

Plus J.R. Smith is on that team, quite possibly the most overrated player in the NBA at the moment (overrated in the sense that he's still playing in the NBA).

If he keeps making weird 70 foot across his body jumpers he can stay in the NBA as long as he wants  

[Pooker]

8 hours ago, Red Devil-Taker316 said:

I wrote an article on the very topic of why players shouldn't be loyal.

http://www.rdtworldofsport.com/2017/07/28/its-not-the-players-to-blame/

History has shown the exact opposite. M.J., great as he is (and he is the GOAT imo) did never get past Round 1 without Pippen (and got to greater heights, winning wise, when Phil Jackson installed the triangle and gave others a role, never mind Horace Grant and Dennis Rodman being on these teams as well). Ditto for Kobe Bryant, he couldn't get out of Round 1 without Shaq or in his prime Pau Gasol (and his championships have Shaq, Gasol, Andrew Bynum and Lamar Odom on those teams).

LeBron made the 2007 Finals with a team that would have won 30 games otherwise and actually had shots at stealing the 2015 NBA title after Kyrie went down. Nobody on the current Cavs know their place because half of them joined the team in February.and the other half a decent to good, but incomplete players.

See, while I agree with that, I would a true that Jordan made Pippen better. Same with Kobe and Gasol. Can you say or name one player that is better because they play with LeBron?

On the loyalty thing, I think Giannis and Durant had quotes today that speak volume. The Greek Freek said it would be great to play for one city for 20 years and that's his goal. Durant responded by telling him he needs to play for himself.  Two totally different view points, and they both can work depending on the player and team.

[Benjamin]

3 hours ago, The Chiksrara Special said:

If he keeps making weird 70 foot across his body jumpers he can stay in the NBA as long as he wants  

Maybe he should have tried that in Game 3 at the end of the game, instead of the stupid drive he made only to put up a poor-percentage shot when he had better options before that.

[Your Mom]

1 hour ago, Benjamin said:

Maybe he should have tried that in Game 3 at the end of the game, instead of the stupid drive he made only to put up a poor-percentage shot when he had better options before that.

Oh I'm not saying he is good or anything it's just every so often he does something like that shot that entertains the hell out of me so he has earned his paycheck as far as I go  

[Pooker]

So is it safe to say that the big 3 of Westbrook, Memo, and George is a failure?

[VerbalPuke]

Were there big expectations for them? 

[Meacon Keaton]

On 9/24/2017 at 00:36, Meacon said:

I'm not even mad. I'm glad Melo is gone. We need a fresh start. He seriously did absolutely nothing for us, and we saw several times over the last few seasons that we actually played better with him off the court. So fuck it. He's gone. It's done. We can move on.

Color me not surprised. He made us worse by being on the court. Melo’s not the great player he’s perceived to be. 

[Red Devil-Taker316]

21 hours ago, Pooker said:

See, while I agree with that, I would a true that Jordan made Pippen better. Same with Kobe and Gasol. Can you say or name one player that is better because they play with LeBron?

On the loyalty thing, I think Giannis and Durant had quotes today that speak volume. The Greek Freek said it would be great to play for one city for 20 years and that's his goal. Durant responded by telling him he needs to play for himself.  Two totally different view points, and they both can work depending on the player and team.

I agree for Pippen, not for Gasol though. Gasol was already an All Star and best player on a 50 win team in the tough West. He was just in his prime when he went to LA. 

As for LeBron, yes. Mo Williams had his only All Star appearance for Cleveland with LeBron (advanced metrically his best season ever by a lot). Chris Bosh went from a defensive 0 to a very good defensive player playing with LeBron. 

On the loyalty piece, I see that as someone who was burned by a team against someone still in his rookie deal. I'm sure Durant would have felt the same way if OKC didn't get cheap with Harden. 

Edited April 24, 2018 by Red Devil-Taker316

[Pooker]

3 hours ago, Los Ingobernables De VP said:

Were there big expectations for them? 

At the start of the season, yes. The reigning MVP, plus Paul George and Carmelo Anothony. A lot of the so called experts were predicting them to be top 3/4 in the West. Which, they barely ended up being. Now they're on the verge of being eliminated in the first round and you can clearly see that the big 3 don't like playing with each other.

 

3 hours ago, Meacon said:

Color me not surprised. He made us worse by being on the court. Melo’s not the great player he’s perceived to be. 

I barely even notice when Melo is even playing. He gets his shots in, but I don't think he's been as big of a problem for them this year.

[JasonM]

On 24-9-2017 at 02:02, Jasonmufc said:

I mean, Knicks got robbed blind right there. But at the same time I don't think this will help the Thunder on paper. Neither Melo or George are natural 4's, and they'll get bullied by any capable big if they even get close to the paint (on either side of the court).

And whilst Enes Kanter (christ did he get done dirty, having tweeted his love for OKC 4 days ago!) isn't gonna score like Melo does, he did add more presence down low that could go outside (rather than an outside threat that can go inside).

It's a bold strategy, and it's an extremely intriguing one for sure. But having three offensive stars that need a ball in their hand is a risky proposition, one that might backfire as they start cutting into each other's game more often than not.

Of course, I could be completely wrong and they blitz into a top 4 spot in the West... But with the Rockets, Warriors, and even Spurs/Pels in there, it can get really tough.

If the Pels got into the playoffs, and they were to line up against the Thunder, they'll have a very bad day against BC-AD and a motivated Rondo doing what he does best.

I got proven wrong on the 4th seed part, but nobody expected the west to get this crazy this year in terms of seedings. 

But I feel I got right on the main reasons why the Thunder aren't cutting it as a playoff team, they're just not a team that works well together. They got three offensive superstars, there's no doubt about that, but beyond Steven Adams at center they have no player that brings a proper edge to the team. 

The only player shining right now is Paul George, who is insanely efficient and has taken the team on his back now that Melo can't bring up volume and Russ is horribly inefficient and taking so many shifts off purely to get a rebound or forcing assists. He's getting triple doubles, but none of it comes natural in the playoffs, he's just forcing the issue and getting a fluffy stat sheet that doesn't help the team actually win.

They're a three and a half man team, three stars and a hard working underappreciated center doing his best on defense. The rest of the team isn't playoff worthy, at all.

Then you look at Utah, they have no stars. But they have arguably the best defensive center in the NBA, one of the best playmakers in the league, a young upcoming player becoming a star. And a shitload of hard working players that show up every play, and can in their own respects have deadly nights if they're left open. They don't have star power, but they have a perfectly balanced team, which matters so much more in the playoffs because planning means so much more than just three stars balling out.

The Jazz have manage to stymie the Thunder's offensive touch, and the Thunder lack the defensive roundedness to do anything against five starters scoring in double digits. Even Rubio is scoring, which shows how dynamic the Utah offense is.

The 2018 Thunder aren't the 2011 Heat, they're more like the 2011 Knicks.

[livid]

Can I just say that I have really grown to dislike Russell Westbrook? Triple double chasing aside, three different times last night he instigated a fight with a Jazz player for seemingly no reason and then just let his teammates take the fall for it.